I think I found my next project

[Rodney Bullock]

Here is a pic of the dash. The buttons are sun burned. The clock is in tack.

[RobertKB]

It's a beautiful all original type, I have only seen pics as he lives 800 miles west of me....

My car is actually a '38 Chrysler, not a '39. I sure like it but I also like the '39 Chrylser which has the waterfall grill. Here is one more picture of my '38.

[Rodney Bullock]

Hi Robert, I know you have a 1938, I worked on a 1938 imperial for years. I told you long ago that I really like your car. The black is Presidental. I think because this car is missing so much If I can make the deal I would lead to street rodding it. The water fall grill trim is outstanding:D I really like it. The deal depends on all that trim being there.

[55 Fargo]

My car is actually a '38 Chrysler, not a '39. I sure like it but I also like the '39 Chrylser which has the waterfall grill. Here is one more picture of my '38.

OOPs sorry Robert, thought was a 39

[steveplym]

Interesting story about that car Rodney. Sounds like trying to restore this car may take some work. Every time someone tries something bad happens to them. Sounds like a car from the movie Christine.

Anyway, that is a really neat car and would be a really nice car to build as it is so solid. Where are you going to put them all Rodney?

[RobertKB]

OOPs sorry Robert, thought was a 39

That's OK Fred, I forgive you! Just don't let it happen again!!

[Rodney Bullock]

Interesting story about that car Rodney. Sounds like trying to restore this car may take some work. Every time someone tries something bad happens to them. Sounds like a car from the movie Christine.

Anyway, that is a really neat car and would be a really nice car to build as it is so solid. Where are you going to put them all Rodney?

I don't know:confused: The deal has not been made yet.My first goal would be to make it moble. I would get a motor in it so I could move it at will. It would be easy since the front clip is off.

[brain2003]

hi, I'm new to the forum.

lost at sea.......tornado......

are you sure this isn't 'Christine'

[builtfercomfort]

I'm working on a 1939 Chrysler Royal Windsor, which is the top-end 6-cyl, just below the Saratoga I guess. The picture of the clock shows the wonderful deco design, and the peeling paint - the back of the glass was painted with translucent gold numbers and darker background, so it can be seen in daylight or backlit at night. The clock itself is mechanical-electrical, it fires a solenoid to wind it every 30 seconds or so; never seen the like before. Also notice that the gauge and clock glass has a large raised bubble in the middle. Hard to find if broken, and I think the gauges are one-year-only items. Still, they seemed to sell quite a few of these cars.

Getting the numbers replaced on my gauges and clock is proving to be hard for me (without dumping a bunch of money in it at least). I've tried overhead transparency paper - good backlit, but no too dim fore-lit in sunlight; I think I'll try decal paper I print on a color laser printer next.

I'm (slowly) putting in a v-8 and automatic, so if someone wants a stock (running!) 6 cyl motor and the 3-speed column shift overdrive transmission (and a few more parts) send me some email. (blorgo at gmail)

--Tom

[Rodney Bullock]

Hi Tom, I would very much like to see the pic's of how you got the V8 in there, I want to street rod the car however I really don't want to use a subframe. How did you do yours? I am waiting for the counter offer for the car.

[builtfercomfort]

Hi Rodney - Right now the car is a couple of hours away so words will have to do for now.

I will have to say I recommend this project, not too bad overall compared to some things I see people going through. This car is like the 'big older brother' of the P-15 - it looks like they used this car for the design of the newer car. It has forged A-frame pieces up front, not the heavy stamped ones of the post-war cars, but the same overall design of the front suspension. Finding tie rod ends may be a slight issue, not sure what interchanges but some stuff does, or could be adapted. Most of the rest of this stuff would be about the same on a P-15 or D-24.

I'm on a low budget here, so a lot of my decisions were based on what would work and be cheap rather than the ideal. You'll see that come up a few times in the writeup below.

Charlie's (olddaddy) disc brake kit worked fine. I was having trouble with the kingpin retaining pins so I shipped everything to him and he put it together for me and it worked. The shock relocation kit didn't fit, I will return that to Charlie some day when I find it :-) but I'm happy with the brakes.

I put in a GM power brake booster unit on the firewall and used a brake pedal assembly out of a 90 GMC van. I found a Ford Explorer 8.8 rear end (disc brake era) which is a perfect fit, and uses the same lug pattern for $300. I am planning on using the stock 16 inch wheels. On those wheels I have 215/70/R16 radials - I'd be happier with something a little skinnier but they work - I'd spend the money on Diamondback wide whitewalls but I got 4 tires for $200 (slightly used).

The V8 fit fine (offset to the right a little) and the only problem was the steering. If you ran a small block Mopar and could get one of those Valiant 273 exhaust manifolds for the driver side it might clear the steering fine. Me, I had trouble. Ugly custom headers on the drivers side and I even had to have someone remount the steering box an inch or so downward. In retrospect I probably should have either put in some steering u-joints or gone with the rack and pinion setup from a Cavalier so I could get power steering but I can do that later.

I was looking around at 318 and 360 Mopar motors for donors but I got a good running 5.0 Ford and AOD for $300 and I couldn't pass it up. So I have a full Ford drivetrain under my car, annoys some people, I've offered to run the Mopar if they will trade me even for the Ford motor and swap it out for me . No takers so far! I put a Holley carb and manifold on it, the motor I got was missing the upper fuel injector unit and it wasn't worth messing with finding the computer and parts to make it work.

I rigged up the stock shifter to the AOD and it should work fine. It's got the Lokar OD shift cable so I don't burn it up. My rear end is a 4.10 ratio and will be happy with the OD part. I have a single exhaust running down the passenger side of the car, that's where it fit best to not hit the gas tank or the (since removed) battery box.

I have some space issues toward the front of the car because I have the 6 cyl sheetmetal. I have a serp. belt system, and had to mount the (GM) alternator up and to the right a bit (and replace the pulley with a 6-groove Ford pulley). The original power steering pump was lower left (would not fit), the air pump was lower right (not needed, wouldn't fit), and the alternator was upper left (close but would hit the hood sides). If I get the air conditioning compressor installed someday I'll have to mount it on top center of the motor. Plenty of room up and down, not much left and right, not much fore and aft. With the Saratoga, you'll have another six inches or so room fore and aft under the hood, but probably the same width issues.

I have room for an electric fan behind the stock radiator but I'm currently running it in front, still thinking about that. I'm planning on getting AC someday and I suppose I'll rework it then.

Let's see, what else... I put the battery in the trunk, but the under-the seat method would work, mine was rusted out. I have the stock hand brake running to a cable on the rear end that interferes with the battery box anyway, I had to buy three cable pullies from the tractor supply and run the cable through those because it has to zig-zag it's way back thru the frame to the rear end.

I found some small 12v gauges with 90 degree needle throw and mounted them behind the existing instrument panel (still working out the details on that). They should look totally stock when I am done.

I currently have the interior torn out except for the headliner (which comes out next), and a friend of mine is working on replacing the trunk metal. I think the car sat in a shed with the rear sticking out because it's in great shape up front but the trunk floor was rusted out or paper thin. And the gas tank was leaking so I found a 33 gallon gas tank from a 90s Bronco that was the right size (6 inches taller though) and that is mounted; I lose 6 inches of trunk space but gain a ton of cruising range. (And, more Ford parts to annoy the purists). That tank was $30 instead of the $300+ a replacement one would be (could never find an exact replacement tank anyway).

Still working out the lighting and wiring. The headlight lenses come up on ebay all the time fairly cheap but the tail light lenses go for big bucks. The front grill teeth are also a bit spendy sometimes, but you can find them. I'm working out the turn signals and such, adding some up front and reworking the tail lights. It should be running and yard-driving in a month or two. Then, interior, bodywork, etc.

[Rodney Bullock]

I am wondering, If I just went with a disc brake set up would that be enough? I was thinking of a sub frame set up at first. This front end can support a 440 can't it? I have found a motor, trans and rear. I want to have this thing on the road next summer. I also want to keep the cost down. You guy's that have V8's in your mopars did you find it impossible to use the original front end?

[Frank Elder]

According to this site a 6 weighs more than a 350 by several 100 lbs. But you have to take in accordance the weight of the transmission that goes with the 440, A833 or 727 Torqueflite it's probably more. Stock springs probably won't cut it.

[Young Ed]

Rodney wasn't this car originally a straight 8? Might have a beefier front end then the 6 version

[Rodney Bullock]

Yes, * with a huge overdrive. It might be able to handle it.

[Norm's Coupe]

Rodney,

You shouldn't have to subframe if you don't want to. In fact, you could even use the original braking system and frontend. Use to be a guy here in Milwaukee area that had a 48 dodge coupe. He had a 350 in it and everything on the frontend was all original, including the brakes. Putting disc brakes on would not change anything, except you'd have better brakes.

[55 Fargo]

Yes, * with a huge overdrive. It might be able to handle it.

Rodney, even with a stock 6, this engine and trans would be in the 800 lb range.

The brakes and front end may have been 12 inch, but most likely is of the 11 inch variety, this front end should be able to support the 440 and trans, maybe you will need as mentioned beefier springs.

The 25 inch flattie 6, and huge fluid drive and trans gets might heavy, a heck of a lot heavier than a SBC and Turbo 350....

[RobertKB]

Rodney, in one of the posts on this thread by "builtfercomfort" he says he has a flathead six and overdrive he is getting rid of. Might be worth contacting him and you could run original powertrain and with the OD be able to cruise highway speeds. Do a little performance work like some of the guys on the forum and you would have a "beast". Just a thought but a good one.

[Rodney Bullock]

It is a good thought Robert however I want to build my first street rod:) I have been very dedicated to the original world. I have restored three cars back to their original condition. It has been fun, now I want to try something new.

We have a thing around here called shadow building. This is whentwo or three people start a project around the same time. They share their experences and knowlege as they are doing basically the same thing but with different model cars. The other guy's have a slight lead on me and come to think of it they are building 1941 and 1930 Studebaker street rods. One has a MustangII front end all ready installed, the other has his motor a 347 with OD already installed so I am lagging behind a little. Well actually I have not even got my car home yet.

It's all in fun... I mean what else is there to do:o

[builtfercomfort]

The Saratoga originally came with the straight-8 in it, which is probably heavier, and had a longer nose. I think you could get any engine in there you want, the problem might be interference with the steering. The best way of handling that is to get the power rack-and-pinion kit so you can run u-joints to the steering box and eliminate the large, inside-the-frame steering box that causes all sorts of trouble in V-8s in these old cars. Then you'd have nice power steering too.

If you run a small block mopar, there is less of a problem because there are special factory manifolds - see here:

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=3398287

[Ricky Luke]

Hi Rodney

Have a look at the Imperial club website for some general info on the 39.

http://www.imperialclub.com/Yr/1939/index.htm

If you want to go unusual, and not have to worry about relocating steering etc, try this Oz Charger engine.

300+ horses

Cheers

Rick

[Rodney Bullock]

oh my:rolleyes:

[greg g]

looks suspiciously like a Jeep 4 liter.

[builtfercomfort]

This is Rodney's thread - I hope he gets the Saratoga! He'll have fun with it. I'd rather have more room in the engine bay, and I think the longer noses look better.

I got a bunch of questions via PM and others about my Ford complete drivetrain mounting and such in my 39 Chrysler. I have some fairly bad pictures of the motor, tranny and rear end - the details of the motor mount are missing but it shows the custom headers needed to clear the steering, how it fits in the firewall and trans tunnel, etc. At my photobucket album there are a bunch of pictures of the exhaust routing, the e-brake cable that runs in pulleys to the rear, and the 8.8 rear end mounting with the Explorer springs. Also really terrible pics of the engine, OD trans and rear end I'm trying to sell - there is too much junk in the way to get a decent picture, it was too late and I was too tired to move the junk when I remembered to take the pictures. But better than nothing, I guess.

Buy my take-off parts! I need an interior (I actually haven't posted a formal for-sale on those yet, but in response to several PMs: I'll sell the entire stock driveline, including motor, OD tranny, driveshaft and rear end for $500 firm, as is/where is in zip 21850, price is for board members only.)

[Rodney Bullock]

After all the hoopla I have made the deal and will pick up the car next month:) Oh boy this will be be great. I have located a motor and a possible trans. I will take my time with it and not rush this project. I am going to put it up for a year or so and go full next year. I good to have my hand busy again. I will start doing my home work and get it right. Mopars back in town voom voom.