What type Welder

[1949P17BC]

All, in the market for a light duty welder, perhaps something from Harbour Freight. Planning on just welding small patch panels on fenders and floors. Never welded before, but have watched a lot, learned how to do other things for the P15, welding is the next logical self taught skill!

[Norm's Coupe]

I use a cheap stick Arc Welder, 110 volts. Works good for me. Just have to learn what size sticks to use with it. Or, they do have cheaper models of wire welders now for 110 volts. Those are supposed to be easier to use than Arc Welders. But........whatever kind of welder you buy, they usually come with a cheap welding mask. Throw that away. The best thing you can buy to help you weld is an auto darkening helmet. Those are great and you can pick those up for around $50 when you buy your welder.

[1949P17BC]

Thanks Norm, the guidance I am looking for

[Plymouthy Adams]

stick welder..welding panels is not advised..metal too thin...the only rods I can ever to get flow at a minimum setting of 20 amps re 310-16 stainless and even at that I was welding exhaust tube...

The duty cycle on most of Harbor Freight welders is very low...little welding/lotta resting...if you serious about buying a welder..step up to a nicer unit often found at the weld supply shop in your area or Lowes etc..Hobart is a better line of home units...also consider getting a unit that can switch between flux and gas shield...

else ..I would recommend a gas welder myself..less punch through when welding new to old in the area of floor pans etc...heat control is smooth and instant change by hand movement...puddling is simple with low pressure flame in flame tip...use copper coated steel rods to prevent sputter and sparking..

[Norm's Coupe]

Tim,

I don't profess to be an expert at welding. But.........you can weld very thin steel with a stick welder without burn through. My arc welder is one of those real cheap 110 volt jobs that sell for about $90. Has heat settings from about 35 amps to 70 or 75 amps (forgot the top exact setting). I had never welded anything or owned a welder until the late 90's. And, I still don't weld that much. However, one of the thinnest and most delicate parts I've welded with it was the bracket that holds the motor inside of an old car heater. Going to say that bracket was about the thickness of the star bracket that goes across the bottom of the top on one of our oil bath air cleaners, but not as wide as those braces. I used the thinnest stick I could buy to weld that back together. Then bolted the motor back in the heater on that bracket and sold the heater on ebay. I did test it prior to selling it after fixing it. Worked like a dream with no vibration at all, and the weld held. That was a lot thinner than any of the body parts on our old Mopar's. You can do it without warping the metal if you just use the right amp setting and the right size stick.

Now, if I really want to, I can also cut steel with my little cheap 110 volt arc welder too. So........I don't need no gas or expensive burner for what I have to cut. I just use more heat and a bigger stick and I can cut a piece of steel, at least up to 18 guage. I have done that just to see if I could.

I will however agree with you about the duty cycle. But..........it doesn't take that long for the unit to recover and be ready to weld again. Usually, just enough time for the steel to cool a little and to look at what I'm doing. That also helps to keep you from warping your part. For most of us like me, time isn't an issue, it will get done. If I was doing it to make money, then I might consider a more expensive unit. But.........for as much as we usually weld, the cheaper units work just fine.

[steveplym]

I purchased a Lincoln Mig Pak 10 from Eastwood several years ago. I really like the Lincoln welders and it has lasted quite a while without any problems. I had a Hobart welder at one time too, and it worked well.

Only difference I found between the Lincoln and some of the other cheaper welders is that the wire was hot at all times, with the lincoln you had to press the trigger button for the circuit to complete. So you can put your wire right down where you want to start, the flip you hood down and go. I got a few flashes in my eyes before I got used to it with the Hobart.

I agree with Tim though on an arc welder. I wouldn't use one on thin steel. Not only do you have to worry about burn thru, but there is a higher chance of warping the metal. I've warped metal with a grinder before, it's no picnic when it is in the center of a door you are trying to put a lower patch panel on. Live and learn.

[Plymouthy Adams]

there is quite a bit of difference between a spot weld and a long bead,....now when you show me a video of a 12 inch run on 18 guage steel with one piece being new and the other a piece of slightly rusted floor pan..then you may make a believer out of me..but until thin..I will not hold my breath...even if you have a stitch welded adapter...especially at 35 amp AC low setting...even with DC low amp is a push...

[moparalltheway]

Get a Lincoln gas welder. 110 volt at Lowe's and you will be glad you did. Cost just a little more but worth every penny. And yes it is not hot until you pull the trigger. I have had other welders but none even compare with the Lincoln. Makes welding easy.

[austinsailor]

Get a Lincoln gas welder. 110 volt at Lowe's and you will be glad you did. Cost just a little more but worth every penny. And yes it is not hot until you pull the trigger. I have had other welders but none even compare with the Lincoln. Makes welding easy.

I have a small 110 volt lincoln. I use it for sheet metal, using gas. You can just tap tap tap the trigger, never getting the metal hot. You can just "stitch" it without any adapters, just a twitchy finger. When I bought mine, they were about $700 or so, they've come down a lot. Some years ago I tried it with 1/16 steel rods in a small arc welder, no comparison.

I also have TIG and gas, but either of those put too much heat in thin panels and you will end up with a lot of warpage. With the wire, you can jump around with very small spots and never heat it up enough to cause problems. Heat control is about the most important thing.

[dezeldoc]

I have a small 110 volt lincoln. I use it for sheet metal, using gas. You can just tap tap tap the trigger, never getting the metal hot. You can just "stitch" it without any adapters, just a twitchy finger. When I bought mine, they were about $700 or so, they've come down a lot. Some years ago I tried it with 1/16 steel rods in a small arc welder, no comparison.

I also have TIG and gas, but either of those put too much heat in thin panels and you will end up with a lot of warpage. With the wire, you can jump around with very small spots and never heat it up enough to cause problems. Heat control is about the most important thing.

If you are getting warpage with a tig you are doing something wrong. tig puts out a better controled heat compaired to a mig, stick or gas welder. you can weld a beer can with a tig but you ain't gonna do it with the others, well I seen a guy do it with a gas torch one time!

If I were you I would get a Lincoln 110v wirefeed from someplace like home depot and get the gas kit with it and it will preform good for just about anything around the house. it is easy to learn on. I think they are around 550.00 or less. stay away from a arc welder unless you plan on welding 1/16" up steel as they aren't real thin metal friendly, and are a pain to learn on. Your first few pounds of rod will be stuck to your work and look like a porcupine!! Skip the harbor freight welders as they are not worth the money and the adjustments are not to good.

[rolliejoe]

The Hobart Handler 140 MIG Welder is a really nice unit. Using it with the gas

and it does a great job and is easy to use.

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200306073_200306073

[dezeldoc]

The Hobart Handler 140 MIG Welder is a really nice unit. Using it with the gas

and it does a great job and is easy to use.

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200306073_200306073

That is pretty much the same as the lincoln 140, both are good welders.

[austinsailor]

If you are getting warpage with a tig you are doing something wrong. tig puts out a better controled heat compaired to a mig, stick or gas welder. you can weld a beer can with a mig but you ain't gonna do it with the others, well I seen a guy do it with a gas torch one time!

I agree with your second statement, (not included above) but this one is not correct. I can weld a pop can together with TIG and have done it. I've never seen it done with a mig, although I expect with the right one and someone who knows what they're doing, it can be done. Not the same thing, though. Tig has to heat the spot you're welding to make a puddle to dip your rod in. That heat is radiating all through the metal while it's heating up a puddle (no matter how small), same for a torch. With a mig the tip of the wire is melting into the puddle as it is creating it. Just a fraction of a second burst with the wire will add to the weld. Not so with tig.

For what it's worth, it's not exactly the heat warpage that makes a makes a panel wavy when you weld it. It's the fact that you welded it while it was warped. That may not seem like a difference, but you can take a big panel, heat it, and it'll warp a lot. Don't weld, hammer or touch it, and when it's cool, it'll return to the same shape as before. But - do anything to it while it's hot, and it'll mess it up. Hitting it will distort it and it'll stay that way, welding it will hold it in that position. Of course, heating too much will also do it, but not mild heating. The point is to do very small welds, get off it before it distorts. Let it cool, then hit another small spot.

[Norm's Coupe]

there is quite a bit of difference between a spot weld and a long bead,....now when you show me a video of a 12 inch run on 18 guage steel with one piece being new and the other a piece of slightly rusted floor pan..then you may make a believer out of me..but until thin..I will not hold my breath...even if you have a stitch welded adapter...especially at 35 amp AC low setting...even with DC low amp is a push...

Tim,

When I said spot weld, I really didn't mean it as an actual spot weld. I guess I should have said I weld about an inch or so, skip a section of at least an inch or more (depending on how long the weld has to be), then I go back and fill in the area not welded the first time, and also keep skipping sections until the whole seam is welded. That way I don't have to worry about building up too much heat on the steel with the stick.

That said, I do have a spot weld and stitch weld attachment to go with the arc welder. But.........on that heater repair I made I simply used the small stick and did not use the stitch welder. In fact, after welding both with the stitch attachment and straight with a smaller stick, I like the smaller stick method better.

I'm not going to make a video of welding with the stick. But........if you or anyone else is ever around here, we'll go out in the garage and do a demo for you. I've usually got steel laying around, at least enough for a demo. And, I always have the larger and smaller sticks stored in the stick bottles to keep em nice and dry.

My welds aren't the greatest looking, but I've seen some peoples welds with gas and wire welders that look just as bad as mine. I am getting better though each time I weld something. Until I get perfect, I just use the old grinder to smooth things out when finished.

I wasn't telling him he should buy an arc welder either. Just that he could if he wanted. Regardless of what welder he buys he'll have to get use to it and practice a little. An expensive welder won't make him or anyone else a better welder though. Only experience will do that.

Really when you get down to it. How much do most of use a welder. Not that much. Even my brother in law who has a professional setup (he's not a professional welder) doesn't use his that much either since his 36 Ford is done. His setup is one that runs several thousand dollars. He even has a flame burner that he bought about 3 years ago. The welder sits idle most of the time for the past 20 years, and he's used that flame burner once to see how it worked in three years. So..........again, I say spend as little as you can for this type of stuff, unless you plan on using it a lot.

[1948Matt]

I have the Hobart Handler 140. I got it from Tractor Supply that I love. It works with or without gas (Flux) and it is a little cheaper than the Miller or Lincoln. It is actually made by Miller, just their off brand if you will. I got mine as a manager special and it ran around $400. With gas it was a bit more, but I won't weld without gas ever again. Good luck on your descision.

[dezeldoc]

I agree with your second statement, (not included above) but this one is not correct. I can weld a pop can together with TIG and have done it. I've never seen it done with a mig, although I expect with the right one and someone who knows what they're doing, it can be done. Not the same thing, though. Tig has to heat the spot you're welding to make a puddle to dip your rod in. That heat is radiating all through the metal while it's heating up a puddle (no matter how small), same for a torch. With a mig the tip of the wire is melting into the puddle as it is creating it. Just a fraction of a second burst with the wire will add to the weld. Not so with tig.

For what it's worth, it's not exactly the heat warpage that makes a makes a panel wavy when you weld it. It's the fact that you welded it while it was warped. That may not seem like a difference, but you can take a big panel, heat it, and it'll warp a lot. Don't weld, hammer or touch it, and when it's cool, it'll return to the same shape as before. But - do anything to it while it's hot, and it'll mess it up. Hitting it will distort it and it'll stay that way, welding it will hold it in that position. Of course, heating too much will also do it, but not mild heating. The point is to do very small welds, get off it before it distorts. Let it cool, then hit another small spot.

My bad I meant tig, fixed it. yeh the guy that did it with gas won about 150.00 bucks on that bet!! never doubted him again! The warpage statement is not 100% correct, heat will warp the steel it removes the memory.

[moparalltheway]

Like I said. Get the Lincoln there is no better for the money. It is worth what little if any in price. If you get something else you will just buy the Lincoln later.

[deadbodyman]

All, in the market for a light duty welder, perhaps something from Harbour Freight. Planning on just welding small patch panels on fenders and floors. Never welded before, but have watched a lot, learned how to do other things for the P15, welding is the next logical self taught skill!

you really want a mig,ez to use,weld like pro in no time,please do yourself a favor dont go to harbor,buy used 110 lincon or miller and save yourself a ton of frustration.ive been in the biz 35 years and i couldnt weld five minutes without some kind of problem what they do do well is keeping your car from rolling back when you shove them under the tires

[deadbodyman]

All, in the market for a light duty welder, perhaps something from Harbour Freight. Planning on just welding small patch panels on fenders and floors. Never welded before, but have watched a lot, learned how to do other things for the P15, welding is the next logical self taught skill!

harbor does have an auto adjust helmet ill recomend around fifty bucks.the mig welder is the only way to go though,youll get farther faster than ANY other way,dont forget there are glues out thatll work even better on patches if you need help just ask,been building cars a long time,have many tricks,be more than happy to help

[power_hungry]

I'd be interested in hearing about the glues that can be used.

[wayfarer]

Check out Devcon Metal Welder II. Two-part methacrylate adhesive for structural bonding of metal alloys...so says the advertisement...

www.devcon.com 800-933-8266

with regards to the welder...flux core leaves splatter, gas shielding is alot cleaner. Gas shielding is useless if the wind is blowing.

.

[greg g]

For glues, check a body shop supply store for panel bonding agents.

If you wanna step up from Harbor Freight, but don't want to spend the extra dollars for Lincoln or others, check the Farm Hand Brand at Tractor supply. Their Duty cycle is considerably higher than the HF one. Also I found that getting a good flux core wire from the local welding supply and cleaning the areas to be welded thoroughly reduces the splatter considerably.

That said I have found that My Harbor Freight 110 volt deal serves my needs well so far . I have learned when trying to weld thin stuff, lower the power and increase the wire feed speed. My auto darkening helmet works well however the head band adjusters leave a bit to be desired.

As far as learning how. Wire welders are really easy compared to sticks and gas and rod. When you get your welder, go to a body shop and see if you can get a crumpled fender or door skin cut up some pieces and practice.

[deadbodyman]

for starters,you can buy used lincon or millers 110v for around 300.00,gas will be about40.00,wire30.00 so for 4-500.00 your welding,if that sounds in the right range by all meens go for it,its the first step of your evolution into the world of rod building or just being the most popular guy on the street,welding is a blast as a hobbie.now if you only want to fix some patches and have no intrest in fixing all the bikes and lawnmowers in the neighborhood there are glues out there that will glue a seam stronger than welding.after the seam dries if you try to chisle it apart the metal will tear before the seam,hard to believe i know i felt the same way until it was demonstrated in front of me,ive been useing it for ten years now,all you need is 25.00 for glue and 5.00 for drill screws.once you learn both youll really be doing something.good luck with your project

[deadbodyman]

I'd be interested in hearing about the glues that can be used.

i can get the part numbers plus show you how via vidio if youd like. the glue i prefer is from SEM,called weld bond available at most body shop supply stores

[dezeldoc]

Another good thing about the glue is no heat!! you can do some wild things with it.