Dartgame Posted July 9 Report Posted July 9 I'm in the process of installing one of these manifolds and two B&B carter carbs. Anyone care to share their experience in setting one of these up using a car throttle linkage ? Quote
lostviking Posted July 9 Report Posted July 9 If I were you, I'd go direct to the source. George Asche is happy to talk on the phone and answer any questions. I can PM you his number, but I believe it's been shared by Tim Kingsbury in his BLOG. Quote
Dartgame Posted July 10 Author Report Posted July 10 I have a call into George. If anyone else has experience to share - please do so, thanks. Quote
Sniper Posted July 10 Report Posted July 10 I have that intake but I am using it for dual throttle body fuel injection and both shafts on my throttle body are linked together using my setup rather than the supplied linkage. so I can't really help with the Dual carburetor setup. Quote
Dartgame Posted July 10 Author Report Posted July 10 I've seen your pics Sniper - how's that going by the way, did you get it running ? Quote
Sniper Posted July 11 Report Posted July 11 3 hours ago, Dartgame said: how's that going by the way, did you get it running ? Not gonna talk about it, lol. I think I wiped a rod bearing on the original 218. Which means I need to get off my duff on the 230 I have been farting about with, Quote
Dartgame Posted July 11 Author Report Posted July 11 I've learned a few minor install tricks for this manifold. If using a stock exhaust manifold, (mine is split), you need to install the two long 3/8's bolts that go through the exhaust manifold before assembling the intake and exhaust manifolds together. Put some permatex number 2 on the thread of those bolts for sealing. They go into the water jacket. Leave the (4) 5/16" bolts that hold the manifolds together just snugged, while installing the assembled manifolds, use anti-sieze on two and permatex #2 on the other two - use new grade 8 bolts. 2 of these bolt holes are blind and the other two enter the intake runner. Tighten them last after all other fasteners are tight. Next, of the 4 studs that use heavy flat washers, the two on the ends of the intake flange (# 1 and #4) need to be installed before any other fasteners. Tight clearances for those two. Be sure to use the 4 brass washers and 4 cone shaped nuts on the exhaust manifold at either end of it. I used brass nuts and flat washers for the three remaining intake studs. Note that the FSM recommends 20 Lb-ft torque on all the fasteners. 1 Quote
Semmerling Posted July 12 Report Posted July 12 (edited) I can help you. That intake has a wider main shaft than the Asche intake. Based on my experience (written up recently) you may need more than George. More importantly your intake has no flexibility as to the distance the main rod can be set from carbs. Asche intakes can be drilled (if one does not ask George to do it, he may have a static jig) with some flexibility as to side-of-intake and distance and even height from the carb's own on-board throttle linkage. This can matter greatly. The Dodge Thickstun has fixed tabs limiting both the main shaft's height and distance to the carbs. This is not an issue IF the resulting throttle linkage is well thought through. The Carter B&Bs are a challenge setting up a linkage on because of the preloaded IDLE set. - Dimensions of the linkage set. The dimensions of the adjustable arm coming off of the throttle linkage main shaft and the piece representing the 2nd final arm-to-on-board carb's linkages is critical to applying uniform return spring values that can overcome B&B preload and get a repeatable full IDLE return. The larger the "bent knee" of those two pieces at IDLE set, the greater the spring's force is in getting to true IDLE set. Most of the people I talked to do not have it. It is why you see the few full set up we do see with multiple springs, all of that loading up the pedal. I spoke with a guy today that actually lifts the foot accelerator UP with his toe to get to 700rpm idle and has been driving with that for a while. - The arm coming off the main shaft that is the mount for the return spring(s) dimension and angle to spring at full IDLE set is critical - The Spring(s) weight and length is critical as is placement in regard to a balance on both carbs. George makes his own critical pieces (The two (2) final pieces that run from the on-main-shaft throttle arm to the carb's on-board throttle) and you will have to as well or at least account for proper length and FINE adjustment for both carbs. A great deal of energy is lost on lousy linkages, clevis is better than turn tabs as they allow for twice the rotation adjustment. The two off the main shaft throttle arm's height, if off the shelf, have real limitations as does not using a rotating bronze insert through that arms hole to support the spring. Etc. etc. etc. Can it all come together and run better than anything you have ever had, absolutely! Is it easy with Carter B&B and duals? That depends on understanding and creating a great linkage set. If you want to talk about it, easier than writing about it let me know and I'll get you my number. Edited July 12 by Semmerling Quote
greg g Posted July 14 Report Posted July 14 Here is a pic of my hardware store and go kart heim joints linkage for carter b1b one a vintage Fenton manifold. Stock bellcrank to fabricated pivot uprights secured by jam nuts. Going on 15 years. Nop, it ain't pretty, but it's pretty effective. Quote
rustyzman Posted July 27 Report Posted July 27 Not going to be of great help, but I did a Thickstun intake on my '54 last year while I rebult the engine and trans. Fair warning, My carb setup is very unconventional, but I went with a custom cable system that I made and did not use the shaft bosses on the intake. All the components are custom, and it works very smoothly. The cable is a generic motorcycle cable (read bicycle brake cable), but all other parts I machined and fabricated. I made the the remainder of the upper intake and all the flanges, brackets, etc. too. The carb is a Mikuni 44phh that I modified heavily to work and breathe properly with the 230. It's working at about 85% of really-good right now, but needs more finesse time to really get it tuned right. I still have to make the high idle cable lever system for the carb. This carb does not have a conventional choke/choke plates, so the enrichment and higher idle are achieved through a fuel enrichment/bypass valve. The high idle system will only be if I need RPM for something, like a future PTO, or just to make it work like it should. Sorry that last picture is sideways... The Thickstun manifold is very nicely made. I did also make some custom exhaust to intake flange stepped washers to get a good seal because of some thickness differences. It has dual Fenton style cast iron headers and a handmade stainless exhaust too. The NiCopp tubing is just a routing carrier for the cable sheathing. Both ends of the cable sheathes terminate in drilled and counterbored ball bearings so they can pivot smoothly as the throttle bellcranks go from one end or rotation, over center and to the other end of rotation without bending the cable itself against the end of the sheath. Maybe helps a bit? This was the most practical setup I found. It is the second iteration of it as well. The first was on the manifold side and looked really great, but it had more bends and was binding the cable a bit, so it got scrapped. Quote
Dartgame Posted July 31 Author Report Posted July 31 Rusty - Wow that's quite a set up for those carbs! thanks for posting. I got the linkage set from George a few days ago and am collecting the last bits needed to complete the installation. 1 Quote
Semmerling Posted August 3 Report Posted August 3 Rusty, I really enjoyed how you went about thinking through this linkage. Really excellent out of the box thinking. Super well done. 2 Quote
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