New here. Seized '53 Dodge flathead 6 motor

[blue71c]

Racine. 

I think I'll go through the bell housing. I don't have an over head crane. . . Yet! Lol

[Plymouthy Adams]

I'll sell you an overhead crane.....lol.....cost to ship would kill ya though......punching the dowels and lifting the bell is the better way to access.....been there and done that...is really easy.

[Dartgame]

Be sure to save all the hardware bag and tag it. If it took you 2 years before deciding to rip it down - it may be a long time before it goes back together. (No offiense intended).

Not sure it sounds like you've not torn a motor down ?

Start by taking the pistons out on the cylinders that look to be the least rusty. You may be limited by the crank and rod position as to which can come out. Take your time dont  use force on anything that seems excessive, you can use wood blocks to drive the pistons out of the block with a hammer. Save all the parts. As you remove the pistons continue to attempt rotation of the crank, you might get lucky and get her to break free. Save the cam - there are no new ones out there, all are reground to my knowledge.

[Lloyd]

I'm kinda with DodgeB4ya although I would try and tear it down first just to see how much it would be to get it back. Bear in mind that flathead engines, especially the 218 can be had for free if you look hard enough. 230's are a little harder to find. I had a 201 in my 39 P8, wanted to put a 230 in it but could not find one without paying. Then a guy in Ohio offered to give me a 218 for the cost of shipping. Went thru Fastenel shipping which was only about $150 and had me a decent engine. Stroked it with a $50 230 crank off eBay and rebuilt it. Of course the total rebuild ran me a considerable amount but little by little I got it done.

[johnsartain]

The engine I decided to use was partially torn down and lying in the bed of the truck fully exposed to the weather. It had been in the bed an untold number of years. As you might assume it was fully stuck. I had to use a 20 ton press, courtesy of Harbor Freight, in order to press the pistons out.I bew the seals in the first 20 ton jack and returned it for another to finish the job. I heard the pistons popping and creaking all the way out of the bore even when thoroughly lubed. If you're a mechanical sort, just go ahead and get you a press. If you're like me you already had wished a thousand times you had one. Now you have a good excuse.

 

[JerseyHarold]

My idea (just a theory, really)  for unseizing an engine is to connect a coolant heater into a radiator hose and let it warm the coolant for a few days.  The expansion and then contraction of the block may free things up.  Again, just a theory.....

[Dodgeb4ya]

How about brazing up a spark plug base to accept a grease zerk fitting.

A big grease gun and pump away

Better yet... hook up a Hydraulic pump or power steering pump to the problem cylinder/cylinders and using a control valve turn each piston into a hydraulic ram... that'l get er turning over.

Probably would need 2000lbs or more pressure on a tough one though!

[Frank Elder]

Head to your local feed store after googling molasses to remove rust.

[blue71c]

 I don't think my problem is in the cylinders. When I pulled off the head the base of the cylinder right where the Pistons that was clean and fresh metal so I must have got it to move just a little bit. I think I might have a spun bearing or a seized bearing on either the crank or the cam. I'm to the point where I am only going to have to take it apart. Thanks everyone for the input.

[Dodgeb4ya]

The cam is no good if it's rusty.

Pull the main and rod caps to check the bearings. If rusty the party is over.

[blue71c]

29 minutes ago, Dodgeb4ya said:

The cam is no good if it's rusty.

Pull the main and rod caps to check the bearings. If rusty the party is over.

Just another reason to put in an isky cam.

[Mike36]

9 hours ago, blue71c said:

Just another reason to put in an isky cam.

Most of the people I've known that put after market cams in an engine tend to be heavy on the throttle, and wind 'em up to feel the extra power and acceleration. These flatheads are torque engines and do not like high RPM's. If you put an Isky, or any cam other than stock in, keep the grind mild and don't continually wind it up. The hotter you make an engine, the shorter its life. These flatheads are best enjoyed for what they are. I love the way I can slow to 10 mph in high gear, ease into the throttle, and it just starts pulling. No bucking and jumping, it just goes. An important feature when they were made and the roads were poor. 

[49D-24BusCpe]

    I agree very much with 'Mike36! I drive them like a high-speed diesel - use their low end torque to accelerate and don't go over 4000 rpm.

   If they're properly geared, they can stay up with modern traffic, AND PUNISH other vehicles of their own era!

Walt

[Pauls_Plymouth]

Mike36 is right. I used a new stock cam when my 218 was overhauled, but i smoothed out the valve chambers & head for a better flow. I added Offenhauser dual 1 bbl manifold. It runs great, reves smoothly once the engine is broke in. No need for a race cam. 

[55 Fargo]

11 minutes ago, Pauls_Plymouth said:

Mike36 is right. I used a new stock cam when my 218 was overhauled, but i smoothed out the valve chambers & head for a better flow. I added Offenhauser dual 1 bbl manifold. It runs great, reves smoothly once the engine is broke in. No need for a race cam. 

A higher lift cam and longer duration can make a huge difference in performance. 

This with  a dual carb and exhaust setup and by raising compression can do wonders.

The engine can handle a more than 4000 RPM.

You need the right cam profile to deliver that though.

 

Edited September 29, 2017 by 55 Fargo Spitfire

[55 Fargo]

6 hours ago, Mike36 said:

Most of the people I've known that put after market cams in an engine tend to be heavy on the throttle, and wind 'em up to feel the extra power and acceleration. These flatheads are torque engines and do not like high RPM's. If you put an Isky, or any cam other than stock in, keep the grind mild and don't continually wind it up. The hotter you make an engine, the shorter its life. These flatheads are best enjoyed for what they are. I love the way I can slow to 10 mph in high gear, ease into the throttle, and it just starts pulling. No bucking and jumping, it just goes. An important feature when they were made and the roads were poor. 

Tell this to George Asche. His 265 powered 29 Desoto roadster has over 200k and it's pedal to the metal.

[Mike36]

1 minute ago, 55 Fargo Spitfire said:

Tell this to George Asche. His 265 powered 29 Desoto roadster has over 200k and it's pedal to the metal.

 Don't have to. It's not a 23 inch  motor with offset rods.

[55 Fargo]

32 minutes ago, Mike36 said:

 Don't have to. It's not a 23 inch  motor with offset rods.

His 52 Plymouth has a 230 and same deal. Well over 100k driven like she was stolen. Both engines are not stock.

If you know George you will know what I mean...lol

These are not Chevy stovebolt babbit pounding 6s that cant handle a little throttle.....lol

[55 Fargo]

George confirmed  revs up to 5500 RPM in  the 230 with offset rods is not a problem.

Obviously you need the cam to do this.

But these engines can handle a lot more than we think.

His 52 plymouth is not babied and goes like Jack the bear.

[blue71c]

My plan is to eventually build the motor up a little more to get more performance out of it with dual carbs and dual exhaust and a performance cam. But for right now, I just want to get it apart and freshened up so I can at least start driving it.

[55 Fargo]

7 minutes ago, blue71c said:

My plan is to eventually build the motor up a little more to get more performance out of it with dual carbs and dual exhaust and a performance cam. But for right now, I just want to get it apart and freshened up so I can at least start driving it.

Nice plan, and yes they do respond well to modifications. Contact Tim or George at AoK Racing Fertigs Pa, they built engines, manufacture intakes and exhaust and do cam grinds of amny profiles for your needs and wants..

Have a look at some performance, 1 is a 265 race engine the other is a 230 race engine, built by George Asche and Tim Kingsbury...

 

 

 

[blue71c]

One of my concerns with this motor was if it's worth hot rodding it. I don't want to dump a ton of money into it just to have it grenade on me for getting on the throttle but I've seen plenty of these engines built as "race motors". I'm still concerned about the smile per mile costs, lol. Keeping the original motor in this car is still cool regardless of how much horsepower it has. 

Edited October 1, 2017 by blue71c

[blue71c]

Does anyone have or know of any videos of these motors being rebuilt? All I see on YouTube are flathead fords.

[Pauls_Plymouth]

blue71c,    I have a few internal pics of my 218 after full overhaul, I will load them on here if they aren't too big. I ported the head and valve chambers so they are smoother. It runs like a champ with the two carb set up. The  exhaust is a straight through stainless muffler from Summit racing.It is single with a larger opening than stock. It breathes good no problem. The vacuum gage shows no  exhaust restriction reving up the . motor. It needs a few more minutes to warm up when cold as the fuel mixture doesn't have all the casting nubs (ground away with porting) to diffuse the gas/air mixture when cold. But it smooths out very nicely before full operating temperature is reached. 

[Mike36]

3 hours ago, blue71c said:

Does anyone have or know of any videos of these motors being rebuilt? All I see on YouTube are flathead fords.

Pm sent.