Mopar 833 OD Behind a 218....Who's Got One?? Give Up The Info!!!

[BloodyKnuckles]

So, I have an 833 that I was planning on using for another project but I have decided on a different route for that one. Well now I have a nice 833 with the 4th gear OD and I need OD now that my original OD failed on me.

So what would be involved in swaping in this trans?

I would love as much info as possible as I have a close friend with the same trans and a need for one in his '56 Dodge Panel.

Thanks alot!!!

BloodyKnuckles

[james curl]

Which bolt pattern does your 833 have. Chevrolet used them in the vans and pick ups in the late 70's early 80's. Some of them have the MoPar bolt pattern and some have the GM bolt pattern. I just saw an article where they were putting one in a early chevy pick up and now I cannot find the article. If yours has the MoPar pattern you can probably modify your bell housing to accept it. If yours has the chevy pattern then you will need the pilot shaft retainer from a MoPar 833 or you will have to enlarge the hole in the bell housing. The article was either in the latest copy of Classic Truck or Custom Classic Truck. You might find the article on line and it has the part number for the pilot shaft retainer.

[greg g]

I had loked into that some time ago and found a website that detailed putting one behind a flathead 6 in a pickup or service bodied truck. I had it book marked on an older computor. Look for Brians Power Giant on the web. I looked like a simple mater of relocating the top mounting holes and adding some to the bottom of the casting for the lowers. There was some discusion regarding the diameter of the input shaft bearing retainer, apparently there were several sizes used. I seem to remember 4 1/4 or 4 5/8 being the one needed. There is also a choice between alumium and cast and short and long tailshafts. You will need to make different arrangments for a parking brake if you need that kinda thing for safety inspection. And be sure to get the shifter that came them, as the OD gear was put where this was as they retained the 1 to 1 4th gear. the shifter made the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 3rd, shift sequence work. GM used them as well and they ca be found in Chevy light duty vans and pickups withthe 6 cylinder application.

You may need to fab up a rear cross member, and of course modify a drive shaft.

If I remember the power giant site mentioned either machining the bearing retainer to match the flatty bell housing, or opening up the hole in the bellhousing to accept the trans, which ever was easier. I suppose if you did the mod to the trans, you could always go back to a stock trans if you or the next guy wanted to. If you open up the bellhousing you stuck or would need to hut up another bell, if ever you wanted to back to stock.

There was also an article about them in MOPAR muscle mag on line.

Here is some stuff

http://www.slantsix.org/articles/4-speeds/ODA833fourspeed1.htm

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/drivetrain/40618_a_833_manual_transmission_swap/index.html

http://www.classicjunkyard.com/new_process_a833.htm

no personal experience, so hope the above info gives you some insight.

[Frank Elder]

How about the getrag 6 speed that goes behind the the viper motor

[james curl]

The May 2009 issue of custom classic trucks has an article about both the MoPar case and the Chevy case as well as the pilot shaft bearing retainer difference with a part number for the smaller dia. one. Google new process 833 transmission and scroll down to the May 2009 Custom Classic Truck article and read the differences.

[thrashingcows]

Well I have a bit of knowledge when it comes to the 833's and 833OD's.

There were 3 different sizes of bearing retainers used on the 833's.

The smallest was the 4 1/4, and was generally used on the earlier trannies, and the 23 spline 833 from 65-87 and was used on SB and 383/400 engine cars.

Then there was the bigger 4 5/8 bearing retainer. This was mainly used on the 18 spline "Hemi" tranny. This tranny was used on most 440/426 applications from 65-71.

Then when they went to the 833 OD tranny, which was the exact same casting as the earlier trannies but was generally an aluminum body and cast tailshaft, and had the big 5 1/4 bearing retainer.

Now you can use the 4 5/8 bearing retainer as a direct bolt on replacement for the larger 5 1/4. It is very close but the bearing retainer should fit and bolt up to the housing and seal everything up. This way you can might no need to machine the bellhousing or bearing retainer to fit? Might double check the input shaft size though, I have a vague recolection that the 18 spline tranny input shaft was larger then the 23 spline? Will have to look this up.

Now with the 833's there were three different tailshafts. There was the long tailshaft and it could have the mounting pads for the shifter either close up by the body, or at the back of the the tailshaft, or could have both. If it was a dual pattern tailshaft generally only one of the mounting locations would be threaded. This longer one was generally used in all B/C/E and truck/van conbos from 65-87.

The other tailshaft was a shorty, used mianly in A/F/M body cars. and has the short tailshaft with the shifter mounting pad located midway on the tailshaft.

This is the tranny I plan on using in Fernando eventually. I hope to be able to adapt it fairly easily.

[kencombs]

I haven't done it yet but have most of the parts and plan to do so in my 56 pickup.. I am using an OD833 from a late 70s van with slant 6. The clutch housing is a 59/60 Dodge truck which will require changing the crossmember to the later style. Also uses a hydraulic clutch which I wanted anyway. The hole for the main drive gear bearing retainer is the correct size, But the hole pattern is not. Will require welding 'humps' on the housing to extend far enough to drill/tap new holes. The original housing is MUCH smaller than this and would not work without an adapter plate. I don't think the smaller bearing retainer can be swapped as the bearing for the OD is larger due to the load added when in OD.

I think one could use the T5 adapters with a Chevy pattern 833 as long as the pilot hole could be adapted.

[wayfarer]

The easiest way to mount the A-833 is to find a 6-cyl bellhousing-flywheel-starter from the 59-60 era (Later units may be the same, I am not positive) These bells have a near proper depth and the 'hole' is close for the O/D bearing retainer.

Not too long ago some here posted some pics of this bell as well as the A-833sitting on it. Come on, fess up, give us a link....

The other option is to use an adapter and mount the post-63 smallblock bellhousing. Keep in mind that this then requires that the flywheel match the bellhousing (130 vs 143 vs 172 teeth). You will also need to use the late 12V starter. An early wheel can be used if a late ring gear is installed.

One other note to keep in mind is that there are 4 different front bearing retainer diameters and the bellhousing should be matched to the trans. The OD trans has the largest retainer diameter.

.

[BloodyKnuckles]

Wayfarer, I didn't realize that was you on the other board. Thank you so much for all the info.

So you don't think the stock '51 Plymouth bellhousing will work?

BloodyKnuckles

[greg g]

I think that that info was on an AOL hometown site and all of those have been shut down by AOL.

[thrashingcows]

I don't think the smaller bearing retainer can be swapped as the bearing for the OD is larger due to the load added when in OD.

Yup can be done.

A friend of mine has done this with an 833OD behind a 440/6bbl roadrunner, and another did it behind a 426Hemi ina charger. They took the 4 5/8 and swapped it for the 5 1/4 bearing retainer. There was just enough material for the bearing retainer to cover and seal everything, and the bolt pattern was the same too. This way they didn't have to change out their original bellhousings.

[wayfarer]

Wayfarer, I didn't realize that was you on the other board. Thank you so much for all the info.

So you don't think the stock '51 Plymouth bellhousing will work?

BloodyKnuckles

The single determining factor for this is the depth of the bellhousing, or, comparing the length of one input shaft against the other. The A-833 has a fairly long shaft but some of the early trans are even longer. If the A-833 is longer than the stock 51 then it would be easy to add something to the face of the bell to take up space or, in some cases, snip off the end of the A-833 input. The next qualifier is where the splines locate in relation to the hub of the disc.

If you can get some measurements from the 51 bell we can make a better assessment of the fitment. Let me know.

Gary

[wilmot andy]

I just sold my a833 OD trans, the aluminum one with OD. It had the IBR changed out from the 5 1/4 to the 4.8", so it would fit the scattershield for my BB. It was used behind a BB before that with the smaller bearing and was stomped on pretty hard, no problems even with the OD gear. If you need any parts or questions, the guy to talk to is Jaime Passon from Passon Performance, he knows everything about 833's, rebuilds and sells them.

[thrashingcows]

I just sold my a833 OD trans, the aluminum one with OD. It had the IBR changed out from the 5 1/4 to the 4.8", so it would fit the scattershield for my BB. It was used behind a BB before that with the smaller bearing and was stomped on pretty hard, no problems even with the OD gear. If you need any parts or questions, the guy to talk to is Jaime Passon from Passon Performance, he knows everything about 833's, rebuilds and sells them.

Lots of people think they can't handle a high HP motor...but they are the same tranny as the earlier cast iron 833's. Occasionally you'll see the aluminum case wear but even that is rare from what I've seen.

Thanks for the additional info Andy.