horn issue

[John Mulders]

Put the steering wheel back in, connected the horn etc and then when I connect the battery the horn starts !

So no bad grond this time

Not sure what I do wrong, think I replaced the items the same way as they came out.

Steeringwheel, contact plate, nut to put the steering wheel tight.

Next the spring, the T cross bar. At the end of the T bar is the wire ending (that goes through the steering colom).

That is all snug.

Then the horn ring (the big one) and the cover plate.

The cover plate atteches to the steering wheel (three screws).

The horn ring can be pressed in and moves in and out (by the spring pressure).

Not sure what goes wrong here?

Anyone?

Thanks

John

[Charlie Olson]

Isn't there supposed to be an insulation piece to keep the wire from making contact as it comes out through the contact plate? That is how my Chevy pikup is set up. If not, is the wire showing any metal exposure?

[Lou Earle]

try loosening the 3 screws that hold the horn ring cover plate- I believe that is how the horn ring is adjusted

Lou

[greg g]

The horn sircuit is bassically hot with ign on. The horn button completes the circuit to ground. If the orn sounds with ign on or bat there is an inadvertant ground somewhere in the circuit.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Most all of the horn rings are insulated from ground and only tightened to the point to have a slight separation from ground source..it is as mentioned earlier that this can be over tightened or insulator missing or ever further, insulation in place but with a slight misaligment..break/tear allowing contact. The horn need to be adjusted with the ohm meter or at least muzzle the horn to keep neighbors ears protected while you trouble shoot. If this gap is not correct and even around the mounting/insulated point it can cause ease of blowing from one angle only and this is what in turn creates excess pressure that ultimately breaks horn ring as a owner tried to blow the horn..these assemblies are not just bolted together..they are assembled and adjusted..

[randroid]

Gents,

My horn started working too well last time I reassmbled the horn-honker stuff and I thought I had torn the wire even though I keep a protecting wrapper on it inside the column. I disconnected it at the relay and have been doing more important stuff, but now it's time to take it apart and do it right. Thanks for the tip; you've come through again.

-Randy

[Normspeed]

John, Make sure your horn wire is attached to the correct terminal on the horn relay. And that the other relay wires, if they've been removed, have been hooked up correctly.

[BobT-47P15]

Hope you can read this OK.

[BobT-47P15]

Dont know if you need this for correct connection of horns.

[John Mulders]

Thanks for the pictures and suggestions.

I checked the diagram, seems my setup is conform the picture Bob gave.

I disconnected the horn itself, indeed better for the relation with the neighbors and also for my own hearing.

Put a light there instead so when the relais is working the light shines.

I also hear the relais.

Note that I did not fiddled around with the relais connections so that should ok.

Now I think I proved the setup to be correct (no faulty grounding) as I placed three rubber insulators between the T-plate and the spring.

At that moment the circuit is broken and the light is out.

When I put the hornring on that nothing happens and when I press the ring in the light works.

This is according Lou's and Tim's suggestion.

(but if I turn the ring a bit left or right the contact is also established which is a bit worrying).

I think that is how it should work (correct me if I am wrong) and thus the retainer should be pushing the ring in so the connection is broken.

Too far in the connection is made again, not far enough the spring and T-plate make contact.

This needs a bit of playing around I guess.

Seems a very sensitive setup and I wonder if that would not be an issue when driving.

Again, any other suggestions appreciated, will start the fine-tuning of the retainer.

John

[John Mulders]

No luck.

With the retainer pushing in manually (without the screws) the contact (spring and T-Plate) should at some point be interrupted.

That is not the case.

With the retainer fastened the light is on, when I gently push the hornring the contact gets broken and if I push further the contact is established again.

Seems that the retainer does not go in far enough to push the hornring in so the contact is broken.

Totally lost here.

Anyone ?

Put the wheels on, lowered the car so it is on its wheels again and tried to fire her up.

It is turning properly but doesn't start yet, so now charging the battery :0

Will try later again.

John

So the hornring

[mikemaker]

The cover plate atteches to the steering wheel (three screws).

loosen those 3 screws. Are you sure you do not have them too tight? I always have to back them off a heep.

[John Mulders]

Hi Mike,

what cover plate is that ? The retainer (see pic Bob)?

Think that is what I exclude by testing (see line "With the retainer fastened the light is on, when I gently push the hornring the contact gets broken and if I push further the contact is established again.").

The fact that with the retainer fastened and then have contact and when pressing the hornring I see the contact to be broken and then when I press harder the contact is established again. That leads me to think the hornring should be a bit closer to the steerinwheel itself.

Just don't see how that can happen with the retainer looser.

Am I overlooking something simple (or complicated) here?

John

Do I make a

[mikemaker]

Yup, loosen the (3): 8-33-5 screws alot.

[John Mulders]

The rubber insulators were just for testing.

Just to understand the principle of it.

I think that with the retainer screws (the 8-33-5) you can pull the horn ring closer to the steeringwheel and at some point the horn ring will push the spring away from the T-plate.

Seems logical but.... when I tighten the screws the contact never breaks. So when tightned it still has a contact. When I gently press the horn ring I can create the moment that the contact gets broken. But that is not a stationairy moment. Then when I press on (so like you actually want to honk the horn) the contact is established again.

Hmm, will try again asap ! Just don't have the feeling this is going to work!

John

[Young Ed]

Just gotta throw this in the mix. I'd heard the advice in here before about leaving those screws loose. When I assembled my horn for the first time I put them tight. My horn works fine!

[mikemaker]

I only know from the experience on my P15 so it may be a different experience for you guys, each time I have removed my steering wheel and put it back together, if I tighten down those three screws, the horn blows constant, then I back them off until I get the horn action I'm looking for. Works for me, I just went outside and confirmed that that is what's going on my my car. Maybe my car is special.

[John Mulders]

thanks again for the responses !

Some replies to questions and other info I can think of to troubleshoot.

- When I removed the horn I am pretty sure the retainer was snug.

- cup is flat side down (the spring cannot move that way).

- T-plate bump up

- the broken nut (Shel - good memory! - , I thought of that aswell) is replaced by a 'of the shelf' nut.

When the horn was blowing all the time I thought that it may make contact with the T-Plate. But I discarded it as the contact is interrupted when the spring is pressed.

But now I think I need to investigate this further, perhaps with assembly the T-Plate is pressed against the nut?

Seems like a long shot!

Will continue to find the culprit !

Thanks!

John

[Young Ed]

John were you able to duplicate that nut 100%? I'm thinking it was thinner then a normal off the shelf one. If your new one is thicker that might be an issue.

[John Mulders]

Ed,

correct, the new one is thicker but it does not make contact (as said I will verify this).

Reason I think it does cause permanent contact is that I can disconnect the contact by pressing the spring.

John