Rad Boiled Out Today

[55 Fargo]

Hi all, took my Rad from my 47 Chrysler to an old time rad shop, complete with hot tanks etc, could tell as all the equipment looked old, the place has been in business 75 years.

It was boiled out successfully, does not leak, and flows well. Will install it inot the car later today and report the results.

As this is a honeycomb style rad, it cannot be rodded out, so if this doesn't work, the rad will need to be recored.

Have many of you guys had success with having your rads boiled out, hoping this does the trick........Fred:)

[Young Ed]

I can't say for sure that mine had an issue before I started but I had both my truck and car radiator boiled out before installing my rebuilt engines. I didn't want old junk getting into my clean engine. They both have the original core and seem to do fine in the heat. Occasionally they will climb a little in heavy traffic but I've never seen water boiling out.

[Dennis Hemingway]

I had mine boiled out at the same time I put a new water dist tube in. My 48 P15 stays between 170-190 with the outside temp at over 100. When we left the car show last Saturday the temp was 108, the water temp in the 48 stayed at 180.

Dennis

[55 Fargo]

Re-installed rad, love this design takes about 10 minutes to get it back together filled and running, well maybe 15.

I did not fill to level in rad, at first just above fins, started car, no leaks, lots of bubbles at first in rad, filled to proper level, no bubbles after this, so it was probably just coolant hitting the inside top of rad. Let the engine run a bit, no leaks and no boiling over. Went for a 3 mile ride, she was around 180 on the gauge on my return, and 168 in the rad, let her idle a while, no change in temps. the outside air temp today is around 75 degrees.

Wil go on a longer run tomorrow, if this does not solve my heat problem not sure what will. The rad shop said the rad had good flow after it was boiled.

One other thing, I hear what sound like a shot of steam coming from the top of the engine after Ishut it off when she is warmed up, any of you guys experience this, wonder if the headgasket is leaking, will change it if necessary............Fred

[Lou Earle]

If it were me I would put a 50/50 mixture of antifreeze and water in her. Fill up a couple of gallon jugs stick them in the trunk and run that sucker for about 30 miles. I believe you had poor circulation and all should be well now. You will know it it boils and that is why u will have the jugs in the trunk!! But I am betting it will be just fine.What thermostat are u running

I was running a 180 (pulled engine) on my 48 taxi and the Gage would show 190( aftermarket Gage BUT the cooking them thermometer I had in the radiator would about 175 to 185- And that is at 60 mph in 90 degree south Ga heat. I think your Gage is 10 + degrees off and your cooling is fine

Lou

[55 Fargo]

Hi Lou, I have no t/stat in there right now, I have run a 160 a 180 and none before, I always get the same results, a hot running engine. I like the idea of a longer run, may do that tomorrow, it's supposed to be about 82 outside. Now not that I want to lead with the chin, but say I do boil over, where do I look next. I also have a 50/50 mix in the rad right now, used clean rain water to cut the antifreeze. I will also return to a t/stat, probably a 180, do you think by running without a t/stat it could now make the engine run hotter, especially at higher speeds. Not sure I want to go for my first long cruise at 60 mph, the diff is a 4.11, the trans and diff have new lube, but I am not sure how good a shape there in, so far no problems. Iam also running with a portable fuel tank right now, as I have yet to find a decent tank for my car, will probably have to buy a new one.But the car has good brakes, decent tires, new exhaust, should be okay to go for a 1/2 hour run down around here on a quiet road..........Fre

[Normspeed]

Fred, I would go with the 160 thermostat for now. Hope this cures it. Test drive it the way you would normally drive, don't pamper it.

Might just be time for a nice rebuild with a hot tank job. You can probably find a good rebuildable core motor for a reasonable price, build it in your spare time, then swap it when you're done. Then rebuild motor #2 using all the knowledge gained from #1.

[55 Fargo]

I have 3 of these engines, a rebuild, with the money and time are just not in the cards right now, this engine has good compression and oil pressure, and runs well. If I can't resolve the cooling isssue, the whole dang project will go on the shelf

[Lou Earle]

I do not believe the engine is the issue. These rascals simply do not overheat- except if we pump them up with higher compression etc. Even then not a lot as u can tell from blueskies, coatney and finch's posts.

Look I took a piece of plywood and blocked off at least 75 percent of the radiator on my Plymouth-48 and ran it a 55(3.90 r ear) and it just went barely over 190 on a cool(70 degree) day running a 10 mile course.

So I believe now - It can change- that your problem is in the flow- the symptom is the overheating.

By the way had a blown head gasket with 48 dodge- never overheated until water ran low then did- added more water drove another 30 miles and pulled the head put on mew gasket and the rest is history.

I would now put in a 180 thermostat ( now drill about a 3/16 ths hole in the side of it to let some water move at all time- just my preference from model A days- Someone invented one for them and I improved it a bit by adding the hole .

I say use the 180 because you will be using that as a minimum in the winter right? besides I think it is better on engine to run it a t 180 rather than 160.

They ran on 180 then why not now-- especially in the chilly north!!

Also what temp gage are u using? original? if so I would not mess it it- unless it comes out easily from the block.

If it does put a new one in -that you have tested on the stove in boiling water against a thermometer in the pot with it. Hook it up and run the car.

And see what develops.

Did you test the radiator fro flow after the boiling?

I would pull the bottom hose at the radiator stuff a rag in there and see what geyser occurs when u remove the rag. Your radiator man said - it made it better but how much?

I believe the give away to the problem is the inability to back flush the radiator- a good radiator should gush out either way.

I just happen to have my radiator and front clips off my 48 taxi--So I went and tested it.

1- when back fl using from the top of the lower radiator hose- it attached to the radiator a full flow of hose water results in the water flowing out the top neck -return- of the radiator BUT not getting high enough to flow out the fill hole . Removing the lower hose and stuffing a rag in it and the upper neck - outlet and filling with water to the top of the filler tube then pulling the bottom rag out- my water gushes out to about 3-4 inches high and takes 10 seconds to stop flowing. Now this is the radiator that runs in my taxi and has never overheated even on 100 degree days- so there is a benchmark for all - i just finished the test.So check your flow, put in a accurate temp gage ,if you can ,and not ruin other one, drill 3/16 hole in 180 degree thermostat lip hole install it and see what happens.

No one has asked but the thought occurred to me - Is your car an 8 cylinder or 6? If 8 that might be problem - I would think an 8 cyl would need bigger cooling capacity

Lou

[BobT-47P15]

I thought I read somewhere that the 160 thermostat was for summer and the 180 degree one for winter and/or colder climates.

Repair manual says overheating might be due to several things including incorrect ignition or valve timing and dragging brakes. It says a thermostat is seldom responsible for overheating......if damaged, it stays in the open position.

The manual said some cars have a "choke" type thermostat, while others would have the "bypass" type. On the bypass type, there are 4 openings that need to be properly positioned. Your repair manual may talk about this....as mine did.

[55 Fargo]

Hi Lou, wil atttempt to answer all the above, I really don't plan on a rebuild orengine swap at this time, even though I could get a decent 265 about 5 miles from home. The engine is a 218 6cyl, it is from a 1951 Canadian Dodge, it is a long block, all Canuck 6 cyl flathead engines are the same block, the bores and strokes were diffferent to handle the engine sizes, ie 218,230,251 and 265. This engine is a 218 D40 engine, it is coupled with a dry clutch 3spd trans and 411 rearend, the entire drive trainwas from the1951 dodge and my uncle and I transplanted it into the 47 Chrysler years ago. The Chrsyler had no drivetrain in it, if I had known better, I would have put a fluid drive, clunkomatic in it, but to be honest i like the dry clutch and 3 spd trans for now, not crazy about 411 gears, but I have a 354 here at home I could transplant. This engine has the built in by pass for the water pump,it originally came with a pressurized rad, it had a 4lb cap.

I have run both 160 and 180 thermostats, to be honest the engine once warmed up and getting hot, will continue to go above these ranges anyway, my car will never be winter driven as the roads are full of salt, slush and snow, just an invatation for rust and a car accident.

The gauge is a cheap after market type form Wallyworld, it is out a bit, the reading I get is 180 on the aftermarket gauge and about 168 in the top of the rad with a meat thermometer, as it gets closer to 200 they both seem to be more evn, ie 205 gauge 195 in rad.

The brakes are not dragging, so I have eliminated this.

Did not flow test, but before it went to the rad shop, the flow was marginal, the guys in the shop, stated it was decent flow, or I am sure they may have tried to sell me a recore job.Telephoned rad shop 5 minutes ago, they confirmed it was flowing very well, only other option would be a recore, but he said it flows well right now.

When you mention reverse flush of the rad, do you have to turn the rad up side down, I could not get it to flow up and out, with the rad right side up. Also it was taking at least 30 seconds to drain out the water, it was flowing, but did take a bit flow, this was all before the rad was boiled out.

As there is currently no t/stat, will put back in either the 160 or 180, and plan to drill a hole in it, mine is the modern type, fits right on the head, regular t/stat housing, because the water pump is an internal by-pass type and so is the engine, because it is a 1951 and later type.

The water tube was pulled, the 3 freeze plugs on the side, it was then pressure washed, and the freeze plug holes were rodded out, when you drain the petcock on block, it pours right out of there very quickly.

I am not sure where else to look, other than a head gasket, the tiing seems fine, it starts and runs great..........thanx Fred ps one other thing, when I filled the systemback up again, i did not fill the rad quite to level at first, after the engine was started, you could see the coolant moving in there like crazy, when you revved her up, so the anti-freeze is moving.

[55 Fargo]

Just started car , did not go for ride yet. Looking in the top of rad, when the engine is revved you can see the coolant flow like crazy now, but when I revv the engine up, I see big bubbles on coolant surface in rad, now is this just the force of liquid, as there is no t/stat in there yet, or is the headgasket faling somewhere. the last compression test, indicated cyl3 5 was only 96, while the others were 100 to 110 psi. Any ideas on this one guys.Thanx and have a great day

[TodFitch]

If you had just recently filled it and not run it much, it could just be air being purged from the system. Take if or a 10 or so mile test drive and see what bubbles you have then. Also check if there is any water in the oil.

The flow through your block and thus your cooling, especially at the back of the block, will not be "per factory specification" unless you put a thermostat in. If the thermostat opens per specification then it is not the cause of over heating. I don't understand why the first reaction of people is to rip it out when they have cooling problems. . .

[55 Fargo]

Just went on 6 mile road test,( all the time I have right now). Outside temp is 82, with humides it's 90, breezy for the south, severe thunderstorms expected today.

Car ran at 200 on gauge once warmed up, tis is 188 in rad with thermometer.if I drove with the wind it was this temp, against the wind it would cool back 5 degrees.

Another thing, after a run, the idle was higher when the engine was running good and warm, what cause this, as once she cooled a bit, the idle would retturn to normal.

When I re-installed the t/stat today, the antifreeze looked nice in clean in the head.

The underhood heat is quite hot, the heat riser is frozen closed, if it is closed in the cold position, would this not contribute to higher heat under the hood. Was thinking of getting a 6 blade fan, would this help. After the run, I let the car idle a bit, giving it gas once in a while the temp in the rad was reading right around 185. If this is as high as it would go, on warm days I would be a happyman..........Fred

[eric wissing]

"When I re-installed the t/stat today, the antifreeze looked nice in clean in the head.

The underhood heat is quite hot, the heat riser is frozen closed, if it is closed in the cold position, would this not contribute to higher heat under the hood."

I had that problem with my car. I blocked off the heat by pass because after a few miles the gas would boil out of my carb. This might add some more heat to your engine too. ( A guess on my part) Eric

[Lou Earle]

"Was thinking of getting a 6 blade fan, would this help. After the run, I let the car idle a bit, giving it gas once in a while the temp in the rad was reading right around 185. If this is as high as it would go, on warm days I would be a happyman..........Fred"

Teh fan will only help at speeds under 35 mph. A fan especially on older cars is for under 35 only- above that the wind handles the cooling on the radiator.

[55 Fargo]

Lat post on this issue, I have tried everything but a head gasket, went for a 5 mile run just now, its 84 outside. At the end of the run the engine is approaching 200 degrees, its hot and then it starts to run a little lousy too, I give up on this beast, maybe this one can't be corrected. Thanx everyone who has tried to help, not sure where this will end up. If I cannot drive the car on warm/hot days why bother, and heck I was only doing 45 to 50 mph, and it's acting like I amclimbing a hill with a 3000 lb trailer

[JerseyHarold]

Two quick items:

Have you checked the timing chain for correct tooth position and excessive slop? Bad timing can contribute to overheating.

What if you refill with water and (gasp!) stop leak and see what happens.

Just my 2 cents...a day late and a dollar short.

Harold

[55 Fargo]

Just got back from a 10 mile ride with my son, today is 82 and very muggy and overcast,tornadoes ripped through this area last night destroying homes and businesses, thank god no one was killed, this was about 30 miles from here. The engine was at 182 on the gauge and 172 in rad after 10 miles. The only thing different about this ride is I was only going 30 to 35 mph, and finished the last couple of miles at 40 mph. I also added about 2 litres of distilled water to the rad to bring it up a little higher than what it was yesterday. I do know the heatriser is in the cold position, tried to turn it with vise grips, maybe I did close it a little, but I doubt it. So at slower speed, meaning lower rpm in engine it ran as it should temp wise. Wonder why the higher speed is causing so much extra heat. This operating temp is good, now what do I need to do to keep it that way at 50 to 55 mph, changing the rear gears will help, from 411 to 354. On a real hot day, would not the heat riser if in the cold position cause excess manifold heat, keeping the valves and that area hotter, would it not effect the gas in the carb bowl, thus running rough, or sluggish when hot...........Fred

[55 Fargo]

Hotter and more huid today, went for a 10 mile ride, was going a little faster, it seemed to keep and evn temp of about 180 for a majority of the journey, but I was only going 40 to 45 mph, as it is a gravel road and it rained hard last night so its choppy topday. I can live with this temp, in cooler weather it will be fine..........Thanx all who listened to my blather onthis topic Fred

[greg g]

Did you try straight water or a lighter antifreeze blend?????

[55 Fargo]

Yes i did Greg, its like 6o% water and 40 % antifreeze

[greg g]

One more thing to try....We all know the heater element is another heat exchanger for the engines coolant. Open the valve to the heater, turn the fan on high, If you can sand the heat drive it this way and see if it makes any difference in your indicated running temp. If you can't stand the heat, let it idle that way for a while with the windows open and see what the temp gauge does. It should provide additional cooling perhaps as much as 30% more which should be worth 10 degrees or so. If this increased circulation of coolant through another radiator makes a difference, I might be inclined to think you may have a weak water pump. I have seen rebuilts with the impellor on backwards. Works but not like it is supposed to. who kows what quality controll those shops in India, Mexico, and or China have.