Uncle-Pekka

Folks, When I pulled the transmission for OD installation, pulling of the propeller shaft made me uneasy thinking of installation. The shaft was REALLY tight to pull backwards enough to get the flange past the bolts ends. Taking it out must be easier because I could pry the flanges apart by lever in between them... How do I compress the shaft to be able to slide it back on the flange bolts?

The 1941 Chrysler is the best looking car of the fat fender era MoPars, thus biz'cupe would be a cool score. Some 4 yrs back I spotted one in L.A. area Craigslist. It was kind of pricey considering the condition, thenagain, the prices of these will probably not drop as time goes by... HOWEVER, this thread was started April 1st... makes old unkka suspicious...

^Thanks! Tha's what I needed. Now the turning is done. I've got a aluminium brake drum. It's not perfect, there were some air or slag pits in my cast. However, it will do the job as well as the original. The advantage is that it's much lighter than the original. Most important, I've got it here where I need it to put the car back together. The hardest test is still to do, talking apart the 3-speed boxes and assembling one working unit with fluid drive input shaft and R10 behind it. That job should take place during the Easter holidays. To be continued...

next step turning the blank. What is the outer diameter of a new brake drum? 5,9 " ...?

It's a rubber seal pressed tight between the chrome trim and the glass. 6-7 years ago (how the time flies....) I posted some photo's of the jig I made to assembly the vent window when I replaced the damaged glass and dried out seal. I cannot find my thread, at least not by a quick search... Well, I actually used rubber from an tire tube. I lubricated a wide rubber strip with soap and pressed in with the window. Finally cut the excess rubber off along the trim egde with a carpet knife.

the cast blank I intend to turn for a new brake drum... This is aluminium instead of cast iron, but I trust it will do the job all the same.

I may have told this before on this forum... What I found under the seat of the 1951 Nash which came from Phoenix, AZ: An ice peak and a two feet long heavy metal bar which had a handle wrapped of electric tape on the other end. On the other hand, the Nash had lots of practical stuff in the glove box and in the trunk there was a neat wooden tool box with some original tools and lot of spares each tagged with cardboard labels. One may assume one of the owners was a precise car person and the other may have been a reckless hoodlum...?

Yes, also in the generic Warner R10 manual told the same; SAE 40 straight engine oil would be the best recommendation, absolutely no EP additives because they provide risk to block the funnels to pinion bearings...

Tim, Would not know about FGL-80, my D24 books only state the 3-speed should eat 2 3/4 pints SAE90 cst oil... and R10 book calls for SAE40 oil. However, thanks for your advice, I think I most probably have GL1 stuff with me already. Penzoil is not common brand here, only sold by US cars specialized parts dealer at relatively high price. No problem finding corresponding synchromesh trans oil, though.

Should I keep my mouth shut because I do not know this as a fact? Only know that Dodge D24 of the same age has window trims wood grained the same color shades as the dash. I'd ASSUME the P15 Special DeLuxe would have the same thing...? However, here are plenty of good people who'd tell the facts reliable - let's invite them. Meanwhile, here's a magazine shot of 1948 P15: EDIT: Here in this below photo the door window trims appear different shade but same wood grained pattern... hmm?

Funny, I found only Jim's reply, started to write my continued question, went away to get a cup of coffee... When I hit return I found Shel's reply, which kind of already answered my second question. In case the mopar 3-speed can live with 90W and 10W (!?!), it obviously will do just fine with 40W as well. Just as Shel said. Well, these are great news to me. I'd get me a big barrell of straight mineral 40 weight motor oil and use it on the engine, 3-speed and OD! - simple and clean! I only drive in summertime, thus will not need multigrade in the engine either. That's another trick I learned by an old timer here in Finland: He remarked, that the 30's-50's flat head engines have not proper lubrication for the top of the engine, most important not for the valve guides. Back then, they relied on motor oil vaporization on working temperatures. Now, the modern oils are too good, on his opinion, there's not vaporization in the same extent as the oils tolerate much higher temperatures. Paradoxical, good modern oils are bad for the old engines. He strongly recommended sticking in basic single grade mineral oil. Yet more, Jim Richardson of Hemmings wrote in the H's Classic Car, that old engines would need zinc-sulfur compound in the motor oil to keep the contact surfaces from excessive wear. He wrote he ran one chevy 235 cam shaft lobes flat with modern oil without any zinc... (HCC issue 74, Nov.2010) Thus he recommends ZZDP additive in mineral oil. (Well, now I went off-topic in my own thread...)

Jim, That was exactly my point, I just was not 100% sure that they are the same can. Thus I was puzzled when Chrysler recommends 90 weight for the 3-speed but B&W recommends 40 weight for the R10. Have you seen any problems with the 40 weight on the 3-speed unit?

Dodge shop manual calls SAE 90 oil for the transmission lubricant. B&W R10 manual recommends SAE40 straight motor oil for the OD unit lubricant. In the Mopar 3-speed+R10 unit, do the lubricants mix - aren't the OD and 3-speed sealed in between? R10 manual allows heavy oil for extreme heat, but here in north those conditions do not exist. Does a heavy oil hinder the OD from working as quick as required? Would like to learn what do you use in your units? Experiences using different weight oils?

The cast pattern is almost made, however, I begun to worry to leave TOO MUCH turning allowance, the cast may be porous way inside... Thus I woud really need to know the offset distance from the propeller shaft flange inner face to the rear axle end of the brake drum outer shell.

The Terraplane looks just great - Would love one myself. Is this a Hudson as well? Nice body apart the missing bits on the A-pillars...

Up-date: Started making a cast pattern for the drum. Will leave generous machining allowance to adjust the axial location.

As you were, soldier, I was just pulling yer leg... ...could not resists to use the opportunity to feast the fart.

Oh, sorry, I missed to translate "fart", I thought it'd be self explaining...? You know, there a lot of fart involved in cars and traffic in Scandinavia. May even be partially reason for the man-made-climate problem. Well, after all it was Fredrik who said that... Whaddy I know... Fart is swedish for speed.

It's the same body as Fireball's coupe! Joy, Joy! Another great score for team Scandinavia! First, Let me provide translation of the above for non-swedish speaking members: Fredrik tells, that he lives in Lindköping and anticipates to se Mattias on some car meet (=träff) next summer, but that depends if Mattias will have time to put some fart to the coupe (=kupan). Once that's settled and clear to all, Let me wish you welcome to our merry crowd, Mattias - and congratulations; not only you've found an awesome cool & fun car, but also the best hobby car forum in the whole wide world. Here you'll find all the information you'll ever need to rod or restore your D24 and also great persons to chat with on long winter nights. Cheers, Farbror-Pekka-från Finland

I checked USPS and Fedex flat rate overseas parcel costs and came to conclusion, I probably will NOT afford to buy the park brake drum from there. (postage cost $75..100 !!!) No need to mention these are not particulary common over here, thus the third alternative is to fabricate one by myself. Shouldn't be too difficult a task, providing I would know the dimensions of a drum. I made the below sketch of the fluid drive negative offset drum. (dimensions are metric, it took me 2min to do it with a caliper, taking the dimensions roughly) If any of you gentlemen would take time to do similar sketch of the OD type of a drum, I would do a amateur cast and turn a drum for me.

Finally the original D24fluid drive parking brake drum (outside diam. is ca. 148mm roughly 5"27/32) 10 splines on the shaft.

Ok, do I need to move all the guts from my 3-speed to OD unit housing? I do not expect the 3-speed input gear wheel to match with the '53 OD trans synchro, if the synchro is big enough to stop the input coming out as per Kings photo shows. Below some pictures of my parts: - the date stamp on the assumed '53 OD unit. I cannot translate this to any year, to me it reads "7 13 54 K OD PT" last digits may be also RT or DT ? - what does this tell to you? Then the OD unit with the short input shaft on: View into the OD unit gear box with the input removed: The OD unit input g/wheel close up: The OD short input shaft removed: Compare to my original fluid drive input shaft (sitting tight on the 3-speed unit) My rough sketch of the dimensions of the fluid drive input stick out (dimensions are in mm) The stick-out total lenght from gear unit housing face (ca.292mm) is 11,5 inches - right?

Roadking, thank you for very thorough walk throught of the swap process. I belive these instructions will save my project. Yet I am thinking to simplify the process (possibly): What if after separating the transmission housing and OD, I would do the same with the original 3-speed and instead of pulling the input shaft would keep the input and counter shaft in their places and marry my original 3-speed with the main shaft sticking out from the separated OD unit? After all the 3-speed housings are the same and the counter shafts shoud as well be the same? Are there issues related to wear? - I mean; the gear wheels in each unit have been running against their mating wheels for 60+ years, thus they would better be married with original spouses than be introduced with cousins from the next unit? Regarding to the last picture, lever cable brackets - Yes, I will need one (do not have bracket yet) - The problem is, I'm overseas up north Finland, unless the bracet fits in an envelope, the shipping will cost quite much... No hurry, though, let me find out shipping alternatives first. Thanks, Pekka

I suppose the relevant question now would be: If I disassemble my original unit totally and get the input shaft unit out, would I still be able to use it in the '53 OD unit? If the two units are differently assembled, would the gear wheels be different, not interchangeable? Thanks for the tip, Roadking: Thus I need to find either an original OD unit drum or 1950 fluid drive unit drum. What about my brake shoe assembly - will I be able to re-use it with the OD unit, providing I will have a correct brake drum?

Rob, To answer your original question of the grooves: I just today took apart my D24 park brake. It has the same grooves, I belive they are manufactured, not worn. My drum has slight wear, small uneven grooves all around, but the ones on the side may be to keep the dirtoff from the center of the drum... whatever, manufactured. Cheers, Pekka