1934 Plymouth PE Barnfind

[blazin6969]

Hi guys,

New to the site I don't know anything about flat heads at all. But picked up this barnfind 34 plymouth Pe. See that it has a flathead just wondering what type of number am I looking for on the motor to help identify it better?

 

Also, the guy took off the carb and filter. Just so reference these filters are the canister types right? Is there any crossover compatibility with new ones or should I try to find NOS? My carb is a Bal and Ball.

I guess im just looking and asking because I really want to get this running. It has all service record until 1961, then Im assuming it was parked. It even has a tag on the radiator hose from 61 I guess showing it was bought and replaced. And on the inner pillar driver side there are a few stickers of maintenance done. Oil looks good obviously going to change it before trying to turn her over. Plus wires and anything or any other info anyone can point me in the right direction. I would be very grateful.

[Reg Evans]

The engine number should be stamped on the block on the drivers side up front just below the head on a rectangular raised spot.

How bout some photos ?

[TodFitch]

The engine number should be stamped on the block on the drivers side up front just below the head on a rectangular raised spot.

How bout some photos ?

 

And the serial number will be on the front passenger door hinge post which can tell you exactly what the car is even if the engine has been swapped out.

 

I am a bit confused on your posting, it sound like the oil and air filters are being referred to interchangeably. Original air filter is a housing with wire mesh that you periodically clean with gasoline or kerosene and then re-oil with heavy (SAE 40  or higher) oil. Original oil filter is a throwaway canister mounted on the engine. You should get at least 10,000 miles between filter changes and those filters are getting hard to find and a little pricy.

[dpollo]

If the engine has the prefix PE, it is likely correct.  it will also have the cylinder castings visible on either side of the distributor.

this engine was made for only 2 years and is narrower than all the Plymouths that follow it so the head gasket is narrower too. ( so if it is not absolutely necessary, do not be too quick to lift the head until you get the right gasket)

The distributor may be a Remy more akin to GM than the Autolites that followed. Just so you know when you go to get points.

 

As for the oil filter, this is a bypass unit and the engine can be safely run without it. It is also possible to get a canister with a replaceable element. (try a tractor store if you are in a farm area.

 

Carter Ball and Ball is likely the correct carb and they are simple to overhaul.  The accelerator pump jet  high on the main body

often needs a wire run through it.

[fstfish66]

nice find

[blazin6969]

Sorry for coming back late guys just been working lately.

The serial on the Block Starts PE205

Gt rebuild kit for the carb, it looked good when taken apart.

Few things,

Got a new filter thought we would do a compression test on this thing. At first all cylinders were really low somewhere near 35. Added some wd 40 and kept working the motor for a bit and now almost all of them have responded well and we are close to 75psi. Only issue with number 4 thing cannot get above 45psi.

I guess after looking at the above post head gasket might be hard to get? Does anyone actually rebuild these

Also as far as the fuel pump is concerned is there a rebuild kit for these as well, this one was toast. Next will be working on the brakes to see where they are at. Looking for any info or pointers I can get never worked with one of these ever.

 

Putting up some pictures as well so you guys can take a look see.

 

 

 

[blazin6969]

In my Garage

 

 

Motor

 

 

 

[TodFitch]

Head gaskets are still available but will have to be ordered. Best Gasket makes them (as well as probably some other companies) but I think you need to find a retailer who carries Best Gaskets to order it for you.

 

Fuel pump rebuilding kits are available from Then and Now Automotive (a.k.a. Antique Auto Parts Cellar) and they are easy to rebuild.

 

You may be interested in my vanity site at http://www.ply33.com/ and more specifically in the parts cross reference section at http://www.ply33.com/Parts/numeric

[blazin6969]

Thanks @Todfitch I use your site often. I didn't know if there were other or how updated some of the vendors on the list were.

[Andydodge]

Blazin........that's a nice old car you got there.......I'm a hotrodder and normally not much into "patina" and the current trend towards that finish but your car looks like just a good general cleanup and I could certainly live with it............whats the interior like?............regards, Andy Douglas 

[TodFitch]

Thanks @Todfitch I use your site often. I didn't know if there were other or how updated some of the vendors on the list were.

 

I update the vendors list when I find problems or if problems are reported to me. If you have any issue with the vendors I list, let me know so I can make note of it and (probably) remove the vendor from the list. Likewise if you find a vendor not on my list, please let me know so I can add it.

 

I can't tell you exactly how often I update that list as it is part of an overall database. The most recent database update time is listed on each parts page but it does not tell you why I updated the database. Might be a vendor update, cross reference update or usage update, etc.

[T120]

Nice car,good photos, noticed your battery jumper cables - originally it would have been wired for positive ground.

[blazin6969]

Blazin........that's a nice old car you got there.......I'm a hotrodder and normally not much into "patina" and the current trend towards that finish but your car looks like just a good general cleanup and I could certainly live with it............whats the interior like?............regards, Andy Douglas 

 

Yea the interior was ehh, but was complete looks like at some point obviously before the 60's that someone just put a sheet over the seats and pinned it down. The front seat wasn't sliding back and forth so I took the seats out to get the track working better and greased up. (Also got rid of all the rat crap literally). Additionally I was working on getting all the windows to roll down nicely without much resistance, I am guessing since it was sitting so long everything needs a good lube job. I think the main job now will be to get the fuel pump rebuilt or replaced. The issue with the rebuilding is I do not think the kit has the rubber boot here or diaphragm and the screen.

 

Next will be getting her fully running if we can, then brakes.

 

Side note this car is actually gunmetal gray. Some chuckle head back in the day painted it with a brush lol it either blue or black now. But on the inside of the door jams and stuff you can see the true color which is really nice I must say.

 

Edited April 25, 2016 by blazin6969

[TodFitch]

 

. . . I think the main job now will be to get the fuel pump rebuilt or replaced. The issue with the rebuilding is I do not think the kit has the rubber boot here or diaphragm and the screen.

 

Kits from Antique Auto Parts Cellar have the diaphragm and screens. Also pivot pins, gaskets, etc. Your housing, link pieces, air domes and glass sediment bowl are re-used but, if I recall correctly, the kit has everything else. Give them that 4360 number that is on the flange so they can be sure to get you the correct stuff.

 

I was able to pick up a new sediment bowl a year or two ago at my local CarQuest. There are a couple of different standard sizes so you'll have to measure to ask for the correct one. And in my case it had to be ordered from the warehouse which too a day.

[Niel Hoback]

Several different sizes of sediment bowls are available at Farm and Fleet. Possibly TSC, also.

[blazin6969]

Oops it's not pictured but I actually have the bowl. Just gave Antique Auto Parts Cellar a buzz he said he would get back to me he has to check. Man never had experience with a car this old or complete it truly is an awesome experience. Now another question would be is there any recommendation of builders of these flatheads if my motor needs redone? I know some would say throw a 230 in it and enjoy the power,but I think with this I'm going to try and stay all original to the car.

[wayfarer]

The L6 is pretty straight forward in terms of rebuilding. If you have concerns about your local shop being focused too much on 'new stuff' then look around for someone who deals more with industrial or agricultural equipment as the Mopar L6 were used in both for decades. 

[TodFitch]

. . . I know some would say throw a 230 in it and enjoy the power,but I think with this I'm going to try and stay all original to the car.

 

Fitting a '35 or up engine in a '33 or '34 has some issues, especially with respect to the location of the starter: The '33/'34 block is narrower (does not have the full length water jacket nor water distribution tube), when they changed to a wider block the moved the starter a bit to clear the wider block.

 

I've seen some where they ground the side off the starter motor and others where they machined the bell housing to move the starter location. You might be able to put a '35 bell housing on. . . not real sure about that.

[blazin6969]

I guess I will cross that bridge when I get to it. Possibly look at some local shops see what they would charge to build it, if it needs it. Thanks for all the information guys this is a wealth of knowledge and people that know things about these cars. Now Tod this will be a weird question but, did these have red vinyl door panels only on the passenger and driverside front 2 doors? Seems a bit out of place in my opinion because the rear doors have this soft material thats a tan color on the door panel. Just a random thing I thought of.

[TodFitch]

I guess I will cross that bridge when I get to it. Possibly look at some local shops see what they would charge to build it, if it needs it. Thanks for all the information guys this is a wealth of knowledge and people that know things about these cars. Now Tod this will be a weird question but, did these have red vinyl door panels only on the passenger and driverside front 2 doors? Seems a bit out of place in my opinion because the rear doors have this soft material thats a tan color on the door panel. Just a random thing I thought of.

 

I am not as knowledgeable about '34 as I am on '33, but that red vinyl is almost certainly incorrect. Typically the door panels were similar material to the seats and would be, in order of ascending original price and thus descending numbers shipped, mohair, broadcloth or leather.

 

It seems that many/most of the upholstery cloth colors back then all fade to the same generic tan. If you can find a bit that has been protected against light and air you may find that tan was actually something else like taupe.

[blazin6969]

Hmm that is interesting. I will have to see if I can see what the original color might have been. The guys over at then and now auto found me a fuel pump rebuild kit, I guess they said this is a newer fuel pump from the 50's and assuming it obviously must have gotten replaced.

I also just picked up a NOS headgasket 602539 ( with asbestos and all lol). I also noticed on bestgasket they do not offer the 514C anymore as well. However, this guy here has a few left maybe from best gasket.

http://www.olsonsgaskets.com/products/

. Also this guy seems to have some if you search the part number 602539

http://www.mmpar.com/MMPARimages/CD0/images1/mvc-602539s.jpg

Anyone ever buy the gasket overhaul kit or the actual master rebuild kit, just wondering the size and fitment because the Plymouth motor was a bit more narrower. Going to be digging back in this weekend and just wanted to get my ducks in a row especially if I have to take the head off. I guess this should be fun.