Joe Flanagan Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Posted June 8, 2011 OK, that's my task for this afternoon. Quote
blueskies Posted June 8, 2011 Report Posted June 8, 2011 Thanks. I don't think I'll install the kickdown switch at the carb linkage. I like the idea of having it within hand's reach. Joe- I mounted the kickdown switch on the end of the shifter handle. Works great to "split shift", giving you five forward speeds. You can read about what I did here: http://www.50plymouth.com/05-tra/tra.html Scroll down toward the bottom of the page for the kickdown stuff. Count the shifts in this clip: Also, if you haven't already downloaded the Borg Warner manual from the downloads section of the P15-D24 site, you should. It has the best troubleshooting guide and factory wiring diagram. Pete Quote
Young Ed Posted June 8, 2011 Report Posted June 8, 2011 Jim's right. Your 49 should have a 3.9 while the OD cars came with 4.11. What I don't know is if that is enough to get you a different tooth count on the speedo gear. I suspect they will be 1# off of each other and you should switch them. Quote
Joe Flanagan Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Posted June 8, 2011 Pete, I did read all of your overdrive entries on your website. Were there any wires visible along your steering column or gear shift when you made that alteration? Also, I have two copies of that Borg Warner manual. It is very useful. The technical manuals from the Imperial Club website are also excellent. Quote
suntennis Posted June 8, 2011 Report Posted June 8, 2011 Looking at the parts book for 1954 and earlier, the same drive gear in the overdrive is used for gear ratios 3.73 to 1 thru 4.3 to 1. The pinion gear or the gear on the speedometer cable varies from 16 to 19 teeth depending on rear end ratio and tire size. Quote
Joe Flanagan Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Posted June 8, 2011 Here are my two speedo gears. On the left is the gear from my 1949 stock transmission. On the right is the one from the 1952 overdrive. My original has 17 teeth. The overdrive gear has 18. I triple-checked. The funny thing is, much of the OD gear seems to be made of plastic. Maybe it's an after market replacement? I also have this rubber seal or washer on my original that is not present on the overdrive speedo gear: The bottom of the seal has a groove in it. I don't know if you can see it in the picture but here it is: Quote
Young Ed Posted June 8, 2011 Report Posted June 8, 2011 Joe why'd you triple check? The ones I've swapped were stamped or cast with the teeth count. Quote
Joe Flanagan Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Posted June 8, 2011 Ha ha. I didn't see that. I did try to make out some tiny tiny printing on one of them but couldn't read it. Quote
Young Ed Posted June 8, 2011 Report Posted June 8, 2011 Ha ha. I didn't see that. I did try to make out some tiny tiny printing on one of them but couldn't read it. Did you find it now? Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 (edited) Jim's right. Your 49 should have a 3.9 while the OD cars came with 4.11. What I don't know is if that is enough to get you a different tooth count on the speedo gear. I suspect they will be 1# off of each other and you should switch them. My factory 1952 Belvedere OD car came with a 4.3 ratio as did my 1953 Savoy wagon with OD. As I recall 18 teeth on the speedo pinions. Here is some factory info on rear axle ratio's. No stamped #'s on this plastic 18 tooth pinion out of a on the shelf OD. Checked 2 OD's-both were plastic 18 tooth count. Some no charge pics. Bob Edited June 9, 2011 by Dodgeb4ya Quote
woodie49 Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 I got my material and rivets from www.brakeplace.com I used these guys. The service was fast and the price was right. But, there is a bit too much meat on the shoe and I can not put the Ebrake on the trans and hook it up with any room for adjustment. I am going to have to shave the shoe down somehow. Haven't really addressed that yet. And have since shelved the project until I have a bit more time. Quote
Joe Flanagan Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Posted June 9, 2011 I sent my e-brake off to Tennessee Clutch and Supply today. So that is taken care of. Don't know how you'd take material off the brake surface. Sounds like that is going to be a bit of a challenge. Ed, I did find the number of teeth stamped on the speedo gears. On my original it says "17T" just as plain as day but I never would have figured out what that meant. On the plastic one from the OD, you really have to look hard to see the "18T." Practically impossible to find. Never occurred to me they'd be marked like that. Quote
Young Ed Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 I used these guys. The service was fast and the price was right. But, there is a bit too much meat on the shoe and I can not put the Ebrake on the trans and hook it up with any room for adjustment. I am going to have to shave the shoe down somehow. Haven't really addressed that yet. And have since shelved the project until I have a bit more time. Ah I buy the material from them. I've never had them do an ebrake for me but they've done great on the other stuff I've had them do. They did the clutch in my p15. Pete had the same issue you have with whoever did his ebrake. He bought some self adhesive sandpaper and stuck it to the drum and started the car. It sanded the lining enough that it worked properly after removing the sandpaper. Quote
Joe Flanagan Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Posted June 9, 2011 That Pete. He's a crafty bugger. He's smart, too. Quote
Jim Yergin Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 Joe, I am the one who suggested you count the teeth so blame it on me. I have a 19 tooth gear on my car with a 4.3 rear end. Still reads too fast but I do not think a 20 tooth gear is available. Jim Yergin Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 Joe,I am the one who suggested you count the teeth so blame it on me. I have a 19 tooth gear on my car with a 4.3 rear end. Still reads too fast but I do not think a 20 tooth gear is available. Jim Yergin The book shows a 20 tooth gear-though I have never owned one! Quote
blueskies Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 Pete, I did read all of your overdrive entries on your website. Were there any wires visible along your steering column or gear shift when you made that alteration? Also, I have two copies of that Borg Warner manual. It is very useful. The technical manuals from the Imperial Club website are also excellent. Yes, the wires were visible, they ran out of the end of the shifter handle, down under the column, and up under the dash. But, they weren't very noticeable, and I couldn't see them from the driver's seat... You can barely see them in these pics- Pete Quote
Young Ed Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 Pete did you have factory turn signals in your car? There is a metal cover that runs down the column to contain the turn signal wiring and Joe might be able to add it. Quote
blueskies Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 Pete did you have factory turn signals in your car? There is a metal cover that runs down the column to contain the turn signal wiring and Joe might be able to add it. Ed- I did not have the factory signal wiring stuff on the car- I had one of the aftermarket signal switches, and the wires ran along the column in a length of plastic wire loom. I have not seen the factory wire cover, but that sounds like the way to go... Pete Quote
Jim Yergin Posted June 9, 2011 Report Posted June 9, 2011 The book shows a 20 tooth gear-though I have never owned one! Does the book provide a part number? My book only shows up to a 19. Thanks. Jim Yergin Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted June 10, 2011 Report Posted June 10, 2011 Does the book provide a part number? My book only shows up to a 19.Thanks. Jim Yergin Jim, I re-checked the book and Part #-20 tooth pinion is for the M6 Fluid Drive models. Bob Quote
Jim Yergin Posted June 10, 2011 Report Posted June 10, 2011 Jim, I re-checked the book and Part #-20 tooth pinion is for the M6 Fluid Drive models.Bob Thanks Bob. I wonder if it would fit a standard transmission? Do you have a part number? Jim Yergin Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted June 10, 2011 Report Posted June 10, 2011 The part# is 1137362. I think the M5 and 6 pinions are longer. I'll check tomorrow. Quote
DJ194950 Posted June 10, 2011 Report Posted June 10, 2011 :confused:if not confused yet, look at pinions avail in 50 chrysler parts book. i've tried to determine if 18,19,20 gears will fit std. trans also. appears so, but???. seems to be tied to tire size, not trans type as there is no mention of trans in applications. must do math!! tire diamenters (not listed) would be much better to determine proper gear tooth #. don't think i'll try. wait until my car is back on the road. have a 17 & 18. but where to find a 19 or 20 if would be closer? appreciate an post with what you guys find. on attached try: hit shift and +++ inlarges pic. thanks and happy motoring, doug Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted June 10, 2011 Report Posted June 10, 2011 (edited) You ought to see the chart I have-it shows tire size teeth count and car models too. I just can't shrink the scans small and clear enough. Bob Edited June 10, 2011 by Dodgeb4ya Quote
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