Lloyd Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 I acquired an R6 overdrive and when I removed the drain plug from the overdrive unit I could see a small piece of metal loose inside. I was able to remove it with a magnet, its a small cylinder shaped like a roller bearing or something, I included a pic of it beside a quarter. Trying to shift thru the gears on the OD and I cannot get it to go into reverse. The picture below showing the top of the transmission shows a small button from the overdrive unit pushing against the back end of the first and reverse shifting bar. This button is what is preventing the shifting bar from going into reverse. It needs to retract into the OD unit so the shifting bar can slide back and engage reverse. But it wont. Ive spun the input shaft while trying to shift, engaged and disengaged the OD lever but reverse is a dead stop. Metal against metal feels like. If anyone that recognizes the small piece that fell out could chime in and let me know what it is and does. Also looks like I may have to disassemble the OD unit to put it back in. I see the four bolts holding the OD unit to the main body, can I remove these bolts and split the two or will I need to disassemble the main unit as well. I read on a previous post that literature concerning the R6 OD is not available and I'm finding that to be true. An exploded parts diagram would be very helpful. Thanks, Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg g Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 The later ones need to be locked out of OD position via the cable to allow reverse to work? Don't know it that might be the problem. Your piece looks like a detent keeper or retaining piece rather than a bearing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted March 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 8 minutes ago, greg g said: The later ones need to be locked out of OD position via the cable to allow reverse to work? Don't know it that might be the problem. Your piece looks like a detent keeper or retaining piece rather than a bearing. Hey Greg, thanks for chiming in. I did move the OD lever although not sure which way locks in the OD or disengages it. Since its a pull I am guessing the lever forward engages and back disengages. But it certainly could be a detent keeper or retaining piece. Looks like I am going to have to disassemble. Just not sure where to start, be nice if I dont have to take the trans apart, just split the two and deal with the OD unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 Looks like a roller bearing to me. if so not so good...will of course have to come apart. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted March 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 Yeah, I see me getting into it. Not sure where or how to start and keep from breaking anything. Dont think I can get a replacement at AutoZone. I do have an exploded view of an R10, maybe an R6 is close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plyroadking Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 Looks like one of the 10 or 12 spragg clutch rollers or the input to main shaft bearing. Doubtful that it's the bearing as there's no way for it to come out with out disassembling the transmission. I'll check for a diagram, if I nor anyone else has one I can disassemble one of mine and post pictures how to get to the spragg clutch. The spragg clutch acts like a ratchet. There is a spring loaded retainer that keeps the rollers on a cylinder that has a ramp for each roller. When you accelerate while the overdrive lever is engaged (but you're not in overdrive) the rollers roll up the ramps, they "expand" till they make contact with the drum on the output shaft. They "lock" the drum and main shaft together and transfer the rotation to your driveshaft. When you decelerate until the governor drops you out of overdrive you go into "freewheeling" the driveshaft is spinning faster than the engine. The spring return of the roller's retainer, rolls the rollers down the ramps and there is no locked connection between the output shaft and the main shaft of the transmission. If you rev the engine up faster than the driveshaft rpms, to rollers roll up the ramp again and contact the drum. I imagine that your retainer is worn, or when it was last assembled one fell out and was not noticed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted March 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 (edited) Hey Andy, Thanks, I just PM'd you asking for some advice. It would help a lot if I had a diagram. Is an R6 anything like an R10 - I have a diagram on that one. Why can't I get it in reverse? If I remove the four bolts from the main body to the OD unit can I pull the half's apart without completely disassembling the entire transmission? Work on just the OD unit then slide them back together?? Edited March 31, 2017 by Lloyd Add content Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plyroadking Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 I found some exploded views, if you pm me your email I'll send them along, they're too big to load here. I'm not certain if you have to pull the transmission apart. R10s have the two bolts in the mid plate that thread into the overdrive case and the only way to get to them is to pull the transmission case. Worst case all you'll have to do is pull the shift forks. The main shaft and gears should all pull out of the transmission without any more transmission disassembly. They have a reverse lockout plunger that runs from the shift fork to the overdrive to take it out of overdrive if you shift into reverse. The overdrive can not engaged while you're backing up or you'd destroy it. I imagine that one of your rollers has jammed up something inside and it's keeping you from going into reverse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverdome Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 1 hour ago, plyroadking said: I found some exploded views, if you pm me your email I'll send them along, they're too big to load here. I'm not certain if you have to pull the transmission apart. R10s have the two bolts in the mid plate that thread into the overdrive case and the only way to get to them is to pull the transmission case. Worst case all you'll have to do is pull the shift forks. The main shaft and gears should all pull out of the transmission without any more transmission disassembly. They have a reverse lockout plunger that runs from the shift fork to the overdrive to take it out of overdrive if you shift into reverse. The overdrive can not engaged while you're backing up or you'd destroy it. I imagine that one of your rollers has jammed up something inside and it's keeping you from going into reverse. I'll bet there is someone on here that can reduce the file size to fit to this format. It would be a nice tech item to have that exploded view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted March 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 (edited) Well I got it apart, wasn't to bad at all. Funny thing is I found another roller in it beside the speedo gear. I'm thinking Chrysler may have decided to throw a couple extra in there in case someone might need them... But they look like the Free Wheel Rollers - in fact they are identical. But the Roller Retainer had everyone of them in it. 12 total. Now I have 14 - 2 extra. Still trying to figure out the no-reverse problem. Looks like the Reverse Lock-Up Plunger is just to long. I've included some more pics. The plunger itself, the plunger in the housing in both the in and out positions - you can see when the plunger is in you have 1-1/2" sticking out, when the plunger is out you have 2". Then a pic of the shifting bar in 3rd gear and a pic of reverse gear with the plunger in. In the reverse gear with the plunger in you can see I have only 1" clearance between the edge of the case and the shifting bar. However in the 2nd pic with the plunger in I have 1-1/2".. A 1/2" to long which is preventing the shifting bar from going into reverse. Only ideas I can come up with is since there was some extra parts in the case its obvious someone was in there. Maybe they swapped the Lock-Out Plunger with another one and the wrong one?? Does anyone know if this part was different between years? I believe this is a 1938 OD mechanical only - w/o any solenoid. Im thinking of taking apart the control linkage and shifting arm inside the case - what pushes against the Lock-Out Plunger just to see if it may be binding but from what I can see its working fine. Cant go down any further than what it is to allow the plunger to retract more. Only other thing is cut a notch in the shifting bar to allow for the 1/2" or shorten the plunger bar. - Last two options. I dont really like doing that unless I can find out its the wrong piece for this OD unit.. Edited March 31, 2017 by Lloyd Edit text Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike36 Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 I too have a R6 and would like to see your exploded view. Hope you can get it on here. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted March 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 (edited) This is what Andy sent me: BTW: If you get a Motors Manual - try eBay - for the year of your trans it should have this info in it.. Edited March 31, 2017 by Lloyd Add text Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted April 1, 2017 Report Share Posted April 1, 2017 Pics above look like of a R-7 OD unit with the short solenoid. The R-6 is OD centrifugally engaged... no solenoid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted April 1, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2017 Yep, I think your right but the R6 did incorporate a solenoid I believe in 1939 although it was not long after - 1940 as I recall that the R7 took its place. The book did say that the steps for working on either OD would be nearly identical as the photos Andy depicted. But in case anyone would like to see it, here is a pic of the R6 - no solenoid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted April 1, 2017 Report Share Posted April 1, 2017 My National Service book shows most all the OD's from 1936-48. It also shows 1937-38 R-6's but there are so many models of it that I cannot figure them out plus not too good of service pictures. It does say how to adjust the cut in/out for the OD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted April 1, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2017 Adjustment of the cut in/out for an R6 would be interesting. After some research I found out that the pics Andy sent me are of a semi-electric OD from 1939-40. I believe this would be the R6 with a solenoid. So perhaps the R7 started in 41. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted April 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 (edited) Got the R6 back together and installed, wasn't to bad. I ended up making a reverse lock-up plunger from a 3/8 X 6 inch #8 bolt. So I still have the original and was able to make this one about 1/2 inch shorter. Its now shifting thru all the gears although I have no idea why the one that was in it seemed to be to long. Now I am trying to hook up the OD cable. The linkage for the OD is shown in the pic at the lower right, small lever with a hole in it. Seems I'm missing an attachment piece that goes thru that linkage arm and secures the cable. I do not have this piece. Does anyone have a pic of this thing I could look at or maybe a fabricated one? Edited April 7, 2017 by Lloyd edit text Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Ed Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 My photobucket account isn't cooperating to see if I have a picture. However from memory its a bolt with a small shoulder and then a hole drilled through it for the cable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted April 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 Hey Ed, thanks. I was just searching previous posts. Thats certainly a thought. It's a big hole, didnt measure it but I would guess 1/2". But I guess you could use a bolt with a hole drilled in it, then a couple flat washers on each side of the cable and a nut to squeeze it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plyroadking Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 It's supposed to be a stepped washer, then the bolt with the hole drilled through and a washer on the back side to keep it all together. This allows it to rotate, I can take a picture of one in an hour or two when I get home Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted April 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 Hey Andy. That ain't good news. Makes sense having to rotate, hadn't thought about that. But how do I make a stepped washer? if you can post a pic it would help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plyroadking Posted April 8, 2017 Report Share Posted April 8, 2017 (edited) Sorry it took so long, here's a picture of one from a R10. I'm missing about half a dozen of them and was going to have some made. Edited April 8, 2017 by plyroadking Forgot to attach picture Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plyroadking Posted April 8, 2017 Report Share Posted April 8, 2017 Here's one off of a R7, it had a cable that was attached to a threaded rod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted April 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2017 Hey Andy, Thanks for the pics. Thats a big help. I've was just searching the internet for a bushing. Looks like the hole in the linkage arm is about 1/2" ID although I believe I would need a fairly snug fit into the linkage arm so the bolt would spin in the bushing and not the bushing spin in the linkage arm. The first one from an R10 will be the easiest. I'm guessing the cable goes thru the hole in the bolt and when you tighten the nut it captures the cable. Seems like it may bend the heck out of the cable where/if it would try and pull thru the bushing. May have to try a washer on each side of the hole in the bolt or something to try and prevent that. The second one for the R7 would give an adjustment with the rod but to get those parts would be hard to get. Took me almost 3 years to find an R6 I could get. Can't imagine trying to find the linkage and connections for an R7. I'll see if I can get something together like the R10 connection. Plus I will need to fabricate a cable clamp and bracket somewhere near the linkage arm. The cable clamp and bracket should not be to hard to make but finding the bushing for the linkage arm is something else. I was looking at bronze shouldered bushings, even oil-lite.. I figure the bronze will wear out first before the linkage arm. Not sure if I'm over-thinking it.. Thanks again for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plyroadking Posted April 8, 2017 Report Share Posted April 8, 2017 It does bend the end of the cable a little, I've had the same cable in my car for years and it's been through hundreds of installations and removals of transmissions. It's a close tolerance between the bolt and the inner diameter of the washer. I would imagine you could make your own spacers, I'll dig around and see how many I can come up with. I'll also have to measure to verify that an R10 washer will work on an R6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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