Overdrive trans question(s)

[pontiacguy]

Hello all, as my name suggests I am traditionally a Pontiac guy. I have searched this forum already and found a lot of good info, but Im having trouble getting an answer to my Overdrive trans dilema. Any help would be appreciated.

 

I had the opportunity to score a pretty solid 54 Plymouth Plaza (wagon) with the 230 and the 3 spd manual . Now, the work begins to make it like I want it to be. As I intend to drive it regularly, an overdrive trans is a must. I intend to keep the 230. As luck would have it, my friends uncle just scored a 52 Dodge truck. Also a flat 6 and a manual trans. He isnt using either, and I would like to know:

1) if his manual trans could be an overdirve trans. ie did they put OD trans's in trucks

2) how would I (he) identify the trans as an OD unit as opposed to a regular 3 spd. (I am in TX the trans in in MI)

3) what are the differences between his truck trans and my car trans. I have learned they are different and I think with the bellhousing I can mate his trans to my motor but i am not fluent enough to do this in a timely (and painless) fashion

 

I prefer to use the factory trans for an overdrive because i want this car to remain factory looking. It will not be getting a modern driveline. If i get desperate I will T5 it though because the speed limit it 75 here and I dont want my flatty to come apart on me.

 

Thanks in advance for any advise you can offer

[pflaming]

Welcome to this forum. I'll let others answer on the OD. OD's and transmissions are not easy to find. I have just enough knowledge to be dangerous. I did send you a PM. Get a service manual off ebay asap.

[Young Ed]

I do not believe there are any 3spd plus overdrives installed in trucks. Some of the really big trucks had 5spds that had OD but its a totally different animal. You really need to hunt down a car overdrive.

[ChrisRice]

Welcome PontiacGuy.  I cant answer that question, but wanted to welcome you to thew forum.  I also have a Plaza wagon, with overdrive (mine is a 55).  Congrats on wanting to keep it primarily stock.

[Lloyd]

Welcome to the forum.

I would agree with Ed, you should be looking for an OD trans for a car. I looked at using a different bell housing on my P8 but the starter mounting was different, it was higher and would have taken some major mods to the master cylinder and firewall mountings to get it to work. Try looking for the fluid-drive or even better Hy-drive trans Chrysler started making in the early 50's, they also made a power-drive(I think that's what it was called ??) later on which may still fit your car.

 

I did a lot of research looking for an OD trans for my 39 P8. Ended up getting an R7 OD trans which I have not yet even started installing. But it was designed for early Chryslers and fits great. I still will have to modify linkage and shorten the drive shaft but it was the easiest way for me with fewest modifications.

Edited September 22, 2014 by Lloyd

[wayfarer]

'Primarily stock' will preclude any post-62 transmissions as they will not have an e-brake and this usually then requires a new axle assembly.

 

The pass car OD was fairly prevalent in the 50's so they are available, however, at times they are ridiculously expensive. Not sure as to the logic other than the old "I've got it and you want it" rag... One sold on e-bay last year for nearly $2000.  Go figure.

There are plenty of photos on line showing the details of the OD trans so keep a copy handy as you look around.

 

If time is of the essence then call George Ashe. 814.354.2621

[plyroadking]

'Primarily stock' will preclude any post-62 transmissions as they will not have an e-brake and this usually then requires a new axle assembly.

 

The pass car OD was fairly prevalent in the 50's so they are available, however, at times they are ridiculously expensive. Not sure as to the logic other than the old "I've got it and you want it" rag... One sold on e-bay last year for nearly $2000.  Go figure.

There are plenty of photos on line showing the details of the OD trans so keep a copy handy as you look around.

 

If time is of the essence then call George Ashe. 814.354.2621

I think you mean I've got it, fought mice, snakes, and tetanus for it, hauled the car home, disassembled it, spent a lot of time going through it, installed it in car and tested everything, uninstalled it and built a stout crate to ship it in, all so you can have the out of the box race ready overdrive transmission experience that you want

[wayfarer]

...or something like that...

 

It could also be that   "I got this POS along with a bunch of other crap that was in the back of a old pickup that I bought last week and now I want $$$$ to recoup all of the money that I spent buying the truck..."

[meadowbrook]

Welcome to the forum.

I would agree with Ed, you should be looking for an OD trans for a car. I looked at using a different bell housing on my P8 but the starter mounting was different, it was higher and would have taken some major mods to the master cylinder and firewall mountings to get it to work. Try looking for the fluid-drive or even better Hy-drive trans Chrysler started making in the early 50's, they also made a power-drive(I think that's what it was called ??) later on which may still fit your car.

 

I did a lot of research looking for an OD trans for my 39 P8. Ended up getting an R7 OD trans which I have not yet even started installing. But it was designed for early Chryslers and fits great. I still will have to modify linkage and shorten the drive shaft but it was the easiest way for me with fewest modifications.

 

Great to know someone else has an R7 overdrive. I bought one and love it. It was a direct fit to my 1950 Dodge Meadowbrook, except for the addition of the operating cable and a longer speedo cable.

[plyroadking]

...or something like that...

 

It could also be that   "I got this POS along with a bunch of other crap that was in the back of a old pickup that I bought last week and now I want $$$$ to recoup all of the money that I spent buying the truck..."

Ok good, for a minute i thought you were talking about my overdrives that i occasionally sell when im done with them.

[Jim Wilson]

I've had what I thought was an R7 in my 1939 P8 Plymouth for several years, and it works very well. I had the car up on the hoist the other day and, to my surprise, R6 is cast on the side of the case. I bought the transmission from Moore's Auto Salvage in Rapid City, SD, and was told it came out of a 1939 Chrysler. Anybody know the story behind the R6 vs R7?  

 

Lloyd, the linkage was a direct bolt-on, no modifications necessary, just the addition of the overdrive cable and, as you mention, shortening of the drive shaft. I did not install a kickdown switch, so the solenoid is not hooked up. .      

[Lloyd]

Thanks Jim, that's encouraging. I really would like the linkage to just bolt up. I haven't really taken a close look at it. Got enough on my plate as it is so I am going to save that for one single project.

Sorry cant help with the R6, don't know anything about the R6, in fact don't know much about the R7 either.

[meadowbrook]

Interestingly, my R7 was the same length as the original 3 speed. No drive shaft changes.

[plyroadking]

I bought a 1939 Chrysler engine and overdrive transmission this last summer. It is a top shift transmission rather than the side shift r7 and r9, mine had a cover on the top that made it into a side shift, i was able to take a 1936 Plymouth floor shift tower and bolt it on. Its still on my bench and i can take pictures when this evening.

[Lloyd]

Here's a pic of my R7 and the stock 1939 P8 trans (Sorry about the slippers).

You can see the difference. It looks like the R7 is the same except for the added tail shaft. I have seen pics of later model standard trans that had the tail shaft but were manual shift w/o OD. At first they almost look like an R7 or R10 and its easy to see how a car with this trans would easily take an OD R7 or R10 without mods.

 

 

[Jim Wilson]

Lloyd, after seeing the picture of your R7 overdrive transmission I realize that you will probably will have to modify your linkage after all. The 39 Chrysler R6 overdrive transmission in my car (and as described by plyroadking above) is a direct bolt-in for a 39 Plymouth P8 because it has the same top cover as the stock 39 P8 transmission. 

[Lloyd]

Well, thanks Jim. I didn't know that. My OD install will be a ways down the road yet, perhaps I will come across an R6 and avoid any mods to the linkage. I would much rather have it install with as few mods as possible.

Thanks again.