833 4 speed with OD transmissions available

[greg g]

There is a fellow nearby who has 2 833 mopar OD transmissions for sale.these are the ones that were in Aspens, Volares and light trucks and vans from the late 70's mid 80's.  They are floor shifted and would require modification of the floor.  They have the short output shaft and what looks like the larger input bearing retainer.  They both come with shifters, this is important since they are geared and selected weird,  They select 4th (1 to 1) as third and the OD is put on the 3rd gear set.  The shifter knows the drill where it shifts 1 2 4 3.  These would present some problems with parking brakes as they do not have or have provision for the old style trans mounted brake, and probably need driveshaft mods as well.  In the ad the look to be the newer aluminum case units.  If any one is interested, let me know, and I will pass along the contact info.  Can also pick up and hold if need be.  I believe the OD ratio was .73.

 

 

Edited July 14, 2014 by greg g

[greg g]

any interest moose??

[moose]

I'm interested, but that's a long way from here.  I've got a line on a local place that may have one, how much for these?

[greg g]

PM'd you.

[Lumpy]

Let me warn you all, I have this tranny in a van I own, and what you wind up with is a really high first gear, and then the OD is too high. BE SURE that you have a low geared rear end if you did use this tranny. The one in my van is 3.55, has a well worn slant six (225) so it's probably right on the same power level as a 230 flat six. And it's a short wheel base van, I doubt that it ways much more than a 40's car. I can only use the overdrive on the level with a tail wind, or down hill. Starting up a steep driveway or hill is a long drawn out clutch slip.

 

I think 3.90 at minimum rear gear, and 4.11's would probably be best. Just saying that if you have already geared the car up a little from stock, you won't like this tranny.

 

Having said that, I'd be curious as to what one has to do to get this tranny to bolt up to the stock 230 bell housing. With a low enough rear gear in could work pretty slick. Not an option for me, as I'd lose my three on the tree, which would break my heart and be unacceptable.

 

ken.

Edited July 14, 2014 by Lumpy

[Daliant.]

I might be interested if the price is right. Both look look like truck/van units, the volare/aspen/dart transmissions only had one mount for the shifter.

Edited July 14, 2014 by Daliant.

[Tim Keith]

The 833 od is a good transmission, essentially the same design as the Hemi four speed.  But the od geared version is wide spaced and not so fun to drive.  The Hurst shifters can be expensive by themselves.  Some of the high miles alloy cased versions can have a worn case as the counter shaft is not bushed.  A machine shop can install a bushing to repair the case and prevent it from happening.

 

"The aluminum-case 833, however, was built with .005-inch clearance between the case and the shaft. Stab it on and off, the gears load and unload, and the countershaft has .005 inch of running room to gain momentum to pound at the hole in the case. So after a while, the case pounds out, then maybe the shaft has .010-inch clearance to whack back and forth, then .020-inch, then .030-inch, until the loose, misaligned internals result in a grenaded tranny. The production aluminum-case 833 has a miserable reputation in Moparland and for good reason."

 http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/drivetrain/mopp_0110_a_833_aluminum_case_buildup/#ixzz37V7oAbRk

[james curl]

If you check, the pilot shaft cover is much larger.  Requiring the bell housing to be removed and put on a Bridgeport milling machine to have the hole enlarged or an adapter made.  The adapter would be much like the one a S 10 T-5 transmission requires.

[Lumpy]

Yeah..."not so fun to drive". That describes it pretty well. And in my last post I meant "weighs", not "ways"!!

ken.

[Tim Keith]

The input bearing retainer is 5.125-inch, the same as many GM truck manual transmissions.  In fact, some GM trucks used the 833 overdrive transmission from 1981 through 1986.  The gear splits are said to be about the same as the 700R4 automatic, but without the benefit of the torque multiplication the OD 833 is not as flexible as the automatic

[james curl]

The bell housing hole would have to be enlarged even if the transmission bolt pattern was the same as the bell housing.  I have modified a P-15 bell housing to accept a T-5 transmission and the hole was enlarged to accommodate the standard GM bearing retainer.  I happen to have an 833 aluminum case overdrive transmission which I picked up at a swap meet but it came without a shifter.  The special shifter for this transmission is very expensive.  This is also a long tail shaft transmission unlike the GM pick ups which use a short tail shaft housing.

[Tim Keith]

The Hurst shifter is costly, but new ones are available.   I like the 833 but prefer the non overdrive version.  It is considered to be the strongest four speed ever used in a production automobile.     I think an underdrive might be better, but don't want to get the Gear Vendors.      In an underdrive the final drive is direct 1:1, which is more efficient and less wear.  I don't know of an alternative to the  Gear Vendors, or whether a Laycock can be converted to underdrive.   For these cars I think its good to get an R-10.  I came across an R-10 this week but I have to buy the entire car to get it, seller wants $300 for the '54 Plymouth. 

[james curl]

I would think that the whole car for $300.00 would be a steal.  If you stripped the car of all of its good parts including the entire front suspension you would have parts to help other owners of these old cars.  It does not take a lot of room to store all of the components that you remove.  You could take the parts to a good swap meet and get your money back.  I have yet to find an overdrive transmission for our cars for anywhere close to $300.00 or I would have one in my car.

[BobK]

Is the shifter itself, on the 833 OD, that "special"? I was under the impression that it was a regular 4 sp shifter with a modified 3rd/4th shifter rod to work with the flipped over 3/4 lever on the tranny..... Opps, that would then mean you would also need a longer 3/4 lever on the shifter itself, thus a "special" shifter. Could one weld an extension on the 3/4 lever on a standard shifter to lengthen it?

 

I was going to not post on the subject after I started typing and thought about it, and the fact that my thoughts may not be correct...... But as they say, there are no bad questions, just bad answers. So those in the know, please correct my thoughts.

[Daliant.]

I have a Hurst competition plus shifter on one of my OD833's and the stock hurst shifter on another OD833, there's nothing special about either one.

Edited July 19, 2014 by Daliant.

[james curl]

I was under the impression that the Hurst four speed shifters that I have would not work on the 833 transmission that I have.  I have not tried to install the shifter and make new rods as all of mine are for Saginaw four speeds.   Is it just the arm and rod kit that is the difference?  I got my 833 cheep because it did not have the shifter and arms or the rods. 

[greg g]

seems to me the shifter was designed to deal with the need to select the gears 1, 2 4,3 sequence using the "NORMAL" H pattern.   So if you put the regular linkage and shifter on it you would need to be the one to remember to shift that way. 

[Tim Keith]

The Hurst shifter is the same but one shift lever on the transmission is on backwards and one rod is different.  Its not hard to make the missing rod.  You can get new four speed shifter rods but not the complete overdrive set.    Brewers is a good resource on these transmissions.   The 3rd gear is actually the overdrive, 4th is straight through - the original 3rd gear.   I used a Hurst shifter from a 340 V8 Duster, with the lever flipped.   Years ago the Chrysler dealer ordered 1 of the missing rods for my overdrive 833.   The people on Slantsix.org can answer questions about these transmissions.

 

http://www.brewersperformance.com/

[james curl]

On my spare P-15 bell housing we enlarged the pilot shaft bearing retainer opening to fit the standard little GM size of 4 11/16" Diameter.  This only allows about a 1/4" of material on the bottom and almost out of the mounting surface on the top.  I do not see any way one could enlarge the hole to 5 1/4" diameter and have any material left on the bottom and questionable on the top of the opening.  I think it would take an adapter plate between the transmission and the bell housing with the minor opening indexed with a raised ring on the bell housing side and the major opening on the transmission mounting surface side of the adapter.  It would require something along the line of the adapter that Paul Curtis sells for the T-5 transmission to P-15 bell housing.  My thoughts are unless you can find the short 833 that Chevrolet used in their pick ups with the standard small pilot shaft bearing retainer it would be impractical to try to use one in a P-15.

[Don Coatney]

For my T-5 install I added a hunk of steel to the bottom of the Bell housing that was both pinned and screwed not welded. Also added a couple of welded ears to the top.