58prostreet Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Can a 218 flywheel be used on 230 motor. I have dodge with fluid drive. I want to convert to a regular transmission. Bob Quote
Jim Yergin Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Bob, My understanding is that the crank on the 230 is fractionally different in length than the 218 crank. The flywheel on the 230 is therefore different and the starter will not engage properly if you use a 218 flywheel with a 230 crank. Some one please correct me if I am wrong. Jim Yergin Quote
grey beard Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 There is also the issue of a pilot bearing, which was not used on fluid drive unitsk but is necessary with standard shift. My understanding is that the crank may need to be drilled for this, but I have no personal experience from which to quote. Please let us know what you finally do in this issue. Quote
blueskies Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Jim is correct... The flange on the 230 crank is about 3/16" thicker than the flange on the 218 crank. The 230 flywheel has a machined recess of the same 3/16" to recieve the additional crank thickness, keeping the position of the flywheel relative to the starter, the same for both versions. If you use the 218 flywheel on the 230 crank, the starter reach will be 3/16" short, because the flywheel will be set back toward the rear of the car by the same amount. Don Coatney used a 218 flywheel on his 251, which has the same issue. Instead of changing the flywheel, he recessed the starter into the face of the bell housing to compensate. Pete Quote
greg g Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Suppose you could also have the 3/16 milled off the crank flange. I have a 230 plymouth engine my car. The extra beef is for dealing with the additional weight and rotating mass of the fluid drive. If you're not going FD I would think you could adress the situation in any number of the way mentioned. I mixed and matched things but I used the same flywheel that came with the 230. But the rest of my 218 stuff bolted up with no issues. Quote
49DODGEBOY Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Suppose you could also have the 3/16 milled off the crank flange. I have a 230 plymouth engine my car. The extra beef is for dealing with the additional weight and rotating mass of the fluid drive. If you're not going FD I would think you could adress the situation in any number of the way mentioned. I mixed and matched things but I used the same flywheel that came with the 230. But the rest of my 218 stuff bolted up with no issues. So does the crankshaft of the 230 that came factory with the 3-speed have the same "mass", IE fluid drive and manual = same flywheel? Quote
wayfarer Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Does anyone know if this 'fat' flange issue shows up with any other cranks? Quote
58prostreet Posted February 1, 2008 Author Report Posted February 1, 2008 I have never worked with any of these engines or transmissions before...All I have learned has come almost 100% from this forum and for that I am very thankful...That being said is there enough material in center of flywheel to take out the 3/16" for starter engagement? I also understand that the 218 only has 4 bolt holes for attachment to crank. Are 4 enough, or do I need to have 4 more holes drilled to utilize the 8 holes in 230 crank? It sounds like I should try to find a 230 flywheel...Does anyone know of a source for them? Thanks for everyones help and attetion...It is appreciated Bob Quote
james curl Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 I have a 41 Dodge 218 fluid drive 8-hole crank with a 48 Plymouth 218 4-hole flywheel installed on it and have not experienced any problems. I guess ignorance is bliss Quote
Jim Yergin Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Vintage Power Wagons sells the 230 flywheel. http://www.vintagepowerwagons.com/products/parts/group1-engine.htm Jim Yergin Quote
blueskies Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Vintage Power Wagons sells the 230 flywheel.http://www.vintagepowerwagons.com/products/parts/group1-engine.htm Jim Yergin Bought mine from VPW. Make sure they know you are using a passenger car clutch. My original 218 flywheel was drilled for both the 9 1/4" clutch, and the 10" clutch. I assumed that the 230 flywheel that I got from VPW would be the same, but it was only drilled for the 10" truck clutch. I had to have a local machine shop drill and tap for the smaller clutch. Pete Quote
Don Coatney Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Don Coatney used a 218 flywheel on his 251, which has the same issue. Instead of changing the flywheel, he recessed the starter into the face of the bell housing to compensate.Pete Pete is correct. This is what I did I have never worked with any of these engines or transmissions before. I also understand that the 218 only has 4 bolt holes for attachment to crank. Four bolts are all that is required for a non fluid drive standard transmission. If you are using a fluid drive 8 bolts are required. If you only use 4 bolts on a fluid drive it will fail. I used an 8 bolt crankshaft with a 4 bolt flywheel and a non fluid drive. Worked well for me. Quote
58prostreet Posted February 2, 2008 Author Report Posted February 2, 2008 Thanks for all the good info...Don, did u have to drill end of crank shaft for pilot bearing on ur motor? Quote
Dodgeb4ya Posted February 2, 2008 Report Posted February 2, 2008 I put a "265 Chrysler 6" 8 hole crank in my 52 dodge pu and used the original 218 3 speed 4 hole flywheel set up W/ no problems. Up to 48 a wide ring gear is used and 1949 and later a thinner ring gear I think 3/8" is used through 1954. You have to watch clutch cover clearance and use at least "grade 5" nuts/bolts for the flywheel. I`ve done a few of these years past. Bob Quote
Don Coatney Posted February 2, 2008 Report Posted February 2, 2008 Thanks for all the good info...Don, did u have to drill end of crank shaft for pilot bearing on ur motor? No, I designed and built this bearing mount. Quote
Normspeed Posted February 2, 2008 Report Posted February 2, 2008 Don, a roller pilot bearing, that is neat. Quote
49DODGEBOY Posted February 2, 2008 Report Posted February 2, 2008 Hey Don Your work is always imaculate (sp) Are you a machinist by trade? Quote
Don Coatney Posted February 2, 2008 Report Posted February 2, 2008 Hey DonYour work is always imaculate (sp) Are you a machinist by trade? No. I shread mad money for the Federal Reserve Bank:cool: Quote
wayfarer Posted February 5, 2008 Report Posted February 5, 2008 Can anyone provide some basic dimensional data for this flywheel issue? Flange thickness of each style and distance from face of flange to face of block of each. Many Thanks Quote
Don Coatney Posted February 5, 2008 Report Posted February 5, 2008 Can anyone provide some basic dimensional data for this flywheel issue?Flange thickness of each style and distance from face of flange to face of block of each. Many Thanks You might find what you are looking for in my Photobucket T-5 album linked below. Quote
wayfarer Posted February 6, 2008 Report Posted February 6, 2008 OK Don, but linked below what ??? Quote
wayfarer Posted February 6, 2008 Report Posted February 6, 2008 OK, found your link, but you have no dimensional or comparison info. If someone has an engine out, on a stand, etc., help would be appreciated. Quote
Don Coatney Posted February 6, 2008 Report Posted February 6, 2008 OK, found your link, but you have no dimensional or comparison info.If someone has an engine out, on a stand, etc., help would be appreciated. I took my own measurements and designed what would work for my specific application. Suggest you do the same. Any measurements someone gives you most likely will not work for your specific application and combination of parts. You must fully understand your objective and make it work with a "failure is not an option" attitude. Quote
wayfarer Posted February 7, 2008 Report Posted February 7, 2008 Just looking for NUMBERS to compare the differences... Quote
wayfarer Posted February 8, 2008 Report Posted February 8, 2008 ...still looking for some numbers if anyone can help. thanks Quote
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