so how screwed am i?

[jaguarsurfer]

i hade the manifolds off because they were cracked and junk but the bottom long studs broke. i ground then flush and drilled them to remove them. well thats when all went wrong.....

the ez out broke in the foward most stud. in the rear stud the drill broke but is far into the motor. i didnt hear it fall but its about 2-2.5 inches into the motor...where is it and how do i get it out? im at my wits end. all i wanted to do was take the studs out. after that the car is ready to drive.

thanks

[oldmopar]

Start be reading this post of a similar problem a lot of good information was given

http://www430.pair.com/p15d24/mopar_forum/showthread.php?t=9295

[jaguarsurfer]

thanks

i read all of it. like the wax trick. never hear of that.

my problem is that both studs are flush so i cant weld to them

but the REALLY big problem is the 1.5inches of drill bit that are foating around behind the stud.

i fished around in there and it seems like its a big open area in there but i cant feel the drill bit. its not stuck in the hole. its loose behind the hole.

[JIPJOBXX]

Use a small a prick punch on the easy out that broke. The easy out should break oft in peaces. This is the way I was taught down at the old ship yard for removing broken oft drills and easy outs. On the one that has the drill all the way through it just use that prick punch and tap it down the side of the drill stud that still remain in the hole. This all takes a little time but this will work and you might just haft to buy a tap to clean up the whole you bugger up while trying to remove those old studs. You are not the first person to do this and probably not the last. As far as that drill that's inside the block well I would forget about it as it will just turn to rust anyway. If it did make it way up to the water pump than you might have a problem but I don't think it will travel that far. Oh yes that whole that has the drill that fell into it, maybe you can get a small round magnet and fish it out of there. Good luck!!!!

[jaguarsurfer]

oh thanks for the good news. the hole with the ez out i understand will be a pain to fix.

makes me feel so much better to know that the drill bit will be ok in there. my mechanic brain was going nuts thinking i dilled to far or put a hole in the cyclinders or the bit will find its way to the oil pan.

i was minutes from takeing the head off...i know that wouldnt help though...lol

[grady hawkins]

Once you get these fixed

aREMEMBEr to put # 2 permtex on those two bottom bolts because they go into the water which is the main reason they break. Some one didn't take the time to do this

[48mirage]

That part of the bit you think is in a void in the engine block may be accessible by pulling your water distribution tube. Can't gaurantee it but if you ever pull that thing make sure you take a good look before you put one back in.

[jaguarsurfer]

i just put a new tube in and just finished putting everthing back together

[John Mulders]

That is a shame of course but it would come off easily then.

Others have been spending hours on the tube and some words I can't repeat were uttered in the process.

Hope you get it out another way (magnet as suggested) and get the remaing parts of the studs out.

John

[jaguarsurfer]

right now im thinking of just finishing removing the broken studs and cleaning up the threads and leaving the bit in its new home...buti dont like the idea of doing that. but i hate the idea of taking the radiator out and all the rest of the parts to get to the piece of bit....oh what to do...lol

[jaguarsurfer]

anyone have a pic of the motor cut away? i would want to be sure i could get to that piece of drill bit with the water tube out before i pulled it.

[Norm's Coupe]

anyone have a pic of the motor cut away? i would want to be sure i could get to that piece of drill bit with the water tube out before i pulled it.

I can understand you not wanting to pull the tube you just put in. However, for what it's worth, here's a short story and my thoughts on this subject. After reading them it's up to you if you want to go fishing or leave the piece of drill bit in the engine.

In 1966 I was in the army and stationed in Paris, France. I had taken my personal 1965 Dodge to France with me. I was renting an apartment nearby that had a little one car garage with one little light overhead. I was simply tuning up the car one weekend, putting in new points, condenser, plugs, etc. Simple job, but the lighting wasn't good. Just had a flashlight to work with. While installing the points I dropped the little screw that holds the points in the distributor of my slant 6 Dodge engine. I then used the flashlight to search the crevices of the engine and on the garage floor to no avail. Could not find that screw anywhere. So.........assuming it was so small it was simply stuck in a crevice so small I couldn't see it. No big deal, just get another screw and install the points. Which I did. Got all finished with the tune up and tried starting the car. Would just turn over and never fired once. Next day at work I called a guy in the motor pool that I knew to get his opinion since I knew I did nothing wrong. He said I should pull the distributor and look at it. So that night I pulled the distributor and found the nylon gears at the bottom of the shaft broken. Also found the missing screw I had dropped. It was jammed inside the distributor and that is what caused the gears to break.

I spent the next day or two looking for a Chrysler dealership to buy new gears or a distributor. But.........there wasn't that many Chrylser dealers in France, and was told I have to order it from the states. Luckily the same friend in the motor pool came to my aid since the military sedans used the same engines.

So.........the moral of the story. If you loose something you should go after it until you find it. If you don't, it could come back to haunt you later.

[jaguarsurfer]

those are all the kind of stories that are going though my head right now.

all i need is a good manifold and i can start driving the car. been looking at it so long

but like i said i want to be sure that the place where the drill bit fell is really excessable though the water tube.

[rearview]

For the EZ out: Try this trick I got to work once... Get a can of the compressed air for cleaning computers. Hold it upside-down and spray it onto the extractor until it is very frozen, you'll need to watch where the bad spot is because a lot of ice will build up. IMMEDIATELY hit it with hammer and sharp punch. The freezing and impact can make it shatter (It's worked for me 1 out of 3 or 4 times trying) You can use a pick to get the pieces out.

The can of air will spray out the liquid when held upside down, cold enough to get frostbite very easily.

If that doesn't work, a coated carbide drill will cut through the extractor, but they are very brittle and need to be stable when drilling. If the carbide breaks in the extractor you're pretty much done. There isn't much that can cut them, except for diamond bit$ or an electrical discharge proce$$.

Extractors / EZ-outs all suck. I just drill with a left hand bit and retap now. The LH drill will sometimes bite and back out the broken fastener. If it doesn't, you've got the new hole.

Which manifold you need? Intake?

[Norm's Coupe]

Reaview is right on when he recommended the left handed drill bits. They work slick for drilling out broken bolts. If you use a slightly smaller left handed drill bit to drill out the stuck bolt, it will still back out the bolt sometimes. However, if it doesn't you can usually knock out the shell of the broken bolt, then just chase the original threads instead of retapping. Just make sure you drill straight if you use them.

[55 Fargo]

those are all the kind of stories that are going though my head right now.

all i need is a good manifold and i can start driving the car. been looking at it so long

but like i said i want to be sure that the place where the drill bit fell is really excessable though the water tube.

Hi Jag, listen I was right where you are last spring, but with only 1 broken bolt/stud.

I tried and drilled it out, by went off center, as I could did not seem to get a real dead on center punch mark, ( that is critical).

I ended up having an expert come out, drill out the hole slightly larger and tapped to 7/16 for this 1 hole.

Okay, so you need the following, cobalt or titanium drill bits, a center punch, drill, tap and die set.

Make a dead on center punch mark, start with a small drill bit say1/8, you need to work up to 5/16 max.

If you get your first drill hole right in the center, you can progresively drill larger holes, to the point that you can pick out the metal pieces, that remain.

If all goes well, then run a tap through the threads, and your back in business.

You can of course try the reverse drill bits too, but beware and take care not to go off center with your dilling, and egg shaped hole with half the threads cut out will make life miserable, and a heli-coil fix will then be necessary, that can be expensive, and sometimes they don't work that well.

Good luck, plan this one out, take your time, use the right equipment.

Also phone around and see if anyone does a mobile service, that might be an option................Fred PS sorry did not know you broke the easy out, hope you can get her out, as other have mentioned, pull the water tube. I pulled mune out a 2nd time last spring, the 2nd time out it came out with ease, as compared to the 1st time..........Fred

[plymouth49]

There is another fix if you are good with an oxy-acetylene torch, or of you know someone who is. You simply burn out the offending bits! Use a cutting head, heat right down the center, and then when it is time blast away. The molten bits of the stud/drill bit/ easy out will coming shooting out back at you, and you will be left with an emtpy hole that just needs to be chased. This does not hurt the block unless you get real clumsy.

[jaguarsurfer]

im going to try that ice trick. never thought of that.

i need an exhaust manifold

i drilled out the rear hole to 1/4 so next m going to try and fish out the broken bit and retap the hole

[jaguarsurfer]

ice trick didnt work but did grind out most of the easy out with a dremel.

now all my drill bits at my house are shot so im going to have to wait till i go to work to get better ones and the right size tap

[Plymouthy Adams]

I have used the ole torch and BLOWN a number of broken bits, taps and etc from cast iron holes...it is still a process that I get nervous about..not so much damaging a block per say but for the blast of molten material spray back when you hit the oxygen blast..if you go this route..PLEASE take care to protect your body parts and items of combustion in and about the area..this process was shown to me when a teenager and my first experiece blasting out broken tool steel was while still in high school..

[plymouth49]

I saw an interesting twist on this repair on, of all places, one of those Sunday morning Horsepower TV shows. They ran into the same problem: bolt broke off, centerpunch was off-center, so the hole they drilled was off-center, too.

They simply drilled the off-center hole to an oversize, and tapped it - right off center where it was. Then, they used red loctite and screwed in a bolt. Next, they cut off the bolt flush with the surface of the casting.

They then used the part that attaches to centerpunch a mark exactly in the right spot. Drill and tap this now-perfectly-located hole to the original size; done.

I would probably let that red loctite cure for at least a few hours, though.

On TV, it only took them about 30 seconds for the entire repair.

[No Bux Rod]

If you think the drill bit piece has made it to the water jacket, then you can remove th lower freeze plug(s) where you will find about 3/8 to 1/2 spacing between the cylinders. From that point you could use a slender magnet to get the part from the other side of the block.

If the drill bit is laying on the shelf above the valve spring chamber, you can fish around with a piece of wire until it falls dwn to the bottom.

Not sure if this will work bit I had to drill a hole in the back of a block to get a WD tube out.

N B R