51 Plymouth Update

[fadingfastsd]

Hey guys,

Sorry it's been awhile since I've posted an update on here.

I think some of you were following my build on my 51 Plymouth.

I swapped in a "newly rebuilt" engine that I bought off craigslist about a month ago.

Well I got everything up and running strong, and put about 50 miles on the new engine with no problems.

Then last Saturday, I was cruising on the freeway to work, going about 55mph, and a knock developed. I was almost to my exit and got off the freeway. As I came to the exit and back down to idle, the knock got progressively louder and worse. It stopped with a clunk and the engine died. Smoke was pouring out of the hood and into the cab.

So I pushed her around the corner, and opened up the hood...didn't look good. Something blew up good and oil was EVERYWHERE.

I've had it towed over to my buddies at San Diego Rod & Custom (www.sandiegorodandcustom.com, I run their website ), and they're gonna take a look. I'm expecting pretty bad news, probably threw a rod.

So, do you guys want to help me with options on engine/trans swaps?

I'm thinking for cost-effectiveness probably a SBC swap with a floor shift manual. Any ideas, comments?

I'll keep you updated as this develops. I'm definitely hanging onto the car though, she's a keeper.

-Evan

[n1gzd_plymouth]

geeze. what a terrible disappointment. I am sorry to hear about your bad luck.

Rebecca

[BobT-47P15]

Oooohhhh.......does not sound so good. Sorry to hear it.

[fadingfastsd]

Thanks for the sympathy! it helps .

I'm pretty bummed, it was alot of work all for nothing.

Good for you guys though, i"ll be having alot of good parts for sale:

2x 2bbl Carter Webers, Offy dual carb intake, split Langdons headers,

lots more stuff.

What engine should I be looking into?

[BloodyKnuckles]

Man, I'm sorry about your luck. That sucks! I've been following your posts since the beginning and had looked forward to the result. I was happy to hear that you were running the flat 6. Things just didn't go your way.

As for engine choices I would consider a carburated 318 Dodge if you would like to keep it a bit more modern. If you are interested in a little more vintage I would consider a Poly motor. I think other than a small hemi these engines are awesome and very much overlooked.

Please reconsider the sbc. They are great engines but it's nice to see other just as reliable powerplants when you open the hood. Just my opinion.

Good luck and do a ton of research. Things will work out just great.

BloodyKnuckles

[greg g]

another interesting option for a cruiser might be the 3.9 liter MOPAR V6 from a dakota pickup. In fact a whole dakota drive line should be available for not much money. I know these aren't Traditional Hot Rod engines, but they are based on the 318 design, they put out quite a bit of power, are easy on gas, and dependable as a rock. plus youget a modern trans auto or 5 speed, and a decent highway rear end.

[cranbrook rookie]

dude , sorry to hear about your motor meltdown. i am interested in your manifolds etc . best of luck with the new drivetrain .keep the faith

[n1gzd_plymouth]

Thanks for the sympathy! it helps .

I'm pretty bummed, it was alot of work all for nothing.

Good for you guys though, i"ll be having alot of good parts for sale:

2x 2bbl Carter Webers, Offy dual carb intake, split Langdons headers,

lots more stuff.

Do you have a picture of this instalation (showing the stuff that might be for sale)? I am interested.

Rebecca

[Don Coatney]

Bummer! Did it throw a rod through the side of the block?

[james curl]

You don't have to throw the rod to have a very loud knock. When I put the front main bearing in upside down and the no.1 rod bearing spun, I pulled the coil wire and cranked the engine and thought I had broken the crank, the knock was that loud. Turned out the crank was only .0015 out of round after everything was said and done.

[Don Coatney]

You don't have to throw the rod to have a very loud knock. When I put the front main bearing in upside down and the no.1 rod bearing spun, I pulled the coil wire and cranked the engine and thought I had broken the crank, the knock was that loud. Turned out the crank was only .0015 out of round after everything was said and done.

James;

Did you also have oil all over everything under the hood?

[dezeldoc]

Don, I think when he spun his bearing it over pressurized the brake jar and knocked the johnson rod off letting the oil back into the block!

Fadingfast, Whatever you do don't put a small block Chevy in it, keep it all Mopar!! You would not put a 318 into a 57 Chevy would you?

[james curl]

No Don, I had 40 pounds of oil pressure when it all happened. I shut it off before the rod could brake the bolts on the big end where the bearing was fused into one peice on the crank throw.

[fadingfastsd]

Hey guys sorry I've been really busy and haven't been back on here in a couple days.

I haven't looked into exactly what happened yet. The car is at San Diego Rod & Custom right now, and they're checking it out for me to figure out what happened.

I was going probly 55 on the freeway, and had been driving for 20 min or so when the knock developed. Temp was fine, oil pressure was fine. Knock became louder at freeway speed, and i went about another mile and got off at the next exit. Right as it came back down to idle the knock got very very loud, right then was when something blew as smoke started pouring out of the hood from oil on the exhaust.

I had to head in to work, and my Dad got it towed over to the shop for me. I'm pretty burned out on it at the moment and havent made alot of effort yet.

I really don't know what direction to go. The reason for a SBC is the same as everybody elses: price, availability, and parts.

I'm open to other options but I just don't know what I'll end up doing.

I'll put up the parts for sale as soon as I have a plan. If you search for posts by my name you can find pics of the carb/intake/exhaust setup on here.

[fadingfastsd]

A quick question:

What Dodge engines are considered the small hemi's?

Where can I read more about these, I'd like to look into that option.

But where the hell can I find one?

[Don Coatney]

No Don, I had 40 pounds of oil pressure when it all happened. I shut it off before the rod could brake the bolts on the big end where the bearing was fused into one peice on the crank throw.

James;

In this case there was oil spewing under the hood. That is why I asked about a rod through the side of the block.

[Young Ed]

Dodge hemis are 241 270 and I think 312. I think there was one bigger CI one too. Started in 53 with the 241. 55 was a 270. You'd find one in a 53-57ish dodge.

[rearview]

Been watching this thread since it started...

Evan... sucks about the motor. Hopefully it is something simple, but I highly doubt it.

Now, this whole thing has got me thinking. Haven't we had a few people here in the last 2 years or so with fresh rebuilt motors go belly up? I'm wondering if the same thing is being missed when reassembling? Swapping even rods / odd rods and screwing up oiling? Improper rod bearing installation? Reusing critical fasteners, such as rod bolts or low grade fasteners??

I've got a hemi coming for my 52, but really am thinking about just freshening up the flatty instead and would hate to make someone else's mistake if avoidable.

Bob

[fadingfastsd]

Thanks Bob,

Sorry I keep missing out on the conversation here, the site has stopped sending me instant email notifications to replies even though its still set to do so. Anybody else having this problem?

Yep I'm still pretty bummed and have been taking a break.

The car is sitting over at my buddies shop at San Diego Rod & Custom.

We should tear into it pretty soon and start coming up with a plan, so I'll keep you guys posted as soon as I have more info.

Where would I find one of these small hemis? It would be pretty awesome to stuff one in there!

[Merle Coggins]

Sorry I keep missing out on the conversation here, the site has stopped sending me instant email notifications to replies even though its still set to do so. Anybody else having this problem?

I don't use that feature, but you may want to check for any spam filters from your email provider. I have the same problem with any messages generated from this forum, they get trapped by Yahoo's spam filter. However, I am able to view the content of the Spam filter before it gets deleted and I've rescued several emails from other members that way.

Merle

[Normspeed]

Here's a good site for info on the early hemis and how to rebuild them. Expect to pay a lot more to rebuild an early hemi than what it cost to do your flattie or a SBC.

http://www.hothemiheads.com/

On my flattie the only problem I had was a careless machine shop installing one oversized valve guide. Since that got fixed, I've run over 11,000 miles, a lot of it at freeway speeds, with no problems. Seems like the two areas that have caused early failure on rebuilds are incorrectly installed number one main bearings, and also failure of wrist pin bushings, maybe due to excessively over advanced ignition timing.

One thing I intend to look closely at when I do another flattie is the piston ring end gap. There was a good post here some time back about the problem of cracked piston rings on flathead 6 motors, and the very small end gap that the Mopar manuals suggest.

Why build a hemi? The photo says it all.

[Young Ed]

I had the 270 hemi I had checked out by a machine shop here. Was quoted just under 2K including $100 to sleeve the one cylinder that was bad. That was about 500 more then the flathead rebuild done by the same shop.

[Normspeed]

Ed, were you going stock or souped up? I think the add-ons (cam, trick pistons, headers, hi performance intake and carbs etc) would add a whole lot to the basic rebuild cost, and from what I've seen the SBC stuff in those areas is a lot more available and less pricey.

[Young Ed]

Good point that was a stock rebuild. I'm sure it needed an overbore but no fancy racing parts. I was on the lookout for the factory 4bbl intake though

[Normspeed]

I still have a 241 red ram on the stand, waiting for some TLC. I'd love to put it in a Dodge roadster. For a while I was watching ebay for intakes and it looked like the average hi-po vintage intake for one of these usually sold for more than the entire cost of my flathead rebuild. I still would like to do it up some day though.