uhh..HOW TO REMOVE FREEZE PLUGS??????????

[Powerhouse]

I am going to give the block a good flush because of the broken studs recently drilled out....and just because it probably needs it. Anyway...how the heck do ya get the dang freeze out/Welch plugs:confused: out?

[Jerry Roberts]

Sometimes you can drill a hole in the center for a stout sheet metal screw , install the screw part way and then pull on the screw head with a claw hammer .

[Powerhouse]

ahhh..i'll try it...thanks.

[40phil41]

I just took a sharp centre punch and made a hole in them and then inserted a small screwdriver and twisted them out.

Phil

[grey beard]

Your biggest screwdriver and a BFH . . . . . . (big fat hammer, what else?)

[PatS....]

Sometimes you can drill a hole in the center for a stout sheet metal screw , install the screw part way and then pull on the screw head with a claw hammer .

That's how I did mine...how about some tricks on replacing them so they won't leak later???

[randroid]

Gents,

You're pulling them the hard way; I had Greg Fischer of Longmont Machine charge me $2700 for the machine work and he never even boiled the block. Because of that simple oversight two of the original plugs blew out within 500 miles and a third let go not too much longer. I've since replaced the others.

I wonder if he bothered installing the new water tube I handed him? If you ever want machine work done just North of Denver guess where I won't send you?

The engine runs so smoothly that I have little doubt he did the 1/2 gram balancing I paid him to do, ergo I paid for the job, but I will always have an uneasy feeling whenever I drive it that I should boil it out. What's the best way to do that without pulling the engine?

-Randy

[grey beard]

I did a major overhaul on my B1B in the chassis - what sort of became an evolutionary process where one thing led to another. With the head, distribution tube and water pump removed, I popped out all the block core plugs and the petcock. Then I dug, pried, blew and flushed the entire water jacket within an inch of its life until I was satisfied it was entirely clean. One of the things I used was a compressed air blow gun with 18 inches of bendable copper tubing for a snout, that I could feed down into every water jacket passage, head bolt hole and crevice.

What I discovered in this process was that over the years much dirt and debri had entered the system from many sources, and it all settled in the lowest part of the water jacket on the driver's side behind the distributor and petcock area. When I first pulled the cock, nothing came out. Had to dig around that area with pieces of mechanics' wire to get it to begin to drain.

The last trick I used to clean things up inside the water jacket - since I did not have the block boiled - was to use a two-foot length of old speedometer cable with a frayed end on my cordless drill. This worked as a sort of roto rooter and polisher - knocked a lot of nasty stuff loose. Now I'm satisfied that the entrire cooling system inside the block is "brand splinter new"" clean.

To install block plugs so they will never pop out, first you must get that little lip edge on which they sit in the block, itself, super clean and free from all scale and dirt. If you don't observe this important step, the plug will not be able to go the whole way into the opening where it must expand, if it is going to stay put. I used number one hardening Permatex - that nasty dark brown stuff in a tube - and buttered up the lip on the block all 360 degrees around each hole, then put the plugs into each hole and used a one inch brass drift and a heavy hammer to expand them in place. They'll be there until the next overhaul - or when they rust out - whichever comes first after my funeral.

Wish I could have found brass block plugs. They're really "forever!":)

[John Mulders]

most logical for me would be:

put water in the block, put the block in the freezer or outside in the winter and they should popout

never have been able to test, temp here is always around 90F and my freezer is way too smal

[james curl]

John, they are not freeze plugs to prevent the block from breaking when the water freezes but casting core holes that allow the sand core to remain in place during the casting process. Then the sand is removed through all of the holes that make up the water jacket.

[Joe Flanagan]

The original block in my 49 Special Deluxe had two freeze plugs blown out (meaning convex) AND the block was cracked for about 9 inches front to back just under the head. So there is proof that they won't keep the block from cracking. Also, I had my block hot-tanked (don't know if it's the same thing as boiled) and while it came out pretty clean, I still got loads of junk out of the water jackets. I did like greybeard and dug around at the bottom next to the cylinders and it surprised me how I kept getting stuff to come out. I didn't do all the clever things that greybeard thought of but I did shoot water at high pressure in every different direction I could and I turned the block every which way so I could get it all. I also used black Permatex around the rim of the freeze plug holes. Kind of makes you think of all the stuff that could go wrong with a 60 year old rebuilt engine. Who knows what's going to happen when I turn the key?

[Powerhouse]

What I discovered in this process was that over the years much dirt and debri had entered the system from many sources, and it all settled in the lowest part of the water jacket on the driver's side behind the distributor and petcock area. When I first pulled the cock, nothing came out. Had to dig around that area with pieces of mechanics' wire to get it to begin to drain.

Thanks for the great advice everyone...I really appreciate it. Don't get me wrong...but did anyone else get a chuckle at the second to last sentance above? No offense to you Grey beard.

[John Mulders]

John, they are not freeze plugs to prevent the block from breaking when the water freezes but casting core holes that allow the sand core to remain in place during the casting process. Then the sand is removed through all of the holes that make up the water jacket.

oops, thanks for explaining !

Really thought it was intended for that to prevent freezing damage.

So why is it called a freeze plug and not a cast plug?

John

[Joe Flanagan]

That's a good question. Inquiring minds want to know.

[Don Coatney]

Actually it is called a "WELSH" plug not a freeze plug.

[grey beard]

Speaking of the which - welsh plugs that is, here's proof that they really ARE core plugs. Couple years back, GM in its wisdom pulled the major bucks out of Olds Division and created Saturn - an all-new division that had lots of leeway for new engineering and R&D. That new division came up with a totally new way of casting engine blocks without sand - by using styrofoam molds, for goodness sake.

The stuff vaporized instantly when the castings were poured, but lasted long enough to do two things - its job as a form for the block mold, and to leave an impression on the casting of the original styrofoam. This new process worked so good that I believe all GM division blocks are now made with this process. Proof is in the exterior block finish - looks exactly like styrofoam - AND there are no longer any welsh plugs in these blocks. Sorta' neat, I think.

[Don Coatney]

Speaking of the which - welsh plugs that is, here's proof that they really ARE core plugs. Couple years back, GM in its wisdom pulled the major bucks out of Olds Division and created Saturn - an all-new division that had lots of leeway for new engineering and R&D. That new division came up with a totally new way of casting engine blocks without sand - by using styrofoam molds, for goodness sake.

The stuff vaporized instantly when the castings were poured, but lasted long enough to do two things - its job as a form for the block mold, and to leave an impression on the casting of the original styrofoam. This new process worked so good that I believe all GM division blocks are now made with this process. Proof is in the exterior block finish - looks exactly like styrofoam - AND there are no longer any welsh plugs in these blocks. Sorta' neat, I think.

Interesting process but how will the folks wanting to repair these cars in 60 years clean the slime and rust out of the blocks?

[Powerhouse]

60 years from now...those cars won't be able to be restored..they'll fall apart in 20.

[Young Ed]

Hey I'm already contemplating a resto for my 94 dakota!

[Joe Flanagan]

So, Shel, what was the thing in your engine?

[Dodgeb4ya]

I`ve always used brass 1-5/8" soft plugs in all my flathead rebuilds. They are forever. Just clean the soft plug (Welch) plug recess and check for pitting too. Bob

[Powerhouse]

ok...got them out...was easy with a drill and a large screwdriver. I took out the generator, starter, distributor, oil filter, and oil fill tube to make it easier. I had a lot of buildup in the plug by the drain cock. Man it was solid. Not anymore...I guess that's why the drain only trickled when It was open. Next step is to put the oil fill tube back and plugs up the distrib hole and starter hole. AND then I get the hose...should be fun....considering the car is in my garage. It's close to freezing outside...I hope this works.

[BobT-47P15]

I think that T shaped item looks a bit like the key on a can of coffee, or

a can of Spam...... :)