froze up ! literally!

[knighthawk]

guess I really screwed up this time ! As some of you know... I'm building this '48 Dodge with the 318 in it , winter 's here, so I need to ''winterize'' these other vehicles, so I move the '48 to the back stall in the 'horse barn' , which has no insulation or heat , exposing it to single digit temps for about a week. Yesterday, I was going over in my head, what to check on the car I'm working in the nice heated shop now, I think....antifreeze...should check the antifreeze,,,,,,, HOLY CRAP ! I never put any anti freeze in the '48 !!!!!!!!!!! So I go in the back drveway of the barn where the '48 is and look ,,,yup I can see ICE in the radiator ! Sooooooooooooo, any suggestions as how to thaw this thing out ? How much damage can I expect ??????? I feel sick just thinking about it !

[aero3113]

Was it frozen solid? If not you might get lucky. Do you have a heat lamp or a torch you can put on the motor to thaw it out then drain?

[knighthawk]

when I looked in the rad, I could see ice, but it was only about 1/2 full, either I got expansion room, or it already broke and melted some, and refroze ? Anyway, yes I did put the flame thrower heater on for a while back there, then laid the shop trouble lite with a 100 watt bulb on the motor, closed the hood , covered it with a blanket. Maybe I should fire up the heater again today ( it should be about 30 degrees outside today ) and open the drain.....

[dezeldoc]

look at the freeze plugs and see if any are blown out, these motors like to crack in the lifter valley when they freeze. you should put a bunch of heat lamps around the motor, water pump, radiator and try to thaw it out and get some anti freeze in it, hopefuly it is not to late.

[knighthawk]

well, I just had some more heat blowing on it for awhile, pulled top rad hose, of intake, no thermostat in it yet, could see a empty thermostat housing , ( no ice 0R water ), that might be good news. Got the lower hose off , full of 1/2 frozen slush, probaley from the flame thrower heat, can't get a good look at the frost plugs,,,,, although I did resist the temptation ot start iy up to warm itup, then realized I could break something like the water pump . Raining today, so that may help melt some.........

[brian hood]

I learned your lesson the hard way. I kept putting water into the rad until I noticed it coming from the oil fill tube. It cracked in the lifter valley. Good luck!

[RobertKB]

I believe it is always a good idea to have anti-freeze in your car at all times. Not only does it prevent freezing but I believe it is better for your engine than having just water. Being forgetful is then not a problem! Knighthawk, I hope you caught things in time and no serious damage was done! Please keep us updated.

[knighthawk]

Aside from being forgetful, the reason there was no antifreeze in it was that I wasn't sure if the engine was even any good or if it would even hold water. But, I should have remembered it was just water when I put it in the back of the barn ! Dezeldoc also said these engines crack in the lifter valley....is it something that can be seen easily ? Is it repairable ? I plan to get it back into the heated area tommorrow. Will probabley have to use the tractor to push it in , as I don't dare start the engine yet,,,, will blow some more heat it tonite for a while

[dezeldoc]

Sometimes you can see them and sometimes not, depends on how clean the lifter valley is. It depends on how bad the crack is, I have welded up many and not had any issues.

[knighthawk]

I got the car into the 'warm work area', did some checkin' , the back two frost plugs ( or this case 'freeze' plugs) did pop out . oil pan drain plug had a little water in it, just enough to thin it a little but not discolor it . Took the spark plugs out, blew air in the cylinders, I think, a little water sprayed out from , #5 on the rt side, # 8 on left side. I'm thinking of putting the frost plugs back in and airing up the block to see what happens ,maybe a down' test, if I can make the right tools.......... I have a very old radiator tester, put it on , pumped it up, has a very slow leak.................

[Norm's Coupe]

Hopefully, it didn't freeze up too solid. The block could have gotten a crack so small that you would not be able to see it, or see air going though the crack. The only way to really tell is fill it up with water/coolant again and see if you have any leaks. Another place to check is in the cylinder ports. My brother in law rebuild an old Ford V8 flathead that looked good. Filled it up with coolant and found a very small crack in the cylinder port wall. So........short of pulling it and having it checked with dye, just fill it up with coolant and keep and eye on it for leaks.

As for repairing cracked blocks. I haven't seen anyone do that and have real good success. A guy who lives just a few blocks from me had his 218 block welded three times, and it would still crack again. Finally replaced the engine.

Good luck.

[dezeldoc]

Norm, it depends where the crack is and how you repair it. I have pinned them and also welded them with no problems.

knighthawk, the oil will not change color till you run it, water is heaver than oil so it just goes to the bottom of the pan. to make a leakdown tester just use an old screw in compression tester and hook it to an air compressor and use about 40lbs air. pull the cylinder you are testing up to tdc both valves closed and put the air to it and see if you get bubbles in the radiator,also check the tail pipe for air leak,intake and oil fill hole for same and it will tell how things are sealing.If it blew out the plugs it most likely is cracked.

[knighthawk]

I was afraid you'd say that ! Years ago , I used a series of cast plugs to repair an old tractor head, Also have 'tried' to weld cast with both cast and nickle rods (and brass ). BUT, also I have used a block sealant called 'K W block sealant' , it came in a 6'' copper colored can. I know it worked really good for putting in loose cylinder sleaves. Haven't seen any now for quite a while.........

[JIPJOBXX]

Hay how about some Bar's Leak! I had a friend who used that stuff in a model B ford engine and it worked.

[dezeldoc]

I have had the come into my shop with pepper,eggs,crackers and a whole lot more I don't remember! KW is great for sealing up leaks if you follow the instructions.

[knighthawk]

I used some kind of brown crap to put in my wifes '95 Ford truck, to stop a water leak I couldn't find. It plugged up everything ! INCLUDING the heater HOSES !!!....................Anyway, I did some more checking on the motor last nite, put shop air hose on the thermostat housing , at 20 #, it blow out the used frost plugs ( I tried to use them over ), so then I set it 10 #, and could not hear any leaks anywhere. SO, I am going to assume, IF there are any cracks, they are not very big. My only concern now, is the lifter valley, as mentioned before,...........I'm guessing I'll have to pull the intake and air it up, in order to check that ?????????

[Plymouthy Adams]

I believe the KW stuff is uptown in one of the oldest parts stores in the area...you must use if for just a spell..drain and let set..do not use in conjunction with antifreeze .drain and flush antifreeze prior to use...have never used it but it does have a good rep....

[knighthawk]

Tim, glad to see your reading this, also may need some help locating some of this K W.....

[james curl]

Our Wal Mart has a liquid glass which is the same as the K W sealer if I remember correctly. As Tim stated the engine must be drained,flushed and then the liquid glass added to the radiator, run to temperature then allowed to sit 24 hours then drain and flush, add water and anti freeze and go. I used a form of liquid glass that came in a quart bottle and was clear in my 55 Chevy pick up for a cracked head, held for about five years before it started missing on start up before clearing the water out of the cylinder. I ended up replacing the head.