harmony Posted November 13, 2023 Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 Hi Guys I may be on the verge of buying a 1941 Fargo. I went to look at it today and the guy didn't really know to much about it but he said the guy he bought it from several years ago said it needed a complete brake job and that everything was missing. I didn't pull one of the wheels to have a look and I didn't think to look on the back side of the wheels. So in hindsight I'm now wondering if it also needed backing plates. I see that there is a complete brake parts for sale on ebay for 750 US. Is that a fair price for everything? It's providing everything except the brake lines and the backing plates. I tried searching on line for backing plates and didn't have any success. I'm not even sure what size brakes they are. 10"? 11"? They wouldn't be 12" like my 48 Windsor would they? Would any backing plate from 41-47 dodge or fargo work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Roberts Posted November 13, 2023 Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 Can you call the seller and ask him to look underneath to see if the backing plates are there ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 20, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2023 On 11/13/2023 at 7:14 AM, Jerry Roberts said: Can you call the seller and ask him to look underneath to see if the backing plates are there ? Yes I did that and he texted me back and told me that he found all the brake parts including the backing plates. They had been taken off the truck by the previous owner. I haven't gone back to have a look at them, but I'm assuming the master cylinder and wheel cylinders all need to be replaced or rebuilt. As well as the rubber flex brake lines would need to be replaced. I see that you have a 41 Plymouth pickup. Besides the badging and the engine, and the tailgate, are there any other differences between the two trucks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Roberts Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 17 hours ago, harmony said: I see that you have a 41 Plymouth pickup. Besides the badging and the engine, and the tailgate, are there any other differences between the two trucks? Differences between the 1941 Plymouth and 1941 Dodge pickups ; The front grills are different , sometimes there were scripts on the tailgates , engines were the same , the Plymouth 3 speed trans was syncro in 2 nd & 3 rd and the 3 speed Dodge was not . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 21, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 30 minutes ago, Jerry Roberts said: Differences between the 1941 Plymouth and 1941 Dodge pickups ; The front grills are different , sometimes there were scripts on the tailgates , engines were the same , the Plymouth 3 speed trans was syncro in 2 nd & 3 rd and the 3 speed Dodge was not . That's interesting about the syncro in the trans. I'm wondering if there was a difference between the dodge and the fargo as far as trans syncro goes. Any Plymouth tailgates I've seen had the raised stamp Plymouth word. The tailgate on this Fargo I'm looking at is plain. I've yet to see confirmed '41 Fargo that had stamped Fargo on the tailgate though. It was my understanding that the '41 Plymouth had a 201 engine. The 41 Fargo had a 251. I've verified that by measuring the length of the head, that being 25 1/2". I actually have a spare 251 in my shop, so that's a bit of a bonus if I decide to buy this Fargo. As for the grill can you point out the differences for me please. Apart from the wording on the garnishing, I can't seem to see a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Roberts Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 3 hours ago, harmony said: As for the grill can you point out the differences for me please. Apart from the wording on the garnishing, I can't seem to see a difference. The first photo is Dodge and the second photo is Plymouth . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 21, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Jerry Roberts said: The first photo is Dodge and the second photo is Plymouth . The truck I'm thinking about buying is a Fargo not a Dodge. Like I said, as far as I can tell the grills are the same except for the difference in the name on the garnishing trim piece. Edited November 21, 2023 by harmony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Roberts Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 8 hours ago, harmony said: The truck I'm thinking about buying is a Fargo not a Dodge. Like I said, as far as I can tell the grills are the same except for the difference in the name on the garnishing trim piece. Sorry , If I would have gone back to the beginning of your thread , i would have clearly seen that you were talking about a Fargo . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 26, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 (edited) I'm still sitting on the fence about buying the '41 Fargo. It's not a runner but the engine is loose. I'm curious about the engine. I measured it and the head is 25 in long. But it doesn't have Spitfire on the head. Does that indicate anything? The truck is in a container with no lighting and it's right up against the wall on the passenger side so I can't get any pictures from that side of the engine. I'm aware of the trick of putting a long wooden dowel down the hole in the head at the top of the 5th or is it the 6th cylinder, after taking out that plug to measure the stroke. But that might be a lot of work trying to rotate that engine with the fan. The trucks been sitting for a couple years. If the engine is a 251, I have a spare 251 engine in my shop, so that's an added bonus. Being that the truck was made in Windsor Ontario Canada, it would stand to reason that the engine is a 251. But could it also be a 265? Or the fact that it doesn't have Spitfire on the head, change everything? Edited November 26, 2023 by harmony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Ed Posted November 26, 2023 Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 If you like the truck I wouldn't worry too much about the engine. Even if it's one of the smaller displacements your 251 will swap in place of another 25" block. How is the body? Anything obvious missing? Rust? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 26, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Young Ed said: If you like the truck I wouldn't worry too much about the engine. Even if it's one of the smaller displacements your 251 will swap in place of another 25" block. How is the body? Anything obvious missing? Rust? The body is actually really sound. A fender bender on one of the front fenders which has been dollied out to match the original shape, but not finished off. No bondo or any body repairs. The grill is not damaged at all. The only rust is on the drivers side running board. They have rotted right through right where the two running board support brackets are. it is missing the Fargo script/globe hood side emblems and they seem impossible to find on line. No seat, no gas tank, no bed at all. I wouldn't restore it. I'd just get it back on the road as a survivor. Lots of nature steel (bare metal) body patina and some spray paint over the years that wasn't a perfect original match in places. It's never had turn signals and of course it's still 6 volt. Tailgate is straight and in good shape. No dints anywhere other than that front fender that was dollied out. I might try to do a better job flattening out that steel on the fender. The current owner has no idea what condition the 3 speed transmission is in. The drivers windshield is broken. I had a look at the frame, and I'm not sure how it comes out of there. I'd probably remove the entire flip out window and replace the entire rubber seal while I replaced that windshield. The engine compartment seems complete. It's very similar to my 48 Windsor so nothing seemed to be missing. It's running a Carter B&B carb, but I'm not quite sure which model. The honeycomb radiator looks perfect. One interesting feature is that on the front bumper, there are 3 bumperette. Any pictures I've ever seen of these trucks, they only have two. So the centre one has a hole in the middle of it for the engine crank handle to go through. It has 5 bolt 15in. wheels. I'm not sure if that was stock or not on the half tons back then. But I have a set of extra 15in. rims for my 48 Windsor so I have no shortage of spare wheels. But it does need tires, even though they have held air for a couple years while stored in the container, I can see the sidewalls are starting to crack. One other good thing is the drivers door opens and closes like the day it came off the assembly line and both door handles don't droop down. All and all it's a pretty decent truck. But just like everyone else these days he's asking too much for a truck that doesn't have brakes, and isn't in running condition. Edited November 26, 2023 by harmony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Ed Posted November 26, 2023 Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 I was going to ask about the windshield frame. They are rust prone and expensive to replace! These trucks are gaining popularity which means availability of aftermarket parts is up but so are prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 26, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Young Ed said: I was going to ask about the windshield frame. They are rust prone and expensive to replace! These trucks are gaining popularity which means availability of aftermarket parts is up but so are prices. As I mentioned the lighting in that 40 foot container was only from my phone. I couldn't see exactly how the glass was mounted. Is there an outside frame and an inside frame, sandwiching the glass? Yes there was some crusty loose rust around that frame for sure. Looks like I just answered my question by a diagram and images from DCM. Looks like the frame is a channel and the frame is in two sections. The glass is slid in from the centre. Meaning in order to replace the glass, you have to be able to carefully slide the old glass out of that crusty frame. So the condition of that frame is quite important. The reproduction frame, glass and seal is about $1500- $2000 CAD. delivered. Yikes !!! If it needs a regulator, that's another $500. Edited November 26, 2023 by harmony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Roberts Posted November 26, 2023 Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 3 hours ago, harmony said: .... Meaning in order to replace the glass, you have to be able to carefully slide the old glass out of that crusty frame.... Usually you have to get very aggressive to prepare the frame for new glass . Break the old glass with a hammer , use a propane torch to remove the old seal . . The four little machine screws that hold the two sides of the frame together can get very stuck too . They thread into a small bar . If I remember correctly the thread size is 10-32 . 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmony Posted November 26, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 7 minutes ago, Jerry Roberts said: Usually you have to get very aggressive to prepare the frame for new glass . Break the old glass with a hammer , use a propane torch to remove the old seal . . The four little machine screws that hold the two sides of the frame together can get very stuck too . They thread into a small bar . If I remember correctly the thread size is 10-32 . It would be nice to be able to get at least one window out in one piece, to use as a pattern. The truck only needs the drivers side. But if I went to that much effort, I might as well replace both windshields. As for a new seal, would one use something like 3M 08008? That's what Steele Rubber always recommends when working with their rubber seal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Roberts Posted November 27, 2023 Report Share Posted November 27, 2023 There are two seals , one between the glass and the windshield frame , the other seal goes between the windshield frame and the body . I think that the original just kind of folded in place around the glass but I think that you would get the best seal by more or less glueing the glass in place with a thick liquid sealer . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Ed Posted November 27, 2023 Report Share Posted November 27, 2023 Yes the original glass to channel seal was just that tar paper looking stuff and I believe a lot of guys just glue them in. There is then a molded seal for windshield frame to body. Can you go see it again and bring a better light and be armed with what we mentioned to check? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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