Dartgame

I have noted that some folks like to cut their coil springs on the front to lower their car. This is my first king pin front ended car - so my question is, if you lower the front end by cutting the coils, does the camber, caster or toe in/out change appreciably ? It would appear to me that the camber/caster do not but the toe does. Any thoughts you can share about this ?

I am going to give you my experiences with the Aerostar springs, which I just completed over the weekend. But first a background on my car. 52 Plymouth bus coupe. 15 x7 cop rims, 215 70 15 tires. No front sway bar, Monroe gas shocks all around. I started messing with the suspension by installing new ESPO 8 leaf springs. Originals were 7 leaf. I opted to leave the 8th leaf in place to see what the result would be. After install the rear sat a little higher than the front, maybe 1-2 inches. Car sat level before the new leaf springs. Upon test driving the front end became even more prone to sway and so on than before - I imagine the stiffer rear was putting more downforce on the front springs. Next step was to do the aerostar springs on the front. I have no experience with swapping coil springs. Every car I've messed with are 60 or 70's mopars with torsion bar front ends. So this was a little bit of a concern on my part as to what to expect. Well, I have to say swapping coil springs was one of the easiest things I've done so far on this car. Literally took 30 minutes to get a spring out. I chose to remove the lower control arm for cleaning and repainting. Just keep the the pivot bar in its original orientation if u do this. So as a result my swap instead of being a 2 hour job was 8 hours..but now I have nice clean front end parts ! After install the test drive exhibited a great improvement in ride, and handling. The car does not dive and sway is greatly reduced. As to ride height, the front end is now about 1 inch higher than it was after the new leaf springs were installed. Overall the car is back sitting dead level but maybe 1-1.5 inches taller than it was originally. Bottom line - for those of you considering the stock OEM style springs - Forget it. Buy the Aerostar springs, be happy, enjoy the vastly improved ride/handling, and put the 150-200 bucks you saved towards something else. Next, I plan on installing a sway bar. But that won't happen for a month or so. Relocating the upper front shock mount is on the list too. Now for a question - as I said, I have no experience with coil springs. I have heard that coil springs will "settle" meaning the front will drop a little after install. Can anyone tell me if that is a true statement, and if so, how much do they drop ? Is the settling something that is affected by driving or can it happen just by sitting still ?

To determine compression ratios you must measure the cyl head volume using a buret graduated in milliliters (cc's), you also need to take into account the cyl head gasket cc's and also the piston cc's at TDC and BDC. It then becomes a simple calculation. The stumbling block for most is getting a buret, not cheap.

Wow the repair works looks kind of rough. Hopefully you can get it to work. Note - if u use silicone sealant, allow 24 hrs for it cure before exposing it to coolant and pressure. Silicone cures with moisture, but if not cured before being put under stress it can and often will fail. There is a special grade of silicone for thermostat flanges - gray in color. I'd try that.

I had a similar issue after I got the 52 running. I had it idling in the garage showing a buddy how nice it ran, and then the engine just stopped running. Kind of embrassing.... I checked for spark and was getting some, but not consistent. Turned out the new condenser which had only 1 hour running time was bad. Pain in the butt because when swapping the condenser - at least on my car - the point adjustment goes out and you have to reset it. Once changed out all was well again. I have another dizzy which I am going to convert to pertronix and keep the point dist. as a back up.... Damn cheap parts these days....found an NOS condenser/points from a specialty parts vendor, which I will use if it comes down to it....

You might want to use some quad 0 steel wool to polish the mating/sealing surfaces and then use some Teflon pipe dope as suggested above. Be generous with the pipe dope and wipe off excess after tightening. I would also guard against coolant being on the surfaces while reinstalling.

Please be sure to check the water pump. I chased a cooling problem on one of my darts for several seasons. I finally checked the water pump impeller and it was loose on the shaft and free wheeled, it was smooth as a bearing, and made no noise while turning. This was a new pump, not rebuilt. Use a digital thermometer on the upper and lower radiator hoses. If you see a huge drop on the inlet side - probably the pump is bad.

Hi young Ed - I saw your rebuild of the fresh air versions of these heaters. The model 53 is the passenger side version in your write up. I don't have a picture handy.

Thanks for the recommendation. I plan on checking some local shops too.

Guess nobody has any ideas. I saw brass works has one advertised. Called them, they want $300 for a record of mine !! Ouch.

I decided to get one of these for my 52. I know it's not the original style, but I decided with the compact size and the fact that I will infrequently need heat or defrost - this unit should be adequate. I have searched high and low on the Internet on this site and others seeking a suitable retrofit or replacement type core for this thing. No dice. It would seem that recoring the original heater core is the only good option. I tested the original core and it has pins leaks in a bunch of places. I looked up and down at OEM current applications and none are the correct size. Anyone have some thoughts about what they did when they serviced their heater core ?

I'd set the timing as far advanced as possible without detonation. I found mine runs well with 7 degrees BTDC.

I bought one of those adapters from champion carburetor in Arlington Texas. There are practically no air cleaners with a 2 3/8 inch base, they are usually 2.5 inches. I cut some pieces of tailpipe and made spacers to bush a 2.5" opening air cleaner to the adapter, one ring fits so snug to the adapter there was no need to mechanically fasten it. The other I JB welded to the air cleaner base, it fit sung as well, but wanted to insure it would not move around. I could have welded it, but the metal on the base is really thin, I figured gluing would be okay. Works fine..

You could probably make one using some brass tubing or some steel tubing, like 5/16 or 1/4 depending on whats needed. Try using a drill bit to determine the size. Use the non cutting end of the bit and slip it into the hole. I'd bet its 5/16 or 1/4 ".

Earl - thanks for noting that, you are correct except that the remote master cylinder reservoir is mounted on the firewall higher than the calipers and the master cylinder itself, so no need for the residual valves. An advantage to the remote reservoir master cylinder.

Death bound - The master cylinder is mounted under the floor using one of AAJ's brackets. Fits like a glove in the space intended for it. Roger at AAJ recommended using a corvette master cylinder, but if I had it would have meant cutting a big hole in the floor because the reservoir would have protruded up thru the floor. Instead - The master power MC uses a remote reservoir that I mounted on the firewall. The cylinder portion fit neatly under the floor with no cutting required, just a little clearancing with a hammer and big drift on the bottom of the floor to allow the thing to fit right. Imagine a master cylinder without the cast iron reservoir on top, thats what this thing is. pflaming - I corrected the pedal issue by adjusting the brake pushrod length. It was too short to give the right amount of travel. I dont have drum brakes - discs on front and rear..I re-bled the entire system again this last weekend and its totally cleared of air. So do a little rev matching to shift it ? Although I did not drive it much before putting her away for the winter, I am favorably impressed with the way it drives. Steering is pretty fair, does not wander much at all, it needs the sway bar without a doubt. I put 215 70 15 BFG radial TA on her with the black walls out on 15" police wheels, they cleared the fenders and the car sits and looks right to me. No need for lowering. Bad thing I found was the right rear axle is slightly bent. The tire on that side wavers - I had her off the ground and ran the car with the engine driving the rear wheels. (yes I made damn sure it was not goin to move, the whole car was up on jackstands.) I guess I will be installing an explorer rear end next spring. Unless someone has a good axle shaft laying around for a 52 concord, haha.

Sorry for the late replies here. Since I last posted, I got the car out and drove it for the first time last weekend Nov 6th . I am pleasantly surprised at how well it runs. Not having a synchronized 1st gear is kind of a pain. It desperately needs a sway bar - I will be putting in one of those cherokee sway bars next spring. Brake pedal is a little low when you mash on the brakes, but I think I still have more air to bleed out. Good enough to drive to its storage spot for the winter. I ended up putting in a remote reservoir MC from master power brakes. I used all AAJ stuff, except for the MC - which Roger recommends using a corvette MC. No go, I would have had to cut a big darn hole in the floor for that thing to have worked. So the master power piece is the way to go, it fits without any cutting, a little judicious use of a hammer to create some clearance between it and the floor was all that was needed. Casper - Dart photos ? Jersey Harold - I cut slits through the headliner to gain access, my headliner is shot anyway, and is on the list for next year.

Aha !! thats what I needed to know. Now for the next question. I had my brother get me a spare IAT distibutor for my 52 ply from a junkyard 53 ply with an IAT. My intention is to convert the 53 dizzy to a pertronix ignition, and keep the 52 as a spare with points. The odd thing about this 53 distributor is that instead of a hole through the side for the primary lead, it has a large square block of rubber that seals the side of the distributor and the connection is made on the outside. I started to look around for a replacement for this rubber block, but this thing seems to be made of un-obtainium. Does anyone know a source for a replacement for this rubber piece or have a unique idea to fix the issue ?

Finished the rewiring project. That turned out to be more of a challenge than I had thought. Since the car was not originally set up with a fuse panel, we more or less re-engineered the wiring on the car. It took much more time than I thought it would. But in the end, the car now has 12 volt neg ground, a 94 amp altenator, turn signals, backup lights, and so on which it never had. One of the more difficult parts were the front parking lights. The car was not originally equipped with turn signals so the front parking lamps were single contact bayonet type bulbs. I looked high and low for some sort of easy solution, and in the end retro fitted some taillight sockets from a 70's dart - I tack welded them into the original brackets for the single filament bulb fixtures. They work great, and you almost might think I knew what I was doing ! Another bear was running the wires up the A pillar. It took alot of trial and error to get that one finished. Managed to do it without skinning any insulation. This whole deal was a process I had not done before so it was a learning curve. If I were to do one again, I'd bet it would go a lot faster. Since then I started the front disc brake conversion, and got the hard parts done, drilling and tapping the steering arms and the spindles. The caliper adapter plate fits perfectly and I am progressing to get the rotors installed. I've slowed down alot on this as I had hernia surgery about 2 weeks ago, but Im pretty happy with the disc conversion so far. I should get that completed over the next weekend. Next will be to move on to the rear brakes, lastly will be the master cylinder. Goal is to have the car driveable by October, so I can drive it a little and then put it away for the winter into dry storage.... Stay tuned......

I am interested in buying a spare distributor and was curious about fitment between the small 218/230 flat sixes and the larger desoto and chrysler flat sixes. For instance, can you swap a big six dizzy into a small block six ?

Thanks guys. Shes not driveable yet. Needs brakes and the rewire. Ill be doing the disc brake and tandem master cyl upgrade. As to the timing light I'll use a 12 volt power source. I have to say I am really impressed with how easy she starts up now. I was running her again today for a short while. Very good feeling to get this milestone passed. I'll comment periodically as we get more done. I figure you might be interested in the disc conversion and tandem upgrade. We'll be using an aftermarket wiring harness to do that part as well. Car is pretty simple so wiring should not be too difficult. Maybe the dash switches and gauges will be the most challenging. My brother and I will do the rewire first, as he is visiting from out of town for about 9-10days next week, and his strength lies in electronics. It may be a while before I do the brake as I have a minor surgery later in August that will slow progress for about 6 weeks. Oh well TMI maybe, thanks again.

After 6 weeks of cleaning/painting detailing the engine/the engine bay, front suspension and associated engine bolt ons, along with rebuilding the carb, the distributor, new plug wires, fuel pump, gas tank, oil & filter, plugs, radiator & hoses - etc etc. We spent about 20-25 minutes trying to start the 52 ply yesterday while twisting the dizzy one way or another and using ether. With a monstrous cloud of oily smoke enough to have simulated a destroyer laying down a smokescreen, she started. I was surprised the fire department did not show up there was so much smoke. We held her steady at about 2500 rpm for 10 minutes, still shooting out clouds of smoke, then she started to clear out. Temp came up to 180 & steady, oil pressure is 40 at idle, electric choke works, fuel guage, ammeter all work right, & she is darn near running perfectly. Previous owner said it had been 2 years since she last ran. I doubt it. Probably more like 5-10 years. Anyway, we shot a fair amount of sea foam down the carb to help clean out more crap in the combustion chamber, with even more crap shooting out the exhaust, and she's running like a champ, no weird noises, except for the valve train ticking which is out of adjustment. I chose not to adjust it until we got it running, I figured loose was better than too tight for an initial start up. Cold clearances are about 18 to 20 thousandths. For now it runs fine, I'll get to the valves after we redo the wiring harness. Insulation is crispy.... HOORAY ! Now for my question - I have a dial back timing light that operates off of 12 volts and an impulse from #1 plug wire. Will this work on a 6 volt battery ? Or should I just use a 12 volt source for the power and use the impulse from the #1 plug wire ? I think the later - sound right ?

Hi all - I was curious about the trim used on the 51 and 52 plymouth business coupe rear quarters. Are they the same length as on a 2 club coupe, 4 door or a wagon ? I am sure the fast backs are different from I have seen. Any help is appreciated. I need a new or good used fender spear for one of the quarters on my 52 bus coupe. Thanks

Hi All - Thanks - I'll look into the rustoleum product.

Hi - new guy here. I am resurrecting a 52 ply bus coupe and am about ready to install a new fuel tank. I have the correct 2 1/4 " fuel hose. The old clamps on the fuel hose are a much more positive clamping design vs the everyday stainless screw clamp I'd use on a heater or radiator hose. My question - when you replaced your tank did you reuse or buy a new version of the old style clamp or did you use a modern stainless screw clamp ? My old clamps cleaned up pretty well, and appear service-able. Thanks