PT81PlymouthPickup

Thanks Greg! I'll have to take some careful measurements and make comparisons. I should have done this before I removed the flywheel from the crate engine in order to mount it on my engine stand. I'm thinking I can still get some measurements and along with some basic math figure out if this engine will go in without modifications to the bell housing, which I really don't want to do.

The entire engine was painted with an aluminum looking silver. The golden color you refer to in the pictures is the cosmoline that was sprayed on everything. Still sticky after all these years. The OEM paint job on this engine is pretty crude when you look close at it. Not much prep. I'm certain it wouldn't last long once operated in the real world. Now it being a crate engine, perhaps it wasn't as fussy a paint job as those installed at the factory, but I doubt it? I have a feeling that a lot of us detail our engines way better than what came when our trucks were new? I hear ya on the wasting away! Lols! The sad thing is, I don't even need it. My current engine runs like a dream. I was looking for a good core engine to have just in case I needed it when this opportunity came up I could not pass on.

Thanks Greg! Yeah, I'd like to determine if it's an "issue" before I attempt a swap. I'm wondering if I can get a crankshaft flange measurement on my old engine by just dropping the flywheel cover? It's been a while since I looked up in there.

I'm hoping so Ed, but with my luck, things rarely go simply. Lols!

Thanks Ed! The 230 came with a flywheel, but I believe the ring gear is not the same tooth count as my early engine? I'm hoping I can use the earlier foot activated starter with the 230? I'm uncertain if it would be just as simple as changing the earlier ring gear onto the 230 flywheel?

Nope! Still in my garage now missing some parts that I sold off to some WC owners. I feel a bit guilty about having done this, but the parts have been going to Vintage Mopar enthusiasts. ? I bought this 230 crate motor because it was a great deal for a NOS engine. I would not even be able to get machine work done on an old core for what I paid for this complete engine. I am however not certain this engine will transplant easily into my 39? The engine in my 39 pickup has no numbers on the block. I believe it to be a 201 or 218? I'm thinking of starting a post hoping to get some insight from those more experienced on swapping a newer and larger 230c.i. into the earlier trucks. I suspect my earlier starter motor might be an issue? If it turns out the 230 is not a good backup engine for my truck, I'm certain I can sell it easily. Advice and opinions welcomed! ?

Brand new military surplus built by Chrysler Corp. in the mid 1960s. Still in the crate when I bought it. I have documentation. PCV yes, but no EGR. I will be posting more about it in the future. I need to determine if it will fit in my truck without major difficulty?

Sounds hard to me! Lols! ? I only weigh 180 lbs

Never having worked on anything bigger than a 3/4 ton pickup truck and after reading through all the comments, I'm curious as how one achieves tightening nuts and bolts on heavy duty trucks? I can't believe a human with a wrench could exert 300-400 lbs with a wrench unless it was 10 ft. long? I'm guessing heavy duty impact wrenches?

A young fella I know whom works at the local Tires Plus shop tells me they are required to torque all wheels on cars to 90 to 100 ft. pounds. I assume that's a policy to prevent broken studs and stripped nuts and also more importantly to be certain they're not too loose. I'm sure these tire places have an occasional law suit? I remember my dad telling me one of the young mechanics who worked for him had spun the lug nuts all the way down by hand and then forgot to tighten them with the impact gun. The customer didn't get very far before the wheels almost came off the car. Luckily, she was an understanding sort. Mistakes occasionally happen even by good people. My dad told the young mechanic to never run the lugs down to the wheel by hand. Just start them and then finish with the impact gun. This way it's obvious that they are not tight. Once experienced with a 4 way wrench or an impact gun you can get a very good sense of proper tightness by feel and or sound of the gun. In the hands of the inexperienced bad things can happen. On my 39 Plymouth my feel is telling me that my new rear wheels are good at 85lbs, but the original front wheels feel tight at around 65lbs. Thought this a bit strange.

Yes, that's either a mix up or is referring to something other than lug nuts or bolts. I know that a 1/2-20 (which are what mine are) would strip the threads long before 375 foot pounds. I'm familiar with the old timer feel method, but thought it might be useful to have a torque number for those that might not be, or out of practice. What started me on this quest was that the feel method was failing me a bit. On my new modern rear wheels it was very positive and after checking with my torque wrench was about 85lbs. The original wheels which I am running on the front seemed like I could keep tightening almost like the steel in the wheel was flexing? After reading a bunch of stuff on threads and lug nuts etc. Lots of variables can affect torque, such as material, plating, lubrication, etc. I did put some never seize on the threads. I was hoping someone might have some torque numbers that would be useful for our original wheels.

Anyone know what the correct lug bolt torque should be on the 1/2 ton pickups with original wheels? Most modern cars I believe are close to 100 foot pounds, but I'm thinking that's too much for our wheels?

Chopped, channeled, Small block Chevy, Turbo 400 trans. Ford 9" rear, disc brakes all around? ? If you do, a bunch of us will show up with guns! ? Lols!

Thanks Ed! I'm hoping the 3/8 spindle offset will take care of that. I'm a bit worried about my increasing the tire diameter about an inch? I'm running a 3:55 rear with a S10 T5 trans. Pulled fine with the 650-16s. I also just discovered Michelin no longer makes the Defender LTX in 215/85r16. Geez! My plan was to run 245/75r16 Michelin Defender LTX on the rear (which I purchased a while ago). They have the same diameter but wider than the 215/85r16s which I now can not get in Michelin. They would have closely matched the rear tires I already bought. So, now I'm faced with mixing tire brands and load ratings which I really don't want to do. I feel like a fool that creates aggravation for himself sometimes by moving too slowly and other time too quickly without thinking things through? Lols! Somebody tell me I'm not the only one?

Hi Ed, Was the pitman arm rubbing issue with 215/85R16s on your truck minor? Did adjusting the steering stop limit your turning radius by much? I'm considering the 215/85R16s for my front axle. I converted to disc brakes which pushed the hubs out about 3/8" which might be just enough to avert the rubbing issue? Also, I'm curious what differential ratio you're running? Does your truck pull hills OK with the larger diameter tires? Sorry for all the questions! Steve

These engines come available for reasonable prices if you keep an eye out for them. I've seen some decent ones on eBay. Often, some street rodder unloading an unwanted flatty from a Mopar that's slated for a v8 transplant. I came across a brand new 230 still in crate just a couple years ago that was advertised on Craigslist. He wanted $1800 and I got it for $1500. I didn't really need it, but figured at that price it was a bargain. I'm not even positive it will fit in my 1939 PT81 pickup? Soon as the weather warms up, I'm going to take a closer look and try to figure out if it will fit into my truck without issues?

Does it crank over strong when you're trying to start it the second time?

My dad owned a Chevron station on Rt 1 in central New Jersey. I was pumping gas there at about 12 years old in the mid 1960s. Talk about full service! We cleaned both windshield and rear window, asked if we could check under the hood fluid levels and would air the tires if they asked. Then we gave them Green stamps which they could redeem for gifts after accumulating a bunch. All the while saying "Yes Ma'am or Yes Sir" no matter how miserable the customer was. Never see that again! Was a magical time for me working with my dad and taking for granted all those cool cars and trucks that were passing through or in for service.

Nice car! Off topic, but I'm interested in knowing what size and brand tires you're running?

I agree with allbizz49's statement. Being a semi-purist, there is something to be said about keeping it Mopar. IMO, too many Chevy's in all makes of street rods! I like to see Chevys in Chevys, Fords in Fords, and Mopars in Mopars. Just my opinion, but a Ford in a Mopar is just weird. Lols! A nicely done flathead six is a strong reliable engine and a less complex project than the engine swap. My vote is keep it mostly stock and if you decide to go street rod, something like a 318 or vintage hemi would be cool. I agree with your frugality, but sometimes it bites you in the end. I imagine your car would have a higher value without a Ford engine under the hood? I think Frank Elder needs to way in on this.

At my age , I no longer have the patience to do all the stripping, repairing, filling, sanding, priming, painting, wet sanding, and buffing. And after all that stuff, have a truck I'm afraid to get a scratch on and probably would be too old to drive. That's if I lived long enough to finish it? There is something to admire about a vintage vehicle that is mechanically sound and gets used without worry. If you can keep a vehicle in a garage and no longer drive it in wet salty conditions, the current rust will hold up just fine. Lols! Anyhow, just saying; I've come to appreciate things without all the shine. Kinda like women. Keeping up with those sporty shiny models will give you more pain. ?

I just had a couple wheels made by "The Wheelsmith" Not cheap, but they did a great job! They were about $200. each and then I had to paint them. I think they'll powder coat if you want to pay extra? Some photos in attached thread.

You Know! Some would pay bunches of money to create that patina. Maybe don't paint it at all? ?

Nice work! ?

Just sort of came my way. In 1979 I went to an auction with a buddy who was looking for a vintage truck. The auction was for Mrs. Blackwell. The widow of a fella who had owned a small town Chrysler dealership in Hopewell, NJ. Along with a lot of other stuff, his service truck was up for auction. A 1939 Plymouth pickup. This truck was in rough condition, but being young and dumb, my friend bid for it with my stupid advice that we could fix it up. Long story short; was fun for a while hanging out and trying to restore the beast, but after several years of trying, my friend had enough, and gave up on it. Me being a stubborn sort and not wanting to give up, I bought it from him. I've pecked away at it over the decades and am still working on it. Lots of grief and spent way too much money and time. I did learn a lot by doing things three times over. Have come to appreciate the engineering of these old machines and it gives me something to occupy my free time now. I don't think our vehicles are every really finished. I should probably have sold it a long time ago, but still too stubborn to give up. It's a love / hate relationship. I'll keep till I croak. Lols!