1st and 3rd Grinding

[Alexander]

Hi Folks

Kind of stumped here.  I switched out my Gyromatic for a manual 3 speed with Fluid drive.  Everything appears to be set up and adjusted correctly.  However no matter how I adjust the clutch 3rd gear will always grind when going from 2 to 3. Also when selecting 1st gear from a stop, I feel soft brief grind.  After careful evaluation It feels as if the clutch plate is every so slightly not full separating???   

I adjusted the clutch to the max but still have the grind.  Any thoughts? 

Thanks

 

Edited June 27, 2017 by Alexander

[Silverdome]

Possibly worn synchronizers in the tranny.

[Alexander]

its my understanding 1st and 3rd dont have Synchro?

[greg g]

With the car at rest and idling, clutch  pedal to the floor, briefly select second gear, then shift to first.  If the grind goes away or lessens, it indicates your synchros are worn or that the input shaft is still turning slightly because the clutch is not fully disengaged.  This usually comes from not having enough free play in the clutch linkage,and can be addressed by adjusting the linkage to be longer so it moves the throw bearing fork more.   You need the pedal to move about an inch before it starts moving linkage.  Also what is your idle rpm?

[greg g]

First and reverse are not synchronized.  Engaging second briefly engages seconds synchro which stops the rotation of the input shaft easing the shift.

Edited June 27, 2017 by greg g

[Alexander]

Greg Absolutely correct!  Going in to 2nd before selecting 1st does help.  I have been doing this trick for some time now.  

I am fairly certain the synchros are fine and that this is a clutch disengagement problem.  I have the clutch adjustment maxed but still feel the input spinning when slowly slecting 1st.  what else can I do to get more "throw" on the clutch?  is there somting i can shim?  Engine RPM is very low (~350)

 

[Dodgeb4ya]

Possibly an issue with the FD two pilot  bushings. They could cause the input shaft to keep turning.

 Did you lube them with some kind of grease?

Hopefully not. Only should use a very slight amount of thin oil on them if anything.

[Alexander]

I never greased the pilot bushing or ever touched them.  I welcome any other thoughts or ideas.  Thanks!

[Silverdome]

Worn bushing or shaft on clutch pivot. Or maybe a bent clutch fork.

[_shel_ny]

Is this a new problem with the same car that I sent you the transmission for several years ago?  What lube is in the transmission?

[P15-D24]

Syncro is bad. To confirm double clutch it and see if it stop grinding. 

[Alexander]

I appreciate all the feedback!

The original Gyromatic never worked so I swapped it out for a 3 speed and have this problem ever since.

 I am hesitated in believing its the syncro as 1st gear has no syncro.

Some how for some reason the input shaft is still turning even though at a stop and clutch is fully pressed. Maybe the car has the wrong clutch?  too thick? 

 

[dpollo]

I think you have two separate problems.  The first gear problem has been discussed pretty thoroughly.  As you have learned, first and reverse are not synchronized. You are sliding the same gear on the mainshaft back and forth.  With the car at rest, select reverse.  If it grinds, then you have a  clutch problem.   With the car in motion, it takes a bit of practice to select first, but it can be done,  ( I am sure someone out there has selected reverse too but it is not recommended)

The High gear shifts  are generally done with the car in motion and even with a worn synchronizer it should be possible to get a good shift if you take it slowly.   Annoying, but possible )   Sometimes the synchronizers do not work well with Hypoid Gear oil.  DodgeB4ya had a good discussion on oils some time ago.  Original oil was a 80-90 non hypoid gear oil.

[greg g]

Which begs the question what lubricant are you using? If you changed it recently and put in modern oil, brass and bronze parts associated with synchronizer parts, can be damaged by the new lubes.  If you did not refill with a gl 1 rated oil, find some and swap it out.  The friction reducing ingredients in new stuff not only cause wear, but also interfere with the synchros working properly.  It like putting car oil in a motorycle with a wet clutch.  Friction reducers cause the clutch to slip.