Panheadguy Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 Hi all, I'm new to the forum and hope to contribute one day but right now I need some help. I'm working on the subject car. The steering wheel and other bits were provided in a box. I have a picrure from the S11 service manual that shows the assembly. Steering wheel on shaft, then a large cupped washer, then nut. Over the nut and seated in the cup is a spring which is held in compression by a brass bar screwed to the wheel. I got all that. It looks to me like there must be a missing insulater to make/break the contact of the horn ring to ground. Anyone got a more complete picture or know how this thing is supposed to function? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_shel_ny Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 Make or break is done by pressing a horn button, or tilting with a horn ring. That provides the ground for the horn relay. This may or may not help. http://mopar.pairserver.com/p15d24ph_forum/topic/26838-need-help-with-horn-assembly/?hl=%2Bhorn+%2Bdiagram#entry267746 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Skinner Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 Panheadguy, I don't have a picture but yes, there is an insulator in that cup. It insulates the spring from the cup. As Shel bizzy said as you press the horn rim the ground causes the horn to sound. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonaldSmith Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 I just fixed my horn ring, after assembling it wrong when I refinished the wheel several years ago. The horn ring mechanism grounds a wire that runs through the shaft to the horn relay, completing the circuit and blowing the horn. The cup and spring are grounded to the steering shaft, frame, etc. (The cup goes in first, not last, like I had done previously.) Without the horn ring in place, the spring would always contact the brass thing with the wings, which has the end of the grounding wire attached to it, and the horn would blow all the time. When the horn ring is attached, it pushes against the end of the spring and separates the end of the spring from the brass thing with the grounding wire. The horn ring is attached to the plastic wheel, and thus is insulated from ground. When the horn ring is pressed in one location, it allows the spring to contact the brass thing, opposite where the horn ring is pressed, completing the grounding circuit for the horn relay. And that's the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Skinner Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 Donald, Your better with words than me. Well spoken! Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 hi, i have a little problem with my dual air horn on my 48 dodge, when i tilt the horn ring, i can ear the relay and the horn make a kind "cloc cloc" but no sound like a real horn ... i try to adjust like is said in the shop manual but nothing ... someone have any idea ? i'm french and before buy anything i want to be sure of what is the problem ^^ the shipping coast from the usa to france are too much expansiv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andydodge Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 Adrian, gidday from Oz.........have you another horn you can try as a test to see whether the original is kaput?.........also the relay maybe kaput............was this system working previously?..........andyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 before removing the front face, one of two work, now, the two not working, i ear something happen into the horn cap but no sound, the relay make a little sound too when i tilt the ring horn. i have the horn of my 41 dodge but i don't want broke it when i test it on my 48 ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_shel_ny Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 Make sure your grounds are good. 6V? 12V ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 this car is all original, never restored, 6v systeme, i'm the 4th owner, i buy it in pennsylvania last year, i have the original lisence plat from 1948 and the mopar envelope with waranty, owners guide, fluid drive guid, and mopar radio model 802 guide ad some other papers about "your new dependable dodge" ^^. the engine is the original, never restored before i do it. other thing, i drove it today, and when i turn the steering wheel i can ear the relay !! i think the wire in the column is in bad shape ... i fix that before other research thank's all ! Adrian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Ed Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 I had this issue once and it was bad grounds where the horns mount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 ok i going to check that too another day ! thank you today a rebuild my front brakes on my 41 dodge club coupe. it's very easy lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De Soto Frank Posted August 31, 2013 Report Share Posted August 31, 2013 this car is all original, never restored, 6v systeme, i'm the 4th owner, i buy it in pennsylvania last year, i have the original lisence plat from 1948 and the mopar envelope with waranty, owners guide, fluid drive guid, and mopar radio model 802 guide ad some other papers about "your new dependable dodge" ^^. the engine is the original, never restored before i do it. other thing, i drove it today, and when i turn the steering wheel i can ear the relay !! i think the wire in the column is in bad shape ... i fix that before other research thank's all ! Adrian. Adrian, It sounds as though the wire that rus down through the steering column is shorting-out against the steering-tube as you turn the wheel - if your horns were working, they would be sounding intermittently as you turn the steering-wheel ! The wire runs all the way down through the steering -shaft, and out through the bottom of the steering gear, so replacement is fiarly easy. Suggest you solder the new wire to the end of the original wire up at the steering wheel, then pull the old wire out through the bottom of the steering gear, pulling the new wire in behind it. The original wire disappears into the harness near the steering gear; you can run your new wire discreetly longside the harness, until you reach the relay. I have used modern #14 gauge plastic-insulated wire for this. If you go with black or dark brown, ity is not very noticeable. Once you get the horn wire and relay working, check the grounds at each horn ( they ground or "earth") through the chassis, and sometimes rust/corrosion cuases poor grounding. If that does not resolve the problem, remove the cover from each horn, and inspect the condition of the contact points, sometmes these become burned. The horn can be tested by itself, connecting a #14 wire from the horn terminal to the negative battery terminal, and another #14 wire from the horn mounting to the Positive terminal of the battery. Don't be alarmed by some sparking - the horn draws somewhere between 20 and 30 amps... Goodluck ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted September 1, 2013 Report Share Posted September 1, 2013 (edited) Adrian, It sounds as though the wire that rus down through the steering column is shorting-out against the steering-tube as you turn the wheel - if your horns were working, they would be sounding intermittently as you turn the steering-wheel ! The wire runs all the way down through the steering -shaft, and out through the bottom of the steering gear, so replacement is fiarly easy. Suggest you solder the new wire to the end of the original wire up at the steering wheel, then pull the old wire out through the bottom of the steering gear, pulling the new wire in behind it. The original wire disappears into the harness near the steering gear; you can run your new wire discreetly longside the harness, until you reach the relay. I have used modern #14 gauge plastic-insulated wire for this. If you go with black or dark brown, ity is not very noticeable. Once you get the horn wire and relay working, check the grounds at each horn ( they ground or "earth") through the chassis, and sometimes rust/corrosion cuases poor grounding. If that does not resolve the problem, remove the cover from each horn, and inspect the condition of the contact points, sometmes these become burned. The horn can be tested by itself, connecting a #14 wire from the horn terminal to the negative battery terminal, and another #14 wire from the horn mounting to the Positive terminal of the battery. Don't be alarmed by some sparking - the horn draws somewhere between 20 and 30 amps... Goodluck ! thank you Frank for this very detailed explanation ! i try this and i let you know about it ! on the 2 horns, one work, the other just make some diaphragme noise but no sound for the one who works i check the ground and the other ground and maybe adjustment. for the wire thru the steering shaft, i read shp manual with the picture of that. it's easy to fix thank you very much ! Adrian. Edited September 1, 2013 by Adrian41D-19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted September 21, 2013 Report Share Posted September 21, 2013 Hi guys ! i fixed my horns !! i check the ground of each horns, i check the wire in the steering tube, clean the contact uneder the horns cap, the high tone is just dirty the other, i dont know but i disasemble it and reasemble it and when i turn the adjusting screw, it work fine ! everything's good ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg g Posted September 21, 2013 Report Share Posted September 21, 2013 Honk Honk, Now This is a Horn............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian41D-19 Posted September 21, 2013 Report Share Posted September 21, 2013 yes ^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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