electrical frustration

[DLK]

I have gotten many good suggestions about my neverending charging issues here so am more expressing my frustration than asking for help at this point. After having my generator rebuilt and voltage regulator tested and passed I installed both and for the past week have been driving around the east metro area with a nice slight charge on my ammeter. I packed up for a 200 mile RT Plymouth club cruise to Owatonna, MN this morning and set out. With the new u-joints my car was cruising nicely at 55-60. I got about 25 miles from home and the ammeter went to discharge again. I turned around and drove home in discharge all the way except for one brief period about 5 miles from home when it showed charge for about one block (I have a new battery at least to get me back). Back to the drawing board...

I can't bring myself to tell my wife yet that the $135 for the rebuild of the generator and $75 for the regulator did not solve the problem. I know the generator and regulator are properly grounded and the connections to the ammeter are tight so on to the next step.

[BobT-47P15]

There's gotta be something causing that situation.

Are all the wires to various lights and accessories good?

Are they indeed hooked up properly?

Are those accessories, etc working properly?

I assume you have a wiring diagram that you've been following.

If a professional shop says the gen and reg are good, they probably

are. So, how about the solenoid, the horn relay, the headlight switch,

or anything else the current runs thru. Just tossing out thoughts.

One time, a while back, I had my headlight switch connected incorrectly...........thought

it was right, but kept reviewing it with the diagram and discovered my mistake.

Hope you get it figgered out soon.

Edited July 31, 2010 by BobT-47P15

[Niel Hoback]

Are you at the "grabbing straws" level yet? Change the fanbelt. Are the generator mounting bolts tight? Ammeter connections tight?

How much discharge does it show? Is it all the way over discharge, or is it just partial, like ten amps or so? If it goes all the way, i would expect to find a dead short somewhere. If its just partial, its more likely its just not charging enough. Frustrating.

[JerseyHarold]

Two things I would look at:

1. Deteriorated wire insulation inside the armored cable from the ignition switch causing an intermittent short. Try wiggling the wire from under the hood while someone watches the ammeter inside the car.

2. The wire running up the steering column from the horn relay to the horn button completes the ground to activate the horn when you press the button. The wire may be chafing on the steering column jacket causing a short. Wiggle that one also to see what happens, or unplug it and drive a while.

Hope these help.

Harold

[Young Ed]

The last time I thought my car wasnt charging it turned out the ammeter wires had come loose. Would be interesting to know what the generator output is while the gauge is showing discharge. Through all of this is your battery going dead?

[DLK]

The last time I thought my car wasnt charging it turned out the ammeter wires had come loose. Would be interesting to know what the generator output is while the gauge is showing discharge. Through all of this is your battery going dead?

It appears my rebuilt generator is not charging. When I ground the field generator terminal to the block the ammeter does not show a charge and when a friend put an inline ammeter on the line from the generator to the vr it showed no charge. So my next step is to take out the generator and return it to the shop for further testing. Yes the battery is being drained slowly.

[Niel Hoback]

Seems you have isolated the problem to a faulty generator. Did you get a guarantee when they worked on it? It sounds like they owe you one that works, since thats what you paid for.

[DLK]

Seems you have isolated the problem to a faulty generator. Did you get a guarantee when they worked on it? It sounds like they owe you one that works, since thats what you paid for.

When I picked it up he said it was in pretty sad shape when it came in and had been subjected to a sloppy rebuild some years ago. This place has been in business for at least 40 years at the same address so I hope you are right. Besides when I dropped it off he said he is one of my older brother's golfing buddies - small world.

[Barabbas]

I just converted my 52 Plymouth to 12 volt. My 6 volt generator was working fine ---I did manage to snap the threaded stud that connects to the field wire when I removed it.

If you want it--you can have it for the price of shipping. The bearings etc were good and the winding should be in good shape, I think it would be easy to fix the stud

Mike

[LuckyDevil]

did you remember to flash the field after installing the generator? I am not sure what difference that makes but every book I have read recommended it.

[DLK]

did you remember to flash the field after installing the generator? I am not sure what difference that makes but every book I have read recommended it.

I did not and will take that up with the repairman tomorrow when I bring my generator and vr back in for bench testing.

[BeBop138]

A must do----polarizing or flashing is a must or the genny can fail----I always have to look it up as to which terminals on the reg you have to arc across cause I don`t use the genny, I convert to alt----------------good luck

[Don Coatney]

A must do----polarizing or flashing is a must or the genny can fail----I always have to look it up as to which terminals on the reg you have to arc across cause I don`t use the genny, I convert to alt----------------good luck

I believe in this case the generator was charging and quit charging while driving. If this is the case it should not be necessary to polarize the generator.

If the generator was never charging after the rebuild then it is necessary to polarize. How to do it is pictured below.

[DLK]

I believe in this case the generator was charging and quit charging while driving. If this is the case it should not be necessary to polarize the generator.

If the generator was never charging after the rebuild then it is necessary to polarize. How to do it is pictured below.

Don as always you have a good point. It was charging fine for probably 40 miles after I put it back in the car before it stopped. Thanks for the link.

[DLK]

Well I went for a 25 mile ride last evening and as the usual charging for first 9miles - not charging for 3, then on the way home charging for 8 then not for the duration, except for about one block just before I got home. I finally think I have proof it is the generator. When it is charging an inline ammeter on the armature lead out of the generator shows it charging and when it is not - it is at zero even when I run a ground wire from the field terminal on the generator to the block. Now the problem is to have the generator shop SEE it not charging. Running on the bench for 5 or 10 minutes it has always been charging just fine. Rather than a bench test I am taking the CAR into the shop tomorrow and will drive around the the area until it is NOT charging and pull into the shop. If as I suspect there is an intermittent short in the generator it is so difficult to convince the shop when it tests fine for them. What really hurts is I spent $135 for the rebuild and the real problem which I understand is hard for them to replicate apparently was not fixed.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I think I would be suspect of brushes getting stuck within their holders inside the generator..lots of original brushes and stuff often are reproduced not quite to exact specs..have seen this in other applications..if these seem a bit tight you may have to block them down and then again, I have also seen the electrical connector to the brush get pinched between the spring on assembly and limit its travel..also do not forget that the tension spring itself may be weak due to age or more appropriately, excess current draw in the past...

[Don Coatney]

What you are saying sound somewhat normal. If your battery is fully charged then the generator will not show a charge. When you start the car it draws from the battery reserve. Once started the generator shows a charge to replace this reserve and bring the battery back up to full charge. Once this happens your ammeter will not show a charge. Shut the engine off and restart it and your ammeter should show a charge to once again replace the battery reserve. If you let the engine idle with the headlights on it will also drain the battery reserve. Once you increase the engine speed it will once again charge to replace the battery reserve. Is this what is happening with your car?

Well I went for a 25 mile ride last evening and as the usual charging for first 9miles - not charging for 3, then on the way home charging for 8 then not for the duration, except for about one block just before I got home. I finally think I have proof it is the generator. When it is charging an inline ammeter on the armature lead out of the generator shows it charging and when it is not - it is at zero even when I run a ground wire from the field terminal on the generator to the block. Now the problem is to have the generator shop SEE it not charging. Running on the bench for 5 or 10 minutes it has always been charging just fine. Rather than a bench test I am taking the CAR into the shop tomorrow and will drive around the the area until it is NOT charging and pull into the shop. If as I suspect there is an intermittent short in the generator it is so difficult to convince the shop when it tests fine for them. What really hurts is I spent $135 for the rebuild and the real problem which I understand is hard for them to replicate apparently was not fixed.

[P-12 Tommy]

I agree with Don 100% He explained the operation of the amp gauge perfectly.

Tom

[Young Ed]

My plymouth always shows about one needles width to the charge side after the initial charging back up. I have found that sometimes on long periods of driving it will go to 0. Dave next time it shows 0 try turning on a couple electrical items like the headlights radio(do you have a radio?) whatever else you got. Heater would be good but I know you don't have one. Even just the headlights should be enough that if it stays at 0 or above with them on that its charging.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I could agree also except for the one statement, he ran a wire from the field to ground with no resultant output...

[martybose]

What you are saying sound somewhat normal. If your battery is fully charged then the generator will not show a charge. When you start the car it draws from the battery reserve. Once started the generator shows a charge to replace this reserve and bring the battery back up to full charge. Once this happens your ammeter will not show a charge. Shut the engine off and restart it and your ammeter should show a charge to once again replace the battery reserve. If you let the engine idle with the headlights on it will also drain the battery reserve. Once you increase the engine speed it will once again charge to replace the battery reserve. Is this what is happening with your car?

If the ammeter was inline with the generator it should have been showing a steady output that is supporting the ignition system and any other loads, even if the battery isn't charging.

Marty