1953 Fargo Panel Van project

[Geekay]

[Geekay]

Geoff, for supply of a WDT try Les Sonter Baulkham Hills 02 9686 1348. Apparently he's the gun for supplying these. Word is he's very good to deal with. I haven't tried him for anything but the Historic Commercial Vehicle Club Forum has multiple good reports on him. Regards, Martyn

Thanks Martyn.

[FargoMarty]

Sorry, Garry, not Geoff. 

[Jeff Balazs]

We might be able to call it a tie.......as soon as you show us all the bits that are still down inside the water jackets.

Oh yes.....that one was never coming out in one piece was it?

 

Jeff

[Geekay]

We might be able to call it a tie.......as soon as you show us all the bits that are still down inside the water jackets.

Oh yes.....that one was never coming out in one piece was it?

 

Jeff

I had a really good go at trying to find any remant bits yesterday. Used a magnet in the lower welch plug holes and retrieved lots of sand like bits of steel/iron.  Not sure if from the WDT or from the block casting. Also one bit like a piece of string about 5 inches long, definitely from the WDT.

 

Given it a hard blast with water and then with compressed air.

 

 

Thanks all for "persuading" me to make an effort and remove the WDT.

[Jeff Balazs]

Oh Geekay you are very ..... very welcome.   You will thank me again when it doesn't overheat.

 

Jeff

[Geekay]

The new WDT from Les Sonter is in..see in photo.

Spent a lot of time flushing out and blowing out the water channels. Also used a magnet to collect any smaal metal fragments from the vacant welch plug holes.

Then installed new brass welch plugs.

Had removed and cleaned out the oil filter assembly and lines, the sump and oil pick up. All these re-installed. New gaskets from Jim Robinson on the sump.

Had the water pump housing "fixed" as the lug for the bottom bolt had snapped off. My brother-law-law welded it with his MIG. Will be extra careful tightening this. He suggested using a copper washer to absorb pressure of the bolt.

Made new gaskets for the water pump and will re-install this tomorrow. The put back the fan and radiator.

Cleaned a heap of baked on oil/grease/dust from various parts of the motor and polished it with a wire brush.

Tomorrow will be filling her up with new engine oil, coolant, and.....hitiing the starter button again.

Hope it still goes after all my attention.

 

 

 

 

[Desotodav]

Well done on all that work GK. Hope it fires up easy for you tomorrow.

[Merle Coggins]

Looking good. Don't forget to put some thread sealant on the water pump bolts. If you don't you may have a coolant leak.

 

Merle

[Geekay]

Looking good. Don't forget to put some thread sealant on the water pump bolts. If you don't you may have a coolant leak.

 

Merle

Excellent advice.  Thanks.

[Geekay]

Fargo's are Go!!

 

The Fargo motor oil system (sump, lines, filetr) and cooling bits (radiator, water pump, WDT etc) are all back on and the Fargo is running beautifully.

Although only able to run it for a few minutes as have an oil leak in a braided line brass fitting. I must have damaged it as was not leaking before.

The motor is now a lot cleaner and painted a few bits.

Still waiting on the new complete braking (pads, pistons, lines, master cylinder) system to be built before it goes anywhere though.

Meanwhile, next job is to put back the steering arms etc after cleaning these up up regreasing.

Then replace oil in the gearbox, which seems to operate as expected when wheels are jacked up.

Clean and grease all the nipples and joins I can find.

Then wait for brake stuff to install that.

Finally then I will be able to see if I can move it under its own power up and down the driveway.

 

Couple of photos of motor below, before and after.

 

[FargoMarty]

Well done mate! Must have been very satisfying to get some noise! Looking forward to hearing that it powered itself along the driveway.

I'm almost at the same stage with my big one. Just sorting out fuel pump issues and waiting for brake bits.

 Regards, Martyn

[FargoMarty]

Massive difference in the engine bay too. Those guards have a good little ledge for sitting tools!

[Desotodav]

Congratulations on a job well done GK. I sent you an email about that braided oil line fitting.

 

Marty, it is good to hear that your big truck is coming along well. I was down your way a couple of weeks ago but didn't drop in. I figure that I won't be back down there til September as it's getting too cold down your way now!

[Geekay]

Geez, has it really been nearly 12 months?

 

Anyway, I am back on the job after having the brakes completely rebuilt, including new lines, and new bonded brake pads, all by Darren at Wodonga Brake and Clutch, who came to my house to bleed the lines and adjust the brakes. I can see why an "expert" is useful when doing the adjustments.

Hooray!! Now I can put the wheels on and take it for it first powered drive for 35 years....or so I thought...

Well, for some reason the fuel is not pumping again from the tank after having refurbished the fuel pump 6 months ago (or more). 

The engine will run if I have a temporary fuel container for above the carby, so at least that is a positive.

After hoping that it was just an air leak in the line it seems the fuel pump is now not "pumping" so have taken it off (again) . Manually operating the lever I do not hear that lovely sucking sound so have opened it up inspect the diaphragm etc.

It looks okay but how do you tell?

 

So I will try to get a replacement diaphragm.

 

I know man will be saying just get an electric one, but I want to get this "sucker" working original.

[Plymouthy Adams]

tank refurbished..in what manner...if lined with sealant, ensure you sealant has not blocked your output filter and or tube should the filter has been removed in the operation. be sure you can get flow from the tank to the input of the pump..don't just assume this is good due to prior work..

[Geekay]

Another milestone day last week when I put the wheels back on and DROVE it up the driveway and up our court, turned around, and back again, using all gear sincluding reverse.

 

The fuel pump diaphragm seems to be on its last legs, but after dismantling the fuel pump, cleaning up and drying the diaphragm, installing a new gasket in the bowl (provided to me by forum member and fellow Aussie Davin) it pumped juice, started and runs beautifully.

 

I have since repeated the drive a few times and wife has taken a video (just need to be edited). Blue smoke from exhaust seems to be decreasing and it is running more and more smoothly.

 

First gear is somewhat hard to "find"  ...is that usual?

 

Anyway, I am a happy chappy. 

 

Have begun to go over electrics and surprisingly everything is working: headlights, tail light, interior light, instrument back light, amp meter. The generator also is "generating"..just not sure yet how well (i.e. with motor going I disconnected battery and motor kept running).

 

The horn...well, what a piece of complicated "system" the steering wheel horn "button" and bits are. Have had to solder up the brass ring under the button and the spring/carbon brushes and still not quite right yet.  The actual horn works though..meep, meep.

[Geekay]

Cylinder compression.

 

Making steady progress towards getting the Fargo to roadworthy in regards to mechanicals.

Peter came over and we did the first compression test, which, at first glance, were probably quite good. Considering the van sat outside at a farm for 34 years.

Starting from the front of the motor the results were:

 

115, 115, 115, 98, 102, 100.

 

There is some tappet noise, but perhaps this is "normal".

 

I haven't driven it very far yet, just about half a mile at a time, and otherwise just idling, and hardly smokes at all now once warmed up.

So the engine has not really had a decent work out yet.

I did get some Marvellous Mystery Oil and applied this to the fuel.

 I see this can be applied to the engine oil too but not sure about the wisdom of this? Comments?

 

I wasn't intending to do any work on the motor internals until I can give it a decent run. Then do another compression test and see what the result is.

What do you think?

[NiftyFifty]

Get the engine warmed up, and control the throttle under the hood and pour some MMO right down the carb...not gulps, just dribble it down to make the engine  run rich and it will burn out a lot of the old carbon and help losen anything sticking up...be sure to do this outside where it can vent.  I do always run some in the oil  too, seems to quiet the lifters a bit IMO.  Sounds like your off to a good start, don't be scared to drain the oil very soon into running it as well, all sorts of sludge can come loose after a few heat cycles.   

[Geekay]

Thanks 4mula.

Will do.

I have changed the oil twice already. First time was a bit dirty but currently it looks okay.

I had removed the sump and cleaned it and the oil pick up thoroughly.

MMO..never seen it in Oz and bought mine from USA. How long has it been around?

 

Garry

 

 

 

[NiftyFifty]

It's gotta be 40 years + old easily I'd say, and ya I forgot about your location....Wal-Mart sells it for like $4.00/bottle in the U.S.

[49D-24BusCpe]

'Geekay',

    You've done everything right so far! Manually cleaning the oil pan and the pick-up is excellent. Also, clean out all the grub from the valve cavity area. As your engine appears to be getting cleaner, just continue to change the oil with your current oil brand. Only use the MMO (or like material) in the fuel system. DO NOT USE IT in your lubricating oil!

    Here's a short story why you don't want to use it in your oil. During the '90s I was involved in the restoring of an ex-USAF Lockheed Constellation. Our Director of Maintenance was an ex-USN Constellation Crew-Chief who was a licensed Air Frame and Engine Mechanic. By that time, I had 30 years experience working on 426 Race Hemi engines, as a drag racing hobbyist. Our group had finally got the bird ready, with full power engine run-ups and high speed taxi runs. At that time, we didn't have a flight crew certified, so a fellow Constellation group from Kansas City was going to do out first flight test.

   The Constellation is fairly complicated mid-50s airplane with four 3350 cu. in. eighteen cylinder engines. They spent a couple of days checking out ALL the flight systems. They asked us if we had used MMO in any of the engines. We said absolutely not, as this is a complete NO-NO in aircraft engines. We asked them why they even asked us that question.

 

    It seems that a couple of years earlier, they had supplied a flight test crew for another Constellation in the U.S. midwest. That enthusiast organization has assured them that everything had been 'done by the book'. They blew one engine on the take-off and lost another during the following emergency landing. It turned out that these idiots had put MMO in the engines. It loosened up all the crud in those engines, plugging oil passages and lines, and ran the engines out of oil. That's why they asked us that question! 

 

    You're doing fine - continue on your present course.     

          

[Geekay]

1 hour ago, 49D-24BusCpe said:

Also, clean out all the grub from the valve cavity area

Thanks. This I have not done so will do.

Constellation is a great aircraft. Only seen one on the ground though. When I was in the states years ago I visited the Howard Hughes Spruce Goose...that was amazing. Massive. Not many comforts inside though.

 

[Jeff Balazs]

Hi Geekay;

I think you might want to be careful adding too much detergent into the system all at once. MMO has solvents which are useful for some applications but pretty dangerous in a relatively dirty old engine. These old flatties are real sludge monsters. No telling what what is hanging around just waiting to drop off into the oil. In fact even though you have cleaned your sump once I would bet if you were to drop the pan again right now you would be surprised at all the black goo you found there again. Ask me how I know......

Jeff

[Geekay]

8 hours ago, Jeff Balazs said:

Hi Geekay;

I think you might want to be careful adding too much detergent into the system all at once. MMO has solvents which are useful for some applications but pretty dangerous in a relatively dirty old engine. These old flatties are real sludge monsters. No telling what what is hanging around just waiting to drop off into the oil. In fact even though you have cleaned your sump once I would bet if you were to drop the pan again right now you would be surprised at all the black goo you found there again. Ask me how I know......

Jeff

Thanks Jeff. Another item on the to do list. Having said that I am happy to progress slowly and allow "things" to develop and fix/restore as necessary.