Battery prices at Tractor Supply Co (TSC)

[BobT-47P15]

I was in a Tractor Supply store last weekend in Kansas City....killing time

while the Mrs and a friend were bargain shopping nearby.

Went to the battery rack to check: 6 volt heavy duty was priced at

$44.99 and 8 volt at $79.99

So....both are available at those prices. Just FYI....following a recent

thread on batteries.

[wayfarerstranger]

i bought one at tractor supply last week best price anywhere ..6 volt is 625 or 650 cold cranking amps & looks like a vintage battery. most like autozone are only 425 or 450 and cost 59.99 core charge at autozone and other places are 12.00 & up tractor supply is 10.00. most places i called batteries have really jumped in price as high as 90.00 to 120.00 . thats insane ,,

[Heavy Flat Head]

Jumped, I wish you would have told me before I bought a new battery for my minvan. The last one at Costco cost me $39.00 for a blazer (2 years ago) and this one was $89.00. Wife thought I was going to have a heart attack right in the store.

Ed.

[Plymouthy Adams]

retail has quickly picked upon the fact that the consumer is going to pay for gas regardless of price..why not rip us up the back for everything else..I think you are sgetting ready to see the next wave in Saturday night discount shopping.

[Tony Cipponeri]

Hey, I was told by a reliable source, that it Illegal to charge a core charge on a new item. Tony C

[Captain Neon]

Hey, I was told by a reliable source, that it Illegal to charge a core charge on a new item. Tony C

I've never heard that before, and I used to work for AutoZone when I was in college. I remember an Arabic man that tried to get a core refund on all his old parts. It was funny trying to explain to him that I wasn't going to give him money for the old spark plugs and wiper blades he fished out of our trash.

In fact, battery core charges were put in place to discourage folks from dumping their old batteries in the trash instead of having them properly recycled. Folks are more likely to return a battery to get their core charge back. Me, I keep an old battery around to bring in to avoid the core charge all together, but once upon a time I did pay the core charge that is represented by my current old battery.

I would think that an eco-Nazi state like California would set a state mandated minimum core charge and heavily fine any one disposing of automotive parts "improperly." I think your reliable source is probably mistaken. Nevertheless, that is probably just California. It is a well-accepted standard in the other 49 states and the DC to institute a core charge for parts that are hazardous (ex. batteries), contain expensive materials (ex. catalytic converters), and cast casings (ex. alternators).

[Young Ed]

Thats been my experience too. The only 2 new parts I've had to deal with core charges on are batteries and the radiator in my dakota.

[Norm's Coupe]

We have core charges here too for batteries and certain other parts. As far as the cost of batteries are concerned. It's not so much the stores raising their prices to gouge us. I buy my batteries at a Remy shop where they make and rebuild the batteries. The reason they give for the cost rising on batteries is due to the cost of disposing of hazardous waste they create in the manufacturing of them and rebuilding them. It getting harder and more expensive for them to dump the waste so they are just passing that cost on to the consumer.

[bob_amos]

I'm that source that Tony mentioned. A few years ago the parts stores were charging a core charge for a NEW water pump. It was only $2. Their reasoning was that there were not enough cores to rebuild and this would boost the cares available making lower priced reman units avail to the consumer. Well, the BAR jumped in and put a stop to that saying it was illegal to charge a core on anything new. They were only entitled to a core return on a rebuilt unit. I have a BAR rep that drops into the shop from time to time and that is what he told me. There are ways that a charge could be made on new items. Charge a higher price and rebate that charge if the customer wants to turn in an old part. Also, a charge for enviorment controled items such as tires are at present. But that charge is actually made up front reguardless of how you handle it when replaced down the road. But a core on new is not a legal action as I am told by our BAR rep. As a matter of fact. A customer's removed part must be made available to him for inspection or his keeping if he so elects. Another problem with these battery core charges is the charge is made upon delivery of the battery from the supplier. If I return a core later they only pay $3 and not the $10 they charge when the battery is dropped off. We will have to wait and see what the California BAR does to this latest attemp at raping the consumer. Yes, prices have risen on batteries and they tell it's the price of the metal contained within the battery. So that excuse does not match the previous posts excuse. Who knows what is true these days? Getting right down to it, it looks too much like the manufactured reasoning being used by the oil companies since the 70's. Over the years companies excuses keep changing from day to day. It's tough to believe anything we are told these days. One wonders if and when it will ever end. One note on the battery charges. We sell so many batteries that we refuse to ever pay that charge and get away with it. They even charge a $2 fuel surcharge when they drop off a battery. We also refuse to pay either of these charges or will go elsewhere to purchase our batteries. Something a one time buyer cannot get away with.

[Captain Neon]

Correct me if I am wrong, Bob, but if one calls it an eco-fee or overcharge and then give a rebate for the old part it still sounds like a core charge to me. It's all semantics are far as you describe it to me. List the core charge as a line item and then refund for the old part, or overcharge and then line item the old part as a rebate. What's really the difference?

Now, I am sure things are different in your part of Cali because they were different when I lived in Minnesota, but here in Northern Colorado it is typical to charge twice retail price for parts with the excuse that if the part fails I am covering the replacement labour. I'm often told that auto repair shops must charge the consumer double for parts or the auto repair shops will go out of business. The part has a warranty from the supplier, does it not?

I used to get my work done by a buddy that I went to high school with, and he never charged me (or anyone else for that matter) more than what I could buy the same part for at NAPA. I am fully aware that shops usually get a lower price from their part suppliers than I can as a regular consumer. I don't mind that a shop may charge me retail when they got the part cheaper. However, it makes little sense to me that a repair shop that is paying $25/hr for a technician (the tech's only grossing $20/hr, netting about $15/hr), and charges me $85/hr labour that I need to pay twice what I can get the same part for at NAPA.

Do you agree with the shops here in Northern Colorado or do you think they are gouging the consumer?

[Norm's Coupe]

I used to get my work done by a buddy that I went to high school with, and he never charged me (or anyone else for that matter) more than what I could buy the same part for at NAPA. I am fully aware that shops usually get a lower price from their part suppliers than I can as a regular consumer. I don't mind that a shop may charge me retail when they got the part cheaper. However, it makes little sense to me that a repair shop that is paying $25/hr for a technician (the tech's only grossing $20/hr, netting about $15/hr), and charges me $85/hr labour that I need to pay twice what I can get the same part for at NAPA.

Do you agree with the shops here in Northern Colorado or do you think they are gouging the consumer?

I don't know what Bob would have to say about that. However, $85 per hour labor charge when the tech gets 20 or 25 of that sounds reasonable to me. Yes $85 per hour does sound like a lot of money, but isn't when you add everything up. After all, the shop owner also has to pay for 7.5% of the employees salary to social security in the employees name. Plus unemployment insurance for the employee, a portion of the employees health insurance monthly premium, plus all the expenses of operating the shop, such as buying and maintaining equipment and building maintenance, etc. Then the owner still should be making some small portion for return on his investment for the shop. So.........if you add all that up, $85 per hour is cheap if you are paying the tech $20 to $25 per hour. The employer also has to pay the monthly premiums for employee Workman's Compensation insurance, in case the employee gets hurt on the job, thats state law.

Its like the clothes we wear. Don't know the cost involved in making just a mens plain white shirt today, but.............Back in the 70's I knew a Plant Manager at a company that made dress shirts for several popular brands. Back then, you could buy the dress shirts in the store for between $5 and $15 (all made the same way in the same plant, just different brands). They sold them to the distributors for just 25 cents each. All the rest of the difference in prices was each stores markup, plus the cost of shipping etc. The markup of each store covered their operating cost, they weren't gouging the customer.

All stores do the same thing, otherwise they wouldn't be in business very long. The difference when you buy it from NAPA is, you aren't paying the tech or for the use and operating cost of the shop to do the work. You're doing it yourself. You have no overhead involved except for the part.

[JerseyHarold]

The basic 'business model' for most repair shops is 1/3 labor(to tech), 1/3 overhead, and 1/3 profit. Here in New Jersey, posted shop rates are hovering around $100. per hour.

[Captain Neon]

Just to be clear, I'm not complaining about the labour. I am complaining about the practice of charging twice the retail price for parts (almost 4x the shop's cost for the parts). The $25/hr figure is roughly what the business pays for the technician. The technician actually grosses $20/hr and takes home about $15/hr.

I understand that a shop has overhead, etc. I object to the practice of hiding costs in the prices charged for parts. A shop may charge a customer one hour's labour ($85) to install an alternator, but then charging $220 for an alternator than can be gotten by any yahoo for $110 seems a bit dishonest to me. I wouldn't object to being charged $195, but I have a big problem with being charged $305 for the job. Do you see where I am coming from? It's especially troubling when it is likely that the shop paid $56 for the alternator.

Worse yet, over $85 for a simple oil change, and they think they have a right to charge so much. Their costs don't amount to $25. I have a problem w/ this. I think it is dishonest. I'm trying to find out if I am completely off-base here from a shop owner in another market. I've had some repair shops here in Colorado tell me I am, when I get an estimate and I complain about their parts estimate.

[bob_amos]

It may be a bit confusing but it's all in the way you put it. Call it a core for a new part and it is not allowed but call it a rebate for an over priced item and it's allowed. Go figure.... Anyone that doesn't know that the layers and gov't use words to twist any statement to their own advantage isn't living in the 21'st century. We have all been done in in some way by a laywer or gov't agency for using the wrong term. It's done on our taxes every day. Good example, in California you cannot tax on the full value of a home unless it is sold or a permit has been pulled. So, they call something an accessment fee and it goes through. We end up paying the tax just the same, only in another name.

Labour rates... My shop is at $82 an hour and many shops in So. Cal. are higher while some are lower. Our rates are determined by the work we do and the affordable rate for the community, plus what we need to exist. It is called a flat rate hour rate. Meaning, that a job has a flat rate value and you price is this flat rate times the shops hourly rate. If you beat the rate you make money, if you take longer you loose. I have been told the bay area is over $100 and places like Arkansas is in the $25 to $35 range. This is what I am told by the warrantee companies we deal with. As to parts. We generally work on what is called a discount rate. It's a sliding rate based on the our purchase price of an item. On average it is a discount rate in the 40% range.

The disliking of the prices charged is a much deeper subject than you see on the surface. For example. My "break even" cost is anywhere from $17,000 to $21,000 per month. Yes, I need to see around $21,000 before I, the owner, gets a single penny out of the shop. But truth be told, shops really are not looking for the customer that works on his own cars, we seek the guy that counts on us to keep him on the road and able to get to work and buy groceries and run the kids to places and use the car for vacations and emergancies. So, you see, without that local garage the people of the world would have no choice but to ride a horse and walk...or fix it themselves. (I'd love seeing someone try to repair some of todays computer management systems. And I haven't even touched on what the cst of tools, equipment and information costs. My scanner costs over $2500 a year to keep updated. Plus the other equipment needs updating too. All at a large cost. Always remember that no matter what the job someone does there really is a need. You be the judge just how important he is to your every day life. If you don't need him then don't pay for the service but if he is needed either pay or seek someone that does not charge as much. And remember, you get what you pay for.

[Captain Neon]

I'm not in complete agreement with that adage. Oftentimes, one gets less than what he paid for. May I amend what you said? "You never get more than you pay for."

It is always a matter of finding the guy who does good work at a good price. I think there are too many people in all sorts of service work that do not give their customers what they are being charged for.

A lot of businesses operate on a reputation that they no longer deserve and rely on a stable customer base that never considers going some where else. In an area that has a lot of new people coming to town a lot of businesses assume that no matter how well they treat a new customer they are unlikely to see them again so they simply rip everyone off, and chuckle about those foolish enough to return.

I've been told by a lot of locals that the best shops in my area do not need to advertise because word of mouth keeps them in business, and to beware of the shops that spend a lot of money on advertising. They have few return customers.

[Norm's Coupe]

Ben,

I can understand where you are coming from. Its real hard to look at the price of a part, then pay more for the part if you have some shop buy and put it in for you. If its something for my P15 I will normally fix it myself because it doesn't matter how long I take to do it. Then I also save money doing it, both on labor and parts. However, if its something wrong with one of our everyday cars I just take it to the shop and tell them to fix it. I already know whats wrong with it when I do that, but I also know it will take me longer to do the job. So........in the long run, its cheaper to pay them anywhere from 3 to 4 times the cost of the part to get it done now. Then my time is free to do other things that I must do. I won't even change the oil in our modern cars. I take it to the shop and have them do it. Most shops around here only charge between $20 and $30 for an oil change. Again, it saves my time, plus I don't have to waste time taking the old used oil to the hazardous waste dump to dump it. Our garbage collectors won't take used oil. You have to take it to the dump yourself.

Sometimes if you have a good relationship with a shop or two, it also helps getting things done free or next to nothing too. As an example, while on a trip a couple of years ago I noticed a new rattle in car when we were about 700 miles away from home. Thought it was coming from under the hood, but everything looked okay there. Finally traced it to the exhaust system. Traced the noise to the heat shield of the converter, so I just forgot about it and said it can wait until we get home. Took the car to the shop when we got home and told them what I thought was wrong. Went back to pick up the car in the afternoon and they said a clamp that held the heat shield had evidently rusted and they replaced it. After just talking for a few minutes I wanted to get going and ask for my bill. He said don't worry about it, it's on the house. Wouldn't even let me pay for the clamp.

Another time recently my wife insisted she wanted a tune up on her Kia. Told her it didn't need one. But.......she kept bugging me because the owners manual says you have to check it for a tune up at X number of miles, so called the shop to set up an appointment. The owner of the shop said that car runs great, it doesn't need a tune up, its a waste of money. Explained to him I knew that, but the wife wants a tune up. So........he said well ok, bring it in and will put it on the computer. I did and he did and the car didn't need a tune up. He only charged me $20 for the computer time. Dealer price for that check up, with a tune up was about $350 to $400 because I checked prices. And, you could bet your bottom dollar if I had taken it to the dealer they would have said the car needed a tuneup even though it didn't. By the way the following month the car passed the emission test with flying colors, so it didn't need any work.

So........again, sometimes it pays to pay a little more to get things done. If you have a good independent shop they will also save you money sometimes, if they can.

This shop is not the same one who helped me with rebuilding the engine in my coupe. However, its closer to me and he also works on old cars too. They did rebuild the master cylinder in my P15 back in 95 when I couldn't get it out, even used my parts. He's usually got an old car or two sitting around for repair, plus he's now building his own 53 Chevy Pickup. Actually, I've know the people at this shop for about 35 years, thats much longer than the one who helped with rebuilding my P15 engine. You just need to find a shop you can trust that does good work, then it's worth the cost.

The last time my van was in the shop was a few months ago for an alternator. I could have bought an alternator for about $100 or so. However, I took it in and paid about $250 or $280 (don't remember exactly) and knew it was going to cost that to get it done. Again though, it was worth it because I didn't have to take the time to do it.