55 Fargo 50 Mile Reliability Run

[55 Fargo]

Just was out for about a 50 mile cruise with the old heap, mostly highway, even some multi lane type highway fora change.

This truck runs well, handles okay and brakes okay, but she is one noisy sucker in the cab, I do have carpet on the floor and some insulation in the cab, but just plain noisy and not engine or fan noise, not sure what, just wind and sound from outside, I guess.

Kept highway speeds at 55 mph, and some intervals at 60 mph, no issues, 2500 RPM @ 60mph.

A couple of pics, from the Lockport Area in Manitoba....

Although the truck ran well, drove reasonable, this is not vacation touring vehicle, does not compare to the nice easy ride of the 47 Chrysler I used to own, may have to rethink my purpose for the truck, and make changes accordingly

Edited August 27, 2014 by Fargos-Go-Far

[pflaming]

My wifes Honda Accord was noisy, we changed tires, made a hugh difference. My truck is noisy also, and I have radials on it. I love to drive it, and will somehow get rid of the noise. I just bought an overdrive so that will help.

[55 Fargo]

My wifes Honda Accord was noisy, we changed tires, made a hugh difference. My truck is noisy also, and I have radials on it. I love to drive it, and will somehow get rid of the noise. I just bought an overdrive so that will help.

These cabs need to be well insulated, and the suspensions softened, not sure how much your OD will help, should help some....

[pflaming]

I removed one leaf from each set, too much work to remove another, but the ride and stance is fine, so will work first on better insulation in the cab. Maybe new cab mounts would also help, the old ones probably are like rock by now.

[NiftyFifty]

The 5 speed changes the noise in the truck dramatically IMO, but the key is insulation. I'm going to use the spray sound deadenerall over the cab, a layer of dynamat type material up to the top of the seats, and then on the floor and firewall will also get foil backed underlay before carpet.

I'm going to drop 3-4 more rear springs, and 2-3 front springs, but I'm working with a 1 ton.

[55 Fargo]

I am not complaining about rougher ride, it is a truck ride for sure.  have a lot of road noise, road surface, wind, making it very noisy in the cab. I have 3.23 gears, so not a real problem with  engine/fan noises. I have no intention of going to a T5 trans, what for with the 3.23 gears, might be better off with a T4 trans from an 80s S10. What I am getting at, is do not think 3.23 gears would be all that great for 5th gear, would be bogging down unless I was going down hill with a tail wind..

[pflaming]

4mulat dix: right on, and the door seals are critical as well. I also learned that a small hole in the firewall creates a lot of noise and one has to block off from the engine side or the air will still get through. If those holes are not covered or plugged from the engine side, the insulation will NOT hide those little noises and they do add up.

I hear tell that insulation under the hood also helps.

[55 Fargo]

4mulat dix: right on, and the door seals are critical as well. I also learned that a small hole in the firewall creates a lot of noise and one has to block off from the engine side or the air will still get through. If those holes are not covered or plugged from the engine side, the insulation will NOT hide those little noises and they do add up.

I hear tell that insulation under the hood also helps.

While I certainly agree with plugging all holes, insulation, door rubber, and even window rubber will all contribute to a quieter ride. Lets face it, these old truck were never as quiet as my modern vehicles, heck there not as quiet as some of my past 1970s pickup trucks.

I do not agree about insulating the underside of the hood, unless you live in the arctic somewhere, way too much heat would be kept under the hood in warm weather. 

[NiftyFifty]

Most vehicles starting in the 60's had under hood insulation and extra on the firewall wouldn't hurt either, the small amount of heat dissipating through the hood isn't going to change much. You can get a non overdrive T5, I wouldn't suggest a T4... Weaker then the 5, not that your overloading the truck, but they only came in the 4cyl trucks for a reason.

The metal on these trucks is far thicker then today's material, its all about the sound and heat deadening...I know guys with Model A's and T's that are as quiet as a new caddy... Just has to be done properly.

[Don Coatney]

The 5 speed changes the noise in the truck dramatically

Couple of T-5 questions? How does the T-5 change the noise level? I could understand this if the original transmission were defective and noisy but a healthy transmission no matter what should not make noise unless shifting gears in a non synchronized transmission.

 

You can get a non overdrive T5,

Where can a non overdrive T-5 be found? What vehicles used them? What would be the benefit of installing a non overdrive T-5?

[ggdad1951]

personally I didn't do much to sound insulate FEF, and have no problem having a conversation while driving him.  I do wonder how much has to do with the tires.  Agree the door seals would be important as well.  AS Merle will point out if I exceeded 50MPH I might have a different experience!  

[55 Fargo]

Link for T4 and T5 transmissions.

 

 

 

http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/t4_t5.htm

[NiftyFifty]

Fargo, that link forgets to mention all the GM and ford products that also used the T5, I've never run across one in a jeep before, but most of those I seen in my shop days were all autos. There are t5's that don't have a final 1-1, I've run into this before because I was warned when I did my swap to check the numbers before buying or installing, but seeing as most guys grab them from the GM S trucks with 2.8 or 4.3 then they were 99% to get an OD version.

As for sound, you may not be able to hear your transmission, but the noise is there and it somewhat blends in with the engine/driveline noise, but once you have done the swap you can hear the difference, a lot less whine and hum at highway speed. I ran my truck with stock 4 speed the first year and changed it out on year two, and my truck was a lot quieter, and I never changed anything else related to noise reduction.

If your happy just running your truck on small runs, then its likely fine the way it is, but if you want to start using it as a distant cruiser you need to spend the money and time, or just suffer through the negatives. I would regularly run my truck 75 mile runs at least once a week, and a few hundred to go to certain shows, I don't believe you need to limit runs or act like these trucks weren't made for the road. I can also quite easily handle 70 mph on the highway at about 23-2400 rpm with my setup.

[Don Coatney]

Link for T4 and T5 transmissions.

 

 

 

http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/t4_t5.htm

The above link shows two different transmissions. The T-4 is a 4 speed non overdrive and the T-5 is a 5 speed with overdrive

 

There are t5's that don't have a final 1-1,

Fact is all T-5 transmissions do not have a final 1.1 ratio. The fifth gear is an overdrive with a ratio something less than 1.1. The photo posted below clearly shows a final (5th gear) ratio of .86.

 

To correct your earlier statement there are no T-5 transmissions that are not overdrive transmissions.

 

[NiftyFifty]

My apologies in calling it not OD, but their are different variations of the 5th gear in different T5's, some not dropping your RPM's as low as others.

Thank God Don was here to the rescue, or the whole thread would be dwn the tubes.

[Jeff Balazs]

Some of the noise is wind related and making sure you have the correct seal and gaskets does help with this.

 

I think the biggest reduction in sound can be had using a product something like the Hushmat Ultra I used. I started off using 3 coats of brush on rubberized bedliner on the entire inside surfaces and underside of the cab. This stuff was effective at getting rid of squeeks etc. I even applied it to the inside of the doors. I then went over the surfaces with Hushmat. I covered everything I could reach with at least one layer. This included the entire floor even under the seat. I put two layers on the inside of the firewall and one on the engine side. This stuff really made a difference.

 

I then put a double layer of foil bubble wrap insulation pretty much everywhere. I don't think it did a lot to quiet things down but it does help with temperature insulation. This was installed behind the upholstery kit I got from John at Pilothouse Interiors. I carpeted the are behind and under the seats. I even put a double layer of the foil insulation under the cab. If you are willing to put the effort in you can really make these cabs very nice. It was a lot of extra work and $ but I am very happy with the results.

 

I managed to quiet my tranny down by using semi fluid grease in it instead of 90w. Heck I even insulated the back of the dash and stuff like that. Every little bit makes a difference.

 

Jeff

[55 Fargo]

Fargo, that link forgets to mention all the GM and ford products that also used the T5, I've never run across one in a jeep before, but most of those I seen in my shop days were all autos. There are t5's that don't have a final 1-1, I've run into this before because I was warned when I did my swap to check the numbers before buying or installing, but seeing as most guys grab them from the GM S trucks with 2.8 or 4.3 then they were 99% to get an OD version.

As for sound, you may not be able to hear your transmission, but the noise is there and it somewhat blends in with the engine/driveline noise, but once you have done the swap you can hear the difference, a lot less whine and hum at highway speed. I ran my truck with stock 4 speed the first year and changed it out on year two, and my truck was a lot quieter, and I never changed anything else related to noise reduction.

If your happy just running your truck on small runs, then its likely fine the way it is, but if you want to start using it as a distant cruiser you need to spend the money and time, or just suffer through the negatives. I would regularly run my truck 75 mile runs at least once a week, and a few hundred to go to certain shows, I don't believe you need to limit runs or act like these trucks weren't made for the road. I can also quite easily handle 70 mph on the highway at about 23-2400 rpm with my setup.

Having the 3.23 gears, not sure again if OD would be a little tough on the old engine, I cruising at 60 mph at usually around 2400 RPM, so at 65-70 would be closer to 2800 rpm.

RPM is not the main issue driving these old trucks at 65-70 mph, it's control handling and braking that concerns me more.

I do believe you on the trans quieter with T5, makes sense to me. To be honest, if I could bolt up a Mopar 3spd AT, that would be a pleasure for me.

Some of the noise is wind related and making sure you have the correct seal and gaskets does help with this.

 

I think the biggest reduction in sound can be had using a product something like the Hushmat Ultra I used. I started off using 3 coats of brush on rubberized bedliner on the entire inside surfaces and underside of the cab. This stuff was effective at getting rid of squeeks etc. I even applied it to the inside of the doors. I then went over the surfaces with Hushmat. I covered everything I could reach with at least one layer. This included the entire floor even under the seat. I put two layers on the inside of the firewall and one on the engine side. This stuff really made a difference.

 

I then put a double layer of foil bubble wrap insulation pretty much everywhere. I don't think it did a lot to quiet things down but it does help with temperature insulation. This was installed behind the upholstery kit I got from John at Pilothouse Interiors. I carpeted the are behind and under the seats. I even put a double layer of the foil insulation under the cab. If you are willing to put the effort in you can really make these cabs very nice. It was a lot of extra work and $ but I am very happy with the results.

 

I managed to quiet my tranny down by using semi fluid grease in it instead of 90w. Heck I even insulated the back of the dash and stuff like that. Every little bit makes a difference.

 

Jeff

Thanx Jeff, sounds like you did a lot of work, and it paid off, yes these trucks can certainly be noisier on those real windy cooler days...