53 Chrysler Spitfire engine in a 50 Meadowbrook

[meadowbrook]

Hi. Would anyone know if a Spitfire engine from a 53 Chrysler bolt into a 50 Meadowbrook?

[Andydodge]

Well, in theory with a bit of adjusting it should....if the Meadowbrook was built in Canada it would have had a 25" engine originally and the same possibily here in Oz.......if a USA build then you will have to move the radiator and see how the front engine mount bracket fits, also whether the sump clears the tie rods and steering etc...........the ideal would be to find a Canadian built 49-50 Dodge or Plymouth and compare installations..........lol..........andyd   

[dpollo]

Andy is correct  but many people, including me , have put the longer engine in their Dodge or Plymouth.  Everything, in your proposed swap will fit except provision must be made for the extra length.  this is not so very difficult but will include moving the radiator forward  and possibly making more room for the crankshaft pulley  . The tie rod may hit the oil pan but this can be corrected with a minor reshaping of the pan.  

If you have a contact in Canada, the Canadian radiator from any 6 cylinder Desoto or Chrysler would be helpful  as well as the oil pan from a 53  or 54 Canadian Dodge or Plymouth.   The extra weight of the longer engine will not be an issue but was compensated for in Canadian cars by using beefier front springs and a needle bearing in the upper king pin.

[Andydodge]

Dpollo..........that king pin needle bearing thing is interesting....had not heard of that before...........andyd

[meadowbrook]

Mechanically, are the Spitfire engine components as available as the 230?

[Andydodge]

As a general guide I'd think that the 25" parts should be as available but as they were specifically for the DeSoto/Chrysler cars in the USA and they were not as widespread as the Dodge/Plymouth then that would result in a smaller amount....tho' they should be common in Canada as they only got the 25" engine.....from what I've seen here on this forum the "Spitfire" branded cylinder head was Chrysler only and from 46 to 53/54...........dunno if this helps................andyd      

[Adam H P15 D30]

10 hours ago, Andydodge said:

Dpollo..........that king pin needle bearing thing is interesting....had not heard of that before...........andyd

Dpollo, you have my full attention also...  Please elaborate.  Would love to add this to my Dodge

Edited November 7, 2019 by Adam H P15 D30

[Dodgeb4ya]

Upper Needle bearing...lower bushing steering knuckles are different than the more common upper/ lower bronze bushing knuckles. This on the D24 cars.

D24's came both ways. Bore size for the steel backed needle bearing is different than the bushing.

[Don Coatney]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Don Coatney]

 

 

 

[chrysler1941]

20 hours ago, Andydodge said:

As a general guide I'd think that the 25" parts should be as available but as they were specifically for the DeSoto/Chrysler cars in the USA and they were not as widespread as the Dodge/Plymouth then that would result in a smaller amount....tho' they should be common in Canada as they only got the 25" engine.....from what I've seen here on this forum the "Spitfire" branded cylinder head was Chrysler only and from 46 to 53/54...........dunno if this helps................andyd      

 

 Spitfire goes back to 1941 ?

[meadowbrook]

Thanks so much for the responses. Sounds like it’s more trouble than it’s worth. 

[Don Coatney]

8 hours ago, meadowbrook said:

Thanks so much for the responses. Sounds like it’s more trouble than it’s worth. 

 

Trust me it is well worth doing.

[meadowbrook]

Why? 

[Don Coatney]

5 hours ago, meadowbrook said:

Why? 

 

Grater horse power and greater torque.

[dpollo]

On 11/6/2019 at 8:50 PM, Andydodge said:

Dpollo..........that king pin needle bearing thing is interesting....had not heard of that before...........andyd

 before I actually got a US built car,  I assumed they all had  needle bearings in the upper king pin pivots.  Read what Dodgeb4ya has to say.  The king pin itself is the same diameter and I have never tried to substitute a bronze bushing for the needle bearing.  I have several unopened kits as well as several opened ones and it seems to me that the better kits contained both bronze and needle type bearings.     ( just to save anyone asking, I have no parts for sale)

[Dodgeb4ya]

I had a guy in need of a D24 needle bearing knuckle. He brought it in and I had a standard bushing knuckle...measured both types and found the needle bearing knuckle bore was larger than the bushing bore knuckle. Couldn't help him in his hunt for the needle knuckle. 

[Loren]

Back to the question of is it worth the effort to swap to a Chrysler engine.

That’s kind of a personal judgement. My college 1949 Plymouth I was told would last forever if I drove it easy and never over 55 mph.

I did as instructed and it never gave me a lick of trouble. But I always wondered what was the difference between a Plymouth 6 and a Chrysler 6 was. All the Chryslers in my family were driven at highway speeds or more (65 mph+) and never had any problems. The answer was, “Well the Chrysler was designed later and it has a larger displacement, plus it is the flagship brand with the founder’s name on it.” 

Of all the Chrysler products I’ve always liked the Plymouths and of all the Plymouths (I could afford) I liked the 1949-54 models especially the Suburbans and Business Coupes. So when I decided to finally restore my Suburban I wanted it to be the ultimate example. Still period correct, a 6 cylinder engine and drum brakes were absolute specs. Most folks look at a flathead 6 and they can’t tell a Plymouth from a Chrysler. When they see drum brakes the same thing applies. I could never put a V8 in my car. That would be an admission of a lack of imagination and skill.

[meadowbrook]

I just asked because I’m not sure the Chrysler engine has that much more power and I could more easily upgrade the 230. 

[dpollo]

The 230 will perform well.   The 251/265 will perform better but may not be worth the effort of installing it.  An overdrive will greatly enhance the performance of both engines.