6 volt Capacitor Discharge Ignition

[Loren]

Years ago I drove a 2 stroke SAAB 93f to work everyday. The oil was mixed with the fuel and being a 2 cycle it fired the spark plugs twice as often as a 4 cycle engine. So anything that promised better plug and point life was worth investigating. At the time there was several CD ignition boxes on the market, with the Delta Mark Ten being the most successful. At their high point they employed 500 people in Grand Junction, CO. Of course later on with emission controls their market dried up and the owner retired. Delta made their boxes fully assembled or as a kit and sold them under the Archer and Heathkit brands besides their own name. I got the full story from a fellow who had built many of them and now repairs them. There are two models the one with a switch to convert the system back to the Kettering ignition without changing wires was called the “B” model and only came in 12 volt.

My Plymouths are 6 volt and I have never seen a compelling need to change them to 12 volt. Well maintained a 6 volt system works just fine for me. Your mileage may vary of course. So because nos point sets are running out, I decided I wanted a Delta Mark Ten to lengthen the life of my plugs and points. Just try and find one in 6 volt! If you do find one it might not be Positive ground, so that means you need my guy to switch it over. Well I did in fact come up with two for my cars and I can tell you it was an adventure!

Since Delta Products went out of business decades ago, the technology in them has not progressed at all. It seems there are other people making CDI boxes for racing and specialty applications. I kept hearing about a fellow in Canada whose Dad had patented the first CDI. He makes them as a cottage industry for the collector car guys ( 4 cylinder Porsche guys love them ) and he has never stopped improving them. Fred Winterburn is his name and he seems to be a really nice guy. According to him the 6 volt version just got the latest improvements. One thing I like about them is the switch which is 3 position CD-on, off, Kettering-on. No wire changes.

Fred’s research found that by limiting the voltage sent to the coil he could get all the current to jump the spark plug gap instead of spilling out everywhere else. I am no engineer so I have to take his word for it. Anyway after reading what the Porsche guys had to say and a few others plus his website I bit the bullet and ordered two of them. He’s building them right now and will ship them at the end of the month.

I have one of Langdon’s Stove Bolt ignitions but I’m not going to convert my cars to 12 volts to use it. I understand they are not being made anymore. HEI maybe very good but I think the Winterburn system has some better features, such as the voltage limiting circuitry and the fact you don’t have to re-engineer the car around the ignition. Of course in a post-apocalyptic world after an electro-magnetic pulse the HEIs will be toast along with the alternators powering them. My tube radio, generator, 6 volt Plymouth will likely run fine. lol

More to come.

[LazyK]

Looking forward to your review.

[desoto1939]

Loren: as you stated about the diminishing of quality ignition parts such as points, condensers, caps, rotors for our cars this is why I try to keep a good supply of the older original Autolite parts in my parts cabinet for my 1939 Desoto.

 

Also be aware that even getting the rubber cups for our wheel cylinders is even getting harder to purchase. I went to my local NAPA store and needed 1 3/8 rubber cups. They did a search and only could come up with a total of 7 from another NAPA store in the area.  They had them delivered to their store and I had them by that afternoon.

Yes even NAPA is having issues with their old stock.

 

So, i recommend that if you have an older antique car/truck, MC or what ever that you start to prepare for the future NOW. The future is coming faster than you think.  I attend several of the Major Car Shows and swap meet here in eastern PA, Carlise, Macungie and even Hershey in the fall.  I am seeing less and less of these early ignition parts on the tables.  The older guys that carried these items are dying and the next generation is not selling these items.  Also people might think about getting a used condenser testing tool just to see what microfarids they are getting in their condensers. 

 

Also suggest that you keep at least one dist cap, rotor, point set and condenser in your truck as a spare and even a complete breaker plate assembly incase of an emergency repair on the road. Even a spare 6 volt generic coil as a spare that can be wired to get you home and back on the road.  This is another reason to have an electric fuel pump on your car.  So many small items to think about, but we all need to be prepared.

 

It is so important now because the old tried and true parts suppliers such as NAPA   might not have these parts and or might now be able to order in the parts.

 

Rich Hartung

[Sniper]

You can still get new production points but I have found the rubbing block wears extremely fast.

[Loren]

Hi Rich,

point taken on replacement parts. I used use a lot of Mallory Ignition parts, however they have fallen off and certain things you just can’t get anymore. At one time ( when they were in Carson City ) I used to get them to make custom distributors for me, those days are long gone.

I bought a Dyna-Flyte dual point breaker plate for my Plymouth because it uses a more common Mopar V8 point set. So I have been thinking ahead.

One of the main complaints I have about electronics is they are voltage sensitive. Drop the voltage too much and it either fries the electronics or they just don’t work.

If you’re committed to 6 volt, you don’t have very far to fall when it comes to voltage drops . lol

Fred Winterburn’s CDI will fire the plugs at full power with voltage as low as 3.5 volts. Also he makes one unit and it doesn’t care if the power is positive or negative. I have no idea how he does it but I like it.

[JohnS48plm]

I ran a Delta Mark 10 that came as a kit. I ran it on a Dodge Dart 273 V8. It ran well and I still have it in a box somewhere in the basement.

[Loren]

On 1/15/2024 at 7:18 PM, JohnS48plm said:

I ran a Delta Mark 10 that came as a kit. I ran it on a Dodge Dart 273 V8. It ran well and I still have it in a box somewhere in the basement.

As I said before I have two Delta Mark Tens on my 6 volt cars. They work as expected. But they are very very rare and if you find a negative ground version you have to have it changed to positive ground. I wasn’t sure if it would work but I put an Overdrive transmission in my Business Coupe and it worked just fine. The ignition interrupt works imperceptibly.

If someone can’t find a part you are talking about, why even mention it?

So when I discovered the Winterburn CDI, I thought I would share. I have not yet received it from Fred but I am excited about it.