Well, how's the rebuilt engine look?

[47heaven]

Here are some pics of my rebuilt engine. Again, I have a P15, but when I got it there already was a 1955 Plymouth engine in the car. When I took it in to be rebuilt, the mechanic discovered that it was already bored at .060 and taking it to .080 would have been risky for overheating, in his opinion. Sleeves were an option, but a very expensive one. Luckily, he was told about a woman that had an engine and other Plymouth parts for sale. Long story short...we found a 1949 Dodge engine and an OD trans there and bought both for $300. Turns out that the engine was in good shape and only bored at .040 and would be able to be bored to .060. Nonetheless, the engine was machined and rebuilt with new parts, but he still used the crank from the '55 engine that was used previously so that it had better horsepower. He also kept the '55 head because it was in better shape. The OD was still in great shape, but needed major cleaning.

Below are pics of the end result. See what you think.

PS: I know thw air cleaner isn't correct because that was on the '55. I thought of putting an oil bath one on, but this is less messy.

[Don Coatney]

Darin;

Your engine looks very good. Couple of questions. I see you are using an internal thermostat by-pass system. There is a recent thread on the pilothouse side of this forum discussing the differences in an internal and external by-pass system. Of note it was discussed that the 53 and newer engine blocks had an extra water port to accomodate the internal by-pass system. As your engine block is now a 49 Dodge does it have the extra water port for the internal by-pass system? Another difference is the back plate on the water pump. An extra hole is required to use the internal by-pass system. Is your water pump new or was it on the 55 plymouth engine?

Also how did using the 55 Plymouth crankshaft increase the horsepower?

[Mr. Belvedere]

The engine looks great! But more importantly does she run as good as she looks? I guess the mechanic took care of your freeze plug issue and everything is right with the world now?

[woodscavenger]

Awesome story. How's it run? How's it sound?

Now for the real question for anyone else contemplating such a move.....how much $$$$$$?

[Young Ed]

If the 49 was a 218 and the 55 a 230 then using the 55 crank(and rods) would get you a little more HP.

[Mr. Belvedere]

You know its funny, I talked to a guy a while back who has had both a 230 and 218 in the same car and both were completely stock. He said the power difference between them is negligable. I tend to agree, not from personal experiance not with these particular engines, but from a couple of fords I had. Two of the same car, one had a 200 6cyl the other was a 250 6cyl. I really could not tell much difference at all, except in gas mileage. There was a much bigger spread between them, than a 218 vs a 230.

[Don Coatney]

If the 49 was a 218 and the 55 a 230 then using the 55 crank(and rods) would get you a little more HP.

Ed;

The 49 was a Dodge and should have been a 230 same as the 55.

[Young Ed]

Thats why I said if I was thinking they were both 230 and it really did nothing for HP. The 55 one was probably just in better shape.

[BobT-47P15]

Darin, I see an alternator......can't recall, did you go to 12V or is this a 6V alternator?

[Don Coatney]

Darin, I see an alternator......can't recall, did you go to 12V or is this a 6V alternator?

Bob;

Look at the battery. It is 12 volts. Also follow the red battery cable running from the negative battery post to the engine head bolt. Negative ground. And all this time Darin said he did not want to hot rod his car:D

[blueskies]

Below are pics of the end result. S

Looks great! Now get behind the wheel and put some miles on it!

Pete

[47heaven]

Darin;

Your engine looks very good. Couple of questions. I see you are using an internal thermostat by-pass system. There is a recent thread on the pilothouse side of this forum discussing the differences in an internal and external by-pass system. Of note it was discussed that the 53 and newer engine blocks had an extra water port to accomodate the internal by-pass system. As your engine block is now a 49 Dodge does it have the extra water port for the internal by-pass system? Another difference is the back plate on the water pump. An extra hole is required to use the internal by-pass system. Is your water pump new or was it on the 55 plymouth engine?

Also how did using the 55 Plymouth crankshaft increase the horsepower?

Hi Don...I'm going to sound very naive here, but what is the internal thermostat by-pass system? You are going to have to school me on what that is. I mean, I may know already, but just not by that name...who knows! As far as the water pump...it's new. The one on the '55 had some life to it when I bought it, but died soon after.

I was told that the '55 crank was more powerful than the '49 Dodge one and it was also in the better shape of the two.

[47heaven]

The engine looks great! But more importantly does she run as good as she looks? I guess the mechanic took care of your freeze plug issue and everything is right with the world now?

Yeah, Robert...the freeze plug isssue was taken care of. The mechanic told me what might've pushed that one out is pressure that could have been in the block from when his other mechanic added the water and anti-freeze and forgot to release the trapped air by losening the heater hose a bit. That is something I didn't know. I took it over to Norm's and he said she sounds and runs nice, in his opinion. I think it sounds good and the glass pack on it gives it a nice, throaty sound. Let me know how this weekend is and I'll drive it out and show you so you can see for yourself. It should be a nice weekend for a drive anyway.

[47heaven]

Thats why I said if I was thinking they were both 230 and it really did nothing for HP. The 55 one was probably just in better shape.

Hard to tell. The '55 crank was in better shape. Even though they are the same size engine, the '49 originally had 103 hp and the '55 had 115 hp...so something gave it more uuuumff!

[47heaven]

Darin, I see an alternator......can't recall, did you go to 12V or is this a 6V alternator?

Bob...yeah, went to 12v not long after I bought it. I was told that the 12v, one wire alternator was the best route to go, and so far it has been. I had to do it anyway because I bought a 12v wiring harness, and installed the electronic ignition. Also, have a CD player in thee...so the 6v wouldn't have been usefull anymore.

[47heaven]

Looks great! Now get behind the wheel and put some miles on it!

Pete

Pete...that's the plan, but I need to get this carburator and fuel gauge issues solved before real long trips. Someone on here mentioned that they might have a carburator for the '49 engine, but that's all I ever heard about it. I inquired about it, but never heard back. Are there other one barrel carbs I can put on there besides a Carter?

[Don Coatney]

Hi Don...I'm going to sound very naive here' date=' but what is the internal thermostat by-pass system? You are going to have to school me on what that is. I mean, I may know already, but just not by that name...who knows! As far as the water pump...it's new. The one on the '55 had some life to it when I bought it, but died soon after.

I was told that the '55 crank was more powerful than the '49 Dodge one and it was also in the better shape of the two.[/quote']

Darin;

Follow this link and read the thread.

http://www430.pair.com/p15d24/mopar_forum/showthread.php?t=6119

The prime reason the 55 engine had a higher horse power rating is in the head. The compression ratio was higher.

[central52]

Hold on there, what's this about "releasing trapped air by loosening the heater hose a bit" concerning adding anti-freeze to the radiator. Is this normal procedure? I thought all you do is put it in and that's it. Ed P.

[Don Coatney]

Yeah' date=' Robert...the freeze plug isssue was taken care of. The mechanic told me what might've pushed that one out is pressure that could have been in the block from when his other mechanic added the water and anti-freeze and forgot to release the trapped air by losening the heater hose a bit. That is something I didn't know. I took it over to Norm's and he said she sounds and runs nice, in his opinion. I think it sounds good and the glass pack on it gives it a nice, throaty sound. Let me know how this weekend is and I'll drive it out and show you so you can see for yourself. It should be a nice weekend for a drive anyway.[/quote']

Just a thought. It may have built up pressure not from air in the system but from pressure build up due to no working thermostat by-pass. I dont know if this is the case but it is worth a look.

[Normspeed]

Guys, I may be wrong on this (I think I was wrong once before, back in 1957:) ) But I think the purpose of the bypass is simply to allow the heater to work before the thermostat opens. There is not a lot of water circulation until the thermostat opens, but with the bypass, some warm water is pumped to the heater circuit before the thermostat opens so you don't have to sit and shiver until the motor reaches operating temp. I don't think the bypass has any effect on actual engine cooling. Just my $0.02.

[Don Coatney]

Guys, I may be wrong on this (I think I was wrong once before, back in 1957:) ) But I think the purpose of the bypass is simply to allow the heater to work before the thermostat opens. There is not a lot of water circulation until the thermostat opens, but with the bypass, some warm water is pumped to the heater circuit before the thermostat opens so you don't have to sit and shiver until the motor reaches operating temp. I don't think the bypass has any effect on actual engine cooling. Just my $0.02.

Norm;

If that were the case why would there be a by-pass on a car that is not equipped with a heater? I think the by-pass is to circulate water in the engine only and not through the radiator until the thermostat opens and allows water to circulate through the radiator.

[Normspeed]

But, in the photo, it looks like the water pump would force water into the bypass hose, above the thermostat, then into the upper rad hose which dumps into the top of the radiator. Then it would go through the radiator, out the bottom rad hose, and back to the water pump without reaching the water jacket. I don't see how it could circulate water in the block.

[BobT-47P15]

1. A cooling system for an automobile engine having a water jacket, a radiator, a water pump, and a thermostat housing, comprising:

a first passage communicating an upper outlet of the water jacket with an inlet of the radiator provided at a lower portion thereof;

a second passage communicating an upper outlet of the radiator with an inlet of the water pump and having the thermostat housing at the upstream of the pump;

an outlet of the pump being communicated with a lower inlet of the water jacket;

a bypass connected between the first passage and the thermostat housing;

a thermostat comprising a thermo-sensitive device, a first valve and a second valve disposed in the thermostat housing, both the valves being operatively connected to the thermo-sensitive device, so that the first valve closes the second passage and the second valve opens the bypass;

the thermo-sensitive device being disposed in the bypass and the first and second valves being operated by the operation of the thermo-sensitive device.

2. A cooling system for an automobile engine having water jackets, a radiator, a water pump, and a thermostat housing, comprising:

a first passage communicating an outlet of the water jackets with an inlet of the radiator;

a second passage communicating an outlet of the radiator with an inlet of the water pump and having the thermostat housing at the upstream of the pump;

a bypass connected between the first passage and the thermostat housing;

a thermostat comprising a thermo-sensitive device and a first valve and disposed in the thermostat housing, so that the first valve closes the second passage,

the thermo-sensitive device being disposed in the bypass adjacent the junction of the bypass and the thermostat housing so that the thermo-sensitive device is exposed to coolant passing the junction, and

the inlet of the radiator is provided at a lower position thereof.

3. A cooling system for an automobile engine having water jackets, a radiator, a water pump, and a thermostat housing, comprising:

a first passage communicating an outlet of the water jackets with an inlet of the radiator;

a second passage communicating an outlet of the radiator with an inlet of the water pump and having the thermostat housing at the upstream of the pump;

a bypass connected between the first passage and the thermostat housing;

a thermostat comprising a thermo-sensitive device and a first valve and disposed in the thermostat housing, so that the first valve closes the second passage,

the thermo-sensitive device being disposed in the bypass adjacent the junction of the bypass and the thermostat housing so that the thermo-sensitive device is exposed to coolant passing the junction, and

the first valve is provided at an upper position in the thermostat.

Also this in a little more compact form:

A cooling system for an internal combustion engine has a water jacket connected to a radiator with upper and lower radiator passages for cooling coolant leaving the engine and a water pump in the lower radiator passage for circulating coolant through the water jacket. A bypass passage connects the upper radiator passage to the lower radiator passage for the circulation of coolant through the water jacket bypassing the radiator. A first thermostat valve in the upper radiator passage closes the upper radiator passage and opens the bypass passage when the coolant is lower than a predetermined low temperature and the engine is operated in a low engine load range so as to permit the circulation of coolant through the bypass passage bypassing the bypass passage. A second thermostat valve in the upper radiator passage opens the upper radiator passage and closes the bypass passage when the coolant is higher than a predetermined high temperature and the engine is operated with a rapid change of engine load so as to interrupt the circulation of coolant bypassing the bypass passage.

[Merle Coggins]

There's a lot of communicating going on there. I think I need to get a lawer to figure it all out.

[Normspeed]

My brain hurts!