What do you call a P15 powered by SBC

[Plymouthy Adams]

wayfarer, on 01 Mar 2014 - 1:13 PM, said:

HEY, I like oatmeal.....

Oatmeal, Cream of Wheat, grits...all have their place I guess...jut not on my table....lol

[falconvan]

Each to his own, I've got a chevy in my 48 and a ford in my 49. So far nobody on here has gotten rude or hateful about it.

[Plymouthy Adams]

YES and until someone asked openly for an opinion...basically one never get a comment one way or the other..the man solicited for a us to comment...

Edited March 1, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams

[Don Coatney]

Pablum....

 

 

[OldDad67]

YES and until someone asked openly for an opinion...basically one never get a comment one way or the other..the man solicited for a us to comment...

Exacty right as stated I asked for everyones honest opinion and that's what I expected. At 70 years old I'm way past the being insulted stage, I enjoy looking at everyones ride no matter what it is and appreciate the work and effort put forth in it's creation. Putting a Furd in a Chevy would make me puke but I would have to respect the owner because he liked it, and besides who am I to judge someone else's project, the car hobby is about having fun and meeting other folks who share the same passion. The great thing about these sites is you get a chance to interact with people all across the country and world for that matter, I think it's a great experience, I only hope I can contribute some of the things I've learned over the years, and I always appreciate honest feedback good or bad. I hope nobody is offended that wasn't the intent.

[Plymouthy Adams]

OldDad67...personally I liked your thread..it was an opening to allow some  folks to vent their perspective without the feeling that he is going to upset the man who was asking....about one of the most honest threads we have had of late.....

[falconvan]

Point taken, thanks for being tactful. I'll be the odd man out; an engine is an engine. Do a nice clean looking install that showcases engineering skill and I'm all for it. I saw a 55 dodge with a Lexus V8 last year; beautiful work. You'd have swore Dodge built it that way if you didn't know better.

[knuckleharley]

I call mine "practical". I'm not crazy about SBC engines in anything but Chevrolets,but my P-15 had a 305/250 combo in it with a 78 Camaro front clip and 10 bolt rear when I bought it,and now that both are junk I am replacing them with a balanced and blueprinted 412 SBC with a hot cam,big valve heads,Weiand,dual feed Holley,10 to 1 pistons,roller rockers,hot cam,etc,etc,etc and either a rebuilt turbo 350 with a shift kit,or more likely a 700 R4.

 

I'm doing this because I already have the engine that I used to run in a Chevy van,and it's only got about 20k miles on it.

 

Besides,it already has the GM frame clip,so no matter what else I do to it other than a chassis swap it's still going to be GM.

 

I have other Mopars that are not polluted,and they will remain all Mopar. I see no reason to make the rebuilt of the P-15 any more expensive or difficult than it needs to be,so I am following the path of least resistance.

[Lumpy]

Mopar is bacon and eggs, with a side of hashbrowns. But on a slightly more serious note, once a car is set up for a SBC, would it not be fairly easy to swap it for a small block Mopar? I would think so, and I think it would be worth the effort. Or not. Just a thought.

 

ken.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Lumpy, on 01 Mar 2014 - 8:16 PM, said:

Mopar is bacon and eggs, with a side of hashbrowns. But on a slightly more serious note, once a car is set up for a SBC, would it not be fairly easy to swap it for a small block Mopar? I would think so, and I think it would be worth the effort. Or not. Just a thought.

 

ken.

 

I believe you missed the fact that the SBC is short in length compared to the Mopar and Ford

[Lumpy]

Oh...I did! Well....move the radiator forward.

 

k.

[steveplym]

Each to his own, I've got a chevy in my 48 and a ford in my 49. So far nobody on here has gotten rude or hateful about it.

 

Guilty as well, but I still like it. 

[Oldguy48]

Well, here's another miscreant chiming in. Although I haven't kept it a secret that my P15 is powered by Chevy, I haven't been bashed or banished (YET). Oh, I've gotten a little bit of good natured ribbing, but that's OK. What I have gotten, is quite a lot of help from this forum during my build. I guess I can understand the Mopar loyalty, so I appreciate the fact that I haven't been tarred & feathered for my transgressions. But the fact remains that I love the P15, and am very happy with the SBC that scoots it along. It's a car that I am extremely proud of, and it has been the recipient of several awards, both locally, and at the Ocean City, MD car show. So to answer the question posed by the original poster..."A great old car with a little extra kick". And I am grateful for all the help, advice, etc. that I have received from this forum. A great bunch of folks. Thank you.

Wayne

[Frank Elder]

I like this thread too! I hate chevy or ford in a a chrysler product....I will always be a mope till the day I die, so it's a good thing none of you are building your cars to please me Now I know how all those off brand guys feel when we drop a hemi in their cars to class them up!

Oats with cream and sugar,

Grits with salt and butter,

Cream of wheat, hot and plain....

Malt o meal left on the shelf.

Edited March 2, 2014 by Frank Elder

[Don Coatney]

Does the boob implant in this Crashler count as a SBC? 

 

 

[knuckleharley]

I believe you missed the fact that the SBC is short in length compared to the Mopar and Ford

Actually,the Ford 302 and 351 are both shorter and narrower than a SBC if you use  the Ford SVO water pump.

 

Be aware that the SVO pump has the water hose outlet on the "wrong" side for Fords,though. Which works in your favor if you have to buy a new radiator too,because aftermarket hot rod radiators for Chevy engines are cheaper than ones for Ford engines.

 

Still,I personally prefer using a Mopar engine in a Mopar if possible.

 

Your point about the Mopar engines being so long is a good one,though. I'm cheating on my 33 Plymouth coupe by using either a 55 or a 56 DeSoto hemi,and they are considerably shorter than the Chrysler or later Mopar V-8's.

 

IIRC,the 55 291 is even a few pounds lighter than a SBC. Don't remember what the 56 weighs right at the moment.

[knuckleharley]

..What I have gotten, is quite a lot of help from this forum during my build. I guess I can understand the Mopar loyalty, so I appreciate the fact that I haven't been tarred & feathered for my transgressions. ..

This was the first thing that struck me about this site and made me bookmark it. Almost all the posters try to help other posters,instead of spending their time being snotty. There may be other forums on the web where everybody is open-minded and more focused on the cars than the egos,but I have never personally seen one.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Actually,the Ford 302 and 351 are both shorter and narrower than a SBC if you use  the Ford SVO water pump.

 

Be aware that the SVO pump has the water hose outlet on the "wrong" side for Fords,though. Which works in your favor if you have to buy a new radiator too,because aftermarket hot rod radiators for Chevy engines are cheaper than ones for Ford engines.

 

Still,I personally prefer using a Mopar engine in a Mopar if possible.

 

Your point about the Mopar engines being so long is a good one,though. I'm cheating on my 33 Plymouth coupe by using either a 55 or a 56 DeSoto hemi,and they are considerably shorter than the Chrysler or later Mopar V-8's.

 

IIRC,the 55 291 is even a few pounds lighter than a SBC. Don't remember what the 56 weighs right at the moment.

 

I guess I should have stated that the earlier ford block is long in the pump snout....and though the later SVO stuff may make using them easier I admit to lack of knowledge here as I have not messed with a Ford since about mid 70's ...However, that is still not an early Mopar option out there that I am aware of...I have two Sunbeam Tigers with the Ford V8 and they had stock ford pumps with the pulley flange pushed back onto the shaft as far as possible in order to move the fan closer to the engine.and this yielded at best a pencil's width of clearance at the radiator and that would cause itself to actually deflect air flow more so than aid it causing the center of the rad to hotspot....simple solution back them was to acquire a Posey built adapter plate that would allow the mounting of a very short neck flat chevy water pump onto the ford engine...the single best mod for the car as it allows use of a very high pitch fan and still two fingers of clearance...Posey no longer offer this that I am aware of..I still have one of these kits new in box and is slated for use in my second Tiger, found it new in box at a swap meet and the seller had no clue what it was...5.00 and it was mine..as for later Mopar the introduction of the Power Tech does make a bit smaller nose and if you slip the single nutted fan and go electric you have a fairly compact engine length but most folks get scared of electronics of the later engine...few makers of harness out there for plug and play and if you do not do your own work and are dependently on harness makers for the retrofit, they are very costly per my inquiries on the internet and require you to send in your donor engine harness for this modification based on my research of this long back..of course I am not sure of this cost today if or if not better priced..

 

and yes the Ford was the most marrow of the three engines...but this very narrow part is at the top of the block where it is not really a hindrance as the manifolds are most always above the A-arms as it is..now if sinking this engine below chassis this tad of clearance may be an issue..this same above the A-arms is what allow a big block mopar to go anywhere a small block mopar will go as the only significant width is at the manifolds/valve covers..again..usually lots of fudge room with the inner fenders...I had a 440 in a 41 Dodge military shark nosed truck..this is a very quick tapering hood, no firewall cuts..but a bit of rad support rework for rad and hose routing..

Edited March 2, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams

[steveplym]

Does the boob implant in this Crashler count as a SBC? 

 

 

 

Is that a 230 or 250 Don?  Interesting engine swap.

[Plymouthy Adams]

interesting in the fact that the engine is sitting in a large Chrysler engine bay and still void of a fan bade with just adequate room for the radiator...I say this not to knock the install...only to point out that the very simple sounding 6 for 6 swap is not without limitations and fading line in the sand on every mod needs yet another mod..

[Lumpy]

You know, if one got on a Chevy forum, and started talking about putting a 318 in a EL Camino....it wouldn't be all love and kisses for sure.

 

I'm not just against Chevy in Mopar, I don't think a Mopar in a chevy, or a ford in a chevy, or Mopar in a Ford, etc, is a good idea anymore. Years ago when the old 40's cars were a dime a dozen, I think that slapping an engine with the wrong DNA into it was no big deal...and there were more chevy engines in the junkyards. Today there's plenty of Ford and Mopar engines too.

 

As the old cars become more rare, I think then it becomes more desireable to have the right DNA. It just fits better. Swapping in a SBC years ago...that's okay. But now I think it should be discouraged.

 

I watch the auctions a lot, and I'm definitely seeing a trend where some really, really nice cars come up for auction, with the wrong DNA in them, and the bidding is weak at best. Same car with the same DNA, whether it's the stock engine or not...bidding picks up, as does price.

 

So I guess my opinion is that a swap done even as little as five years ago...that's one thing. Swapping in an engine with the wrong DNA today, or tomorrow...not a good idea, and really no reason to do that. I think that the awareness is that a engine with the wrong DNA, just not "belong". Nothing to get mad about, or put someone down for....just a rising awareness.

 

Just some rambling thoughts. Haven't even had coffee yet!

 

ken

Edited March 2, 2014 by Lumpy

[Oldguy48]

There have been a lot of valid, and interesting points mentioned on this thread about creating half-breed vehicles. And I concur…looking at car after car powered with a SBC at a show CAN get a bit monotonous. But I WANT to see the half-breeds, because I can appreciate the creativity that was required to make that “bastard” engine fit into the engine compartment, and the clever ways that it all comes together. Whether it’s just the shifter linkage, or how the alternator brackets were fabricated, or how the exhaust system was routed, or whatever. If you take the time to understand and appreciate the creativity that went into that engine transplant, perhaps you would tend to be more forgiving. After all, the engine is simply providing the motive force to propel the car. And a Mopar, Chevrolet, Ford, Oldsmobile, Cadillac etc. engine share a lot of similarities except for the name. And if it weren’t for all that creativity, where would the automotive world/car hobby be today?? I’m not really criticizing those who prefer to be brand loyal, but simply suggesting that regardless of the reason the builder chose a particular power plant, view the build from a different perspective. If your job was to transplant a Chevy engine into a Mopar, how would you go about it?? (Even if you made you nauseous !!)

And here’s another extreme example of a half-breed vehicle that took a lot of talent and skill to build! Ridiculous overkill to be sure, but interesting nevertheless!!

Wayne

[Lumpy]

I got the impression that there's actually no drive train...engine does not actually motivate the car.?? Kind of a four wheel engine stand?

 

But....great throttle response. Didn't realize those engines revved up like that.

 

ken

[Eneto-55]

Any engine transplant, if it was not available for that car, creates the need for creativity.  So I think you can appreciate the work that went into a correct brand transplant just as much as a mixed brand transplant, w/o the negative factors.  (I am also a purist - even down to mixing mechanical parts like using the rotors oof of another brand vehicle.  I would try as much as I could, in that case, to use Mopar rotors on my P15, if I were planning to do that upgrade.)

[Oldguy48]

I got the impression that there's actually no drive train...engine does not actually motivate the car.?? Kind of a four wheel engine stand?

 

But....great throttle response. Didn't realize those engines revved up like that.

 

ken

There are several successive videos that you can click on, that show the build as it progresses, and yes the car is drivable. I think video #4 shows that.

Wayne