Looking for a good oil

[Mopar Wayne]

What oil do you recommend for my 48 230 flat head six. The manual calls for something that is no longer produced and to add some refined kerosene if needed. I would really rather not do this. lol. Wondering what new technology oil I should use.

[John Fleming]

I  use SAE 30 detergent oil .    API service SN     I live in South Florida and use the same type of oil year round. 

[knuckleharley]

Your manual says to use 30 weight or 40 weight non-detergent oil,and you can buy it at any auto parts store in the nation. I buy it by the case from amazon because it's cheaper and more convenient.

Tractor dealers stock it,too.

If you live in an area that is hot in the summer and cold in the winter,you use the 40 wt in the summer and the 30 wt in the  winter.

IF your engine has NOT been rebuilt or ran using high-detergent oil by the previous owner,it is not a good idea to just switch to 30 wt HD  oil because there will be a ton of accumulated sludge in your engine,and if you break it all free all at once you had better be prepared too change the oil and filter multiple times before you drive it. Start it up and sit in the drivers seat and keep an eye on your oil pressure gauge. Once it gets to normal temps the oil pressure will stabalize. Watch the guage,and when it drops down to 20 lbs (a number I pulled out of thin air), turn the  engine off immediately,and change the oil and filter again.

Repeat until the  oil pressure stops dropping.

There was no such thing as detergent oil when your car was new. The non-detergent oil allows any trash in the oil to drop down to the base,where it is supposed to drain away when you drain the  oil for a oil change. The filter is  supposed to catch any too light too drop to the bottom of the oil pan.

 

This is what and why they were talking about adding a quart of kerosene to the oil before changing it. The kerosene would wash away and sludge stuck to the block and allow it to drain away. Works fine,but the key is to watch the oil pressure gauge while you are running the engine with the kerosene in it.

Modern detergent oils loosen the sludge,just like kerosene.

 

This system worked good as long as you kept changing the oil and filter at recommended intervals,but the cars get old and start to burn a little oil,and the 3rd or 4th owner isn't as likely to keep up with the maintenance.

There are going to be people that will tell  you I am full of crap,and they switched over to modern 10w-30 or whatever detergent oil without doing any of that stuff,and things went perfectly.

Believe whoever you want to believe.

As for me,I run 30 and 40 weight non-detergent in my old flathead engines until and unless they are rebuilt of have at least had the oil pans pulled,the oil pumps rebuilt,and everything cleaned while it was apart.

One they are clean,I run 15w-40 Mobile Delvac  high detergent oil in mine. I use it because because  I have had excellent service with it in my diesel engines in my trucks and tractors,and I have faith in it.

I use the Moble 1 Turbo Diesel oil in my two diesel pu's,and am convinced it is the finest oil on the market.  I will use it in any old engines I rebuild or clean out in the future.  Had a few cases of Delvac sitting on the shelf that I wasn't using in my trucks,so  I used it in my non-rebuilt engines.

Listen to what the other people tell after reading this ,and do whatever makes the most sense to you.

Once again,the key is keeping an eye on your oil pressure gauge.

Edited October 19, 2017 by knuckleharley

[Mike36]

Knuckle, in your fourth paragraph, don't you mean non detergent oil ?

[knuckleharley]

18 minutes ago, Mike36 said:

Knuckle, in your fourth paragraph, don't you mean non detergent oil ?

Thanks for the heads up. I hope I have now cleared up the confusing sentence.

[keithb7]

I have witnessed this sludge in my 265. When I was in the valves. I suspected this same sludge would be in my oil pan. I bought the car in May. I did an oil change this summer. I used a new oil like a 10W30, if I recall. I do watch my oil pressure gauge. I had not seen a drop in pressure at all yet up to this point.  I do understand what has been said above, about breaking down the sludge. It makes sense that new oil will do this. It's probably just not happened to me yet. 

Now that winter is here in my neck of the woods, my car is pretty well parked for the year. I think I'll pull the pan and get all this sludge out. Wipe up everything I can see, and touch. Heck maybe I should drop in new bottom bearings! While I am in there.

Keith

[Dodgeb4ya]

Well if you really really really need to know about oil...

Sit down for awhile and learn everything you always wanted to know about oil>>>>>>>>>>>>>>https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/2013/06/20/motor-oil-wear-test-ranking/

[Branded]

8 hours ago, keithb7 said:

 

Now that winter is here in my neck of the woods, my car is pretty well parked for the year. I think I'll pull the pan and get all this sludge out. Wipe up everything I can see, and touch. Heck maybe I should drop in new bottom bearings! While I am in there.

Keith

Remove the pickup while you have the pan off because it will be full of crud too. Uncrimp the pickup housing that holds the screen and clean behind it, the screen is easily removed.

[Mike36]

At the last oil change on my 230, I stuck my finger in the drain opening to feel for sludge, after the oil had all drained. Yuk !  Sludge was close to 1/4 in deep. I dropped the pan and cleaned the mess out. Then pulled the valve covers, found the same mess. Cleaned out all I could with fingers and rags, then used brake clean and compressed air. Makes a big mess, but is now squeaky clean. This has to be done BEFORE reinstalling  oil pan, or mess is now in the oil pan you just cleaned ! While cleaning the oil pan, I noticed the bottom of the drain opening was higher than the bottom of the oil pan. This allowed the sludge to stay in the pan after all oil was drained. I should mention the drain was on the rear of the pan, not the bottom. I cut a 4 inch square piece from another pan with the drain in the bottom. Then cut a smaller hole in the bottom of my 230 pan. With the patch welded over the opening in my 230 pan, I now have a drain dead center in the bottom, with no lip to retain sludge. After installing pan, I put in 3 qts oil and 2 qts auto trans fluid. No oil filter. Drove car 30 miles, and drained it out. Looked like black paint coming out of pan. Drained and cleaned  oil filter canister, installed new filter, added 5 qts Shell Rotella 15-40. Drove the same 30 miles, pulled dipstick, oil looks like it did when I put it in. I highly recommend doing this if you oil turns black shortly after an oil change. That dirt circulating through your engine is not a good thing.

Edited October 19, 2017 by Mike36

[knuckleharley]

4 hours ago, Mike36 said:

At the last oil change on my 230, I stuck my finger in the drain opening to feel for sludge, after the oil had all drained. Yuk !  Sludge was close to 1/4 in deep. I dropped the pan and cleaned the mess out. Then pulled the valve covers, found the same mess. Cleaned out all I could with fingers and rags, then used brake clean and compressed air. Makes a big mess, but is now squeaky clean. This has to be done BEFORE reinstalling  oil pan, or mess is now in the oil pan you just cleaned ! While cleaning the oil pan, I noticed the bottom of the drain opening was higher than the bottom of the oil pan. This allowed the sludge to stay in the pan after all oil was drained. I should mention the drain was on the rear of the pan, not the bottom. I cut a 4 inch square piece from another pan with the drain in the bottom. Then cut a smaller hole in the bottom of my 230 pan. With the patch welded over the opening in my 230 pan, I now have a drain dead center in the bottom, with no lip to retain sludge. After installing pan, I put in 3 qts oil and 2 qts auto trans fluid. No oil filter. Drove car 30 miles, and drained it out. Looked like black paint coming out of pan. Drained and cleaned  oil filter canister, installed new filter, added 5 qts Shell Rotella 15-40. Drove the same 30 miles, pulled dipstick, oil looks like it did when I put it in. I highly recommend doing this if you oil turns black shortly after an oil change. That dirt circulating through your engine is not a good thing.

The good news is all that sludge is evidence the old non-detergent oil was doing what it was designed to do,take the trash out of suspension before it got a chance to circulate through the bearings.

Modern detergent oils are designed to keep the trash in suspension so it is trapped by the oil filter. Modern cars have a different oil filtration system than the old cars,so if the filter in a new car gets clogged up,oil is allowed to bypass the oil filter in order to lube the bearings. Or at least that is the way it was explained to me. I am not an automotive engineer,and don't pretend to be one.

The old non-bypass system worked just fine as long as you drained and replaced your oil and filter according to the recommendations in the owners manual. The problems didn't usually start happening until the 2nd or 3rd owner,who just owned a old car for cheap transportation and was reluctant to spend the money to keep it maintained.

In other words,you can continue to run non-detergent oil in your old car with a rebuilt engine with no worries whatsoever as long as you change the oil and filter in accordance with the owner's manual recommendations.

Personally,as I have said before,I MUCH prefer using modern 15w-40 diesel HD oil in engines I know to be clean inside. It's just a much better oil in all respects.

[Mopar Wayne]

Thanks for all of the response.  There is some great information and tips in here. 

[Mike36]

3 hours ago, knuckleharley said:

The good news is all that sludge is evidence the old non-detergent oil was doing what it was designed to do,take the trash out of suspension before it got a chance to circulate through the bearings.

Modern detergent oils are designed to keep the trash in suspension so it is trapped by the oil filter. Modern cars have a different oil filtration system than the old cars,so if the filter in a new car gets clogged up,oil is allowed to bypass the oil filter in order to lube the bearings. Or at least that is the way it was explained to me. I am not an automotive engineer,and don't pretend to be one.

The old non-bypass system worked just fine as long as you drained and replaced your oil and filter according to the recommendations in the owners manual. The problems didn't usually start happening until the 2nd or 3rd owner,who just owned a old car for cheap transportation and was reluctant to spend the money to keep it maintained.

In other words,you can continue to run non-detergent oil in your old car with a rebuilt engine with no worries whatsoever as long as you change the oil and filter in accordance with the owner's manual recommendations.

Personally,as I have said before,I MUCH prefer using modern 15w-40 diesel HD oil in engines I know to be clean inside. It's just a much better oil in all respects.

I understand what you have written, and agree with it. My problem was the oil pan drain being 1/4 inch higher than the bottom of the pan. Therefor the sludge did not go out with the oilwhen drained. It was still lying there in the bottom of the pan eagerly waiting to pollute the new oil.

[knuckleharley]

1 hour ago, Mike36 said:

I understand what you have written, and agree with it. My problem was the oil pan drain being 1/4 inch higher than the bottom of the pan. Therefor the sludge did not go out with the oilwhen drained. It was still lying there in the bottom of the pan eagerly waiting to pollute the new oil.

Yes,that does happen,but mostly with cars that were driven in cities and never really warmed up enough to allow the sludge to liquefy enough to drain.  Add to that infrequent oil changes,and it's a wonder any of them lasted.

And of course,once they get really gummed up,it's not going to drain out no matter how long you run it at normal temps. That's what the quart of kerosene was for right before a oil change. Put the kerosene in a car with normal sludge and then start it up and run it up to normal operating temps before draining it,and the "normal" sludge in the bottom of the pan would drain out with the oil.

Of course,the problem with this is when you buy a old car you have no way of knowing if it has ever been flushed or not,and can't really tell until you drop the oil pan and pull the valve covers.

BTW,I knew a tightwad in the mid 70's that had a 68 Impala,and damned if  he didn't use recycled oil in it,the cheapest he could get,and he would even pull off the screw-on filter,wash it out in a bucket of kerosene,and put it back on the car. He drove that car for at least 4 years that I know of,and never once bought a new oil filter.

Edited October 19, 2017 by knuckleharley

[DrDoctor]

Gentlemen,

   This topic has been knocked around many, many times, with the conclusion being something to the effect that whatever works—use it. I’ve said this many times, and will say it again—you can put your trust in Knuckleharley, and what he says. He’s been around the track a few times, as have I, and he knows of what he speaks. Those who possess wisdom—listen to him. And those who don’t—should. Just sayin’ . . . . Thx.

[Dodgeb4ya]

On 10/19/2017 at 5:14 AM, Branded said:

Remove the pickup while you have the pan off because it will be full of crud too. Uncrimp the pickup housing that holds the screen and clean behind it, the screen is easily removed.

I just had a oil  pickup professionally  hot tanked and looked really clean...........

But I knew I would have to open it up... remove the baffle and screen to properly clean it.... cleanliness a must to protect the bearings...

[MackTheFinger]

See all that gunk on that pickup screen? I'll never think it's a good idea to dilute that kinda stuff with solvent,  put it in suspension with oil, and circulate it through an engine. 

[bobostski]

I removed the oil pan to clean and found the steering arm was in the way off removal.I turned the wheels and I was able to get it out. I thought I would have to take it all apart.  Just a FYI moment.