engine help

[fireman_033]

hello folks scott here new to the whole plymouth scene but not new to cars by any means. just bought a 47 plymouth sedan deluxe which has been off the road since 1973 or at least thats when the last tag expired. anyway the motor is not locked up or anything but before i got the car home i had the grand idea that i was going to clip the car with a trans am clip and the rear and put a 00 fuel injected 5.3 from a chevy 4x4 and a overdrive trans. after getting the car home and looking at this site a lot i have found that converting the front to disc is the way to go with that and have been studying on that when i come up with my own disc conversion i will let you know what i have done but my big question now is i saw someone in little rock ar has a 54 chrysler flathead will this fit in the place of my engine with no probs? my engine is not locked up but the starter does nothing and the intake and exhaust is barely hanging there you can move the breather side to side about four inches so i have not tried to start it. I thought if the bigger chrysler motor would fit I could sell the 5.3 and stick to the original style engine thats way cooler. any help will be greatly appreciated thanks Scott

[Norm's Coupe]

The Chrysler 6 cylinder engine is 25 inches and the Plymouth 218 6 cylinder is only 23 inches long. To make it fit you have to do some modifications like flipping the radiator around, etc. Since the car already has a Chevy engine it's also very probable that the drive shaft and rearend has also been changed out. So.........you'd probably have to replace the whole drive train to make the Chrysler engine or Plymouth flathead fit back in there.

Since everything is already set up for the nice modern Chevy engine, I'd stick with it. Will do highway speeds a lot better than the old flathead will. The Chevy 350 engine is only 23 inches long too, so that's why it fit in there so well.

[Don Coatney]

Since the car already has a Chevy engine

Norm;

Guess I missed the part about this car already having a chuby engine. Where did you get that idea?

Scott;

Installing a long block Crashler flathead 6 in a P-15 is doable. How muxh experiance have you had in doing this kind of work.

[Norm's Coupe]

Norm;

Guess I missed the part about this car already having a chuby engine. Where did you get that idea?

Scott;

Installing a long block Crashler flathead 6 in a P-15 is doable. How muxh experiance have you had in doing this kind of work.

Don,

Guess I miss read his post. Upon reading it again I see that he was just thinking of putting the Chevy engine in.

No offense as I know you have the big flathead setup and know it works because I've seen it in action, but I still feel if your going to modify the drive train, I'd go with the Chevy engine setup he mentioned.

[Don Coatney]

Don' date='

Guess I miss read his post. Upon reading it again I see that he was just thinking of putting the Chevy engine in.

No offense as I know you have the big flathead setup and know it works because I've seen it in action, but I still feel if your going to modify the drive train, I'd go with the Chevy engine setup he mentioned.[/quote']

Geez Norm;

Now I am really offended:eek:

[Young Ed]

Maybe Norm should put his SBC into his coupe. Then we'd all know why it never leaves his house.

[BobT-47P15]

Hi Scott. Welcome to Plymouth ownership and this forum.

If you've read previous posts, you may recall that Mr Coatney here has a

DeSoto long block engine in his Plymouth. And Norm (Norm's Coupe) has

a pretty easy to install set of front disc brakes on his. So there are two

people who have first hand experience. And they're always willing to

help......that's part of the beauty of this forum.

[fireman_033]

i am, used to be, an ase certified tech but have been a fireman for the past 6 years i am 34 and have been working on cars since i was 12 rebuilt first motor at 13 so i am kinda experienced i have the welding machines and lift and such as that just need pointed in the right direction. any info i can get will be greatly appreciated the guy i got this car from also has a 49 52 four door sedan he may not sell parts but if enough people need good parts it may be worth it to get car and part it out or may even be a good one to restore if anyone looking for one out there let me know and i will go get price and check it out closer. Im gonna try to crank this engine some time this weekend but not looking for much who knows may have a good engine here just dont know why the intake/exhaust is loose like it is couldnt run as loose as it is or at least i dont think it could. anyways thanks again. Scott

[Reg Evans]

Come on Don....show him how you did it before he changes his mind.

[wayfarer]

...if you swap to one of them shiverlay injuns yullle havta join a witless protection programme...hahahaha

[blueskies]

i am, used to be, an ase certified tech but have been a fireman for the past 6 years i am 34 and have been working on cars since i was 12 rebuilt first motor at 13 so i am kinda experienced i have the welding machines and lift and such as that just need pointed in the right direction. any info i can get will be greatly appreciated the guy i got this car from also has a 49 52 four door sedan he may not sell parts but if enough people need good parts it may be worth it to get car and part it out or may even be a good one to restore if anyone looking for one out there let me know and i will go get price and check it out closer. Im gonna try to crank this engine some time this weekend but not looking for much who knows may have a good engine here just dont know why the intake/exhaust is loose like it is couldnt run as loose as it is or at least i dont think it could. anyways thanks again. Scott

I think keeping the six is a terrific idea, but then I'm a bit biased :D

I think you should assess the situation with your existing 218. It might just need some TLC and be a good runner without much work. Then you can start to spiff it a bit with some speed stuff.

Pete

[Don Coatney]

Scott;

Below is a link to my Photobucket picture album. I documented my long block install and other modifications with a couple thousand pictures. In my case I had to modify the front crossmember, move the radiator forward, modify the oil pan, modify the radiator bracket, modify the harmonic balancer, relocate the front engine mounts, and several other things I no longer remember. Check out the pictures in all my bucket albums and ask questions. I also have installed disc brakes, dual carburetors, dual exhaust, dual point distributor, a T-5 five speed overdrive transmission, and a 3.55/1 differential. In my opinion keeping a flathead 6 is the only way to go. I have made several long road trips in my car with no major complications. I have never been on the "hook".

[Norm's Coupe]

Well.......while you can dress up and hop up the old flatheads, they still won't hold a candle to a nice modern engine IMHO. Not only will you get better performance out of a 350 or other modern V8 engine, parts are a lot less expensive and a lot easier to get.

The picture below is of a 41 Plymouth. Not a 350 but a modern 318 in it, but either in stock form will probably still walk all over any flathead 6 on the highway that any of us could possibly build up.

[Don Coatney]

Well.......while you can dress up and hop up the old flatheads' date=' they still won't hold a candle to a nice modern engine IMHO. Not only will you get better performance out of a 350 or other modern V8 engine, parts are a lot less expensive and a lot easier to get.

The picture below is of a 41 Plymouth. Not a 350 but a modern 318 in it, but either in stock form will probably still walk all over any flathead 6 on the highway that any of us could possibly build up.

[/quote']

Norm;

If that is the way you really feel then why do you have a flathead in your car that you dont drive. If you had a SBC in it would you drive it?

[Norm's Coupe]

Don,

If I had an SBC in the car I would probably have A/C etc. as well. Would have probably also put in some nice bucket seats for more comfort at the same time. And yes, since it would be more comfortable then I would probably drive it more. Why didn't I do that to begin with.

Well.............At the time I bought my coupe, I still had the 70 Impala sitting here and the plan was to use that engine and drive train for the P15. However, I listened to too many other people telling me to rebuild the original engine and keeping things original. That was before I had internet access so the people were people close to me, not anyone on this forum. So, instead of following my own feelings I rebuilt the original engine and did the interior the way I did. I've been kicking myself ever since for not following my own feelings. But........if I had it to do all over, the coupe would have a nice 350 setup in it, along with all the comfort creatures to go with it.

Today, if someone were to offer me around $14,000 for my coupe it would be history to me. Then I could go after the real setup I was looking for. I'm not about to change everything in the coupe now because that would be money wasted. So..........that's the only reason I haven't put the 350 engine and tranny I have sitting in the corner of the garage in my coupe.

So........I guess you could say the flathead is still in there by default only.

[Normspeed]

I agree with Norm on the performance, but a fancy flathead six sure rates high on my fun meter. There's just something about 350/350 that makes my eyes glaze over. Same thing when I open a Hot rod magazine and turn the pages...Chevelle, Mustang, Chevelle, Camaro, Camaro, Camaro, Mustang, Chevelle... yawn.

Gotta go with whatever makes you happy though, it's your car to enjoy.

[homebrewer]

I've had em both. and not to offend the purists out there, My 350/350 combo is a lot more satisfying to me than the 6 ever was. Parts are easier to obtain, and usually a whole lot cheaper. You can buy a brand new crate motor a lot cheaper than rebuilding a 6 properly. It is a little tougher to work on due to the lack of room in the engine compartment, and cooling can be a problem when you run AC though. I know we are in the minority on this forum, but I can live with that . This forum is still the best of any forum Cars-Motorcycles- Beer that I belong to. George

[Young Ed]

Norm will you accept a 50 chevy in trade?? It would be a perfect home for a 350. I wouldn't replace the engine in an old car with a modern one. Its just like driving a modern car then. To me the fun is in the quirkyness of all the old technology. Norm it is really too bad you didn't listen to yourself. I've been there done that too. I've got a neighbor with a beautiful yellow 46-48 ford coupe. I've been in my house since 02 and I've never seen the car outside of the garage. I wonder if it even runs at this point.....

[Norm's Coupe]

Norm will you accept a 50 chevy in trade?? It would be a perfect home for a 350. I wouldn't replace the engine in an old car with a modern one. Its just like driving a modern car then. To me the fun is in the quirkyness of all the old technology. Norm it is really too bad you didn't listen to yourself. I've been there done that too. I've got a neighbor with a beautiful yellow 46-48 ford coupe. I've been in my house since 02 and I've never seen the car outside of the garage. I wonder if it even runs at this point.....

Ed,

Trades are ok, but if your talking about the 50 Chevy you just picked up last year, there would have to be a lot of money to boot. That car looked like it needed a lot of work.

As mentioned before, my coupe does leave the driveway when I want it to. But.......maybe your neighbors nice Ford is like my brother in laws nice 36 Ford Coupe. It's real nice too, but it rarely sees the light of day, and when it does it he doesn't drive it anywhere except around his neighborhood. He does drive his 38 Ford coupe a little more but again, not that far. Here's his 36. Both have the stock Flathead V8's.

[Young Ed]

Yup thats the 50 chevy. Pretty soon we'll start working on it again. I wouldn't be surprised to see it back on the road this summer. Its just a matter of who will own it at that time Body work is close to done and after that its just paint and interior.

I suspect my neighbors Ford is a street rod judging solely by the bright yellow color. I've never seen the front of it or heard it run to know more. He just opens the door and sits in his lawnchair behind the car. There is a early 70s fullsize merc in the stall next to it. That never leaves either

[Norm's Coupe]

He must be related to my brother in law. As mentioned the 36 rarely sees the light of day. It's seen less in the last 3 years. He built another garage in out in the back yard then put the 36 in it. There is no driveway to that garage and the 36 hasn't left the garage since. In fact, he pulled the rebuilt engine that was in it, rebuilt another late 40's V8 Flathead with a Merc crank and just finished putting it in last fall. It's in running condition again but he still has a few minor things left to put back on the frontend of the car before driving it. That is, if he ever drives it.

He keeps saying he likes working on them better than driving them but I think he's just afraid the car will get a scratch on it.

[Young Ed]

I'll never quite understand that. I'd have to drive it at least a little. Norm as much as we mess with you, you are still driving yours more that your brother in law and my neighbor. My car is totally unfinished and pretty rough but I sure have fun driving it. The first time I showed up for a POC event with it the other guys were thinking will he make it all weekend with that thing.... (I know cause later a couple said wow that things runs alot better then we thought it would)

[Norm's Coupe]

Ed,

Actually, once I got the brakes fixed on my coupe in 1995 I started driving it around a little. Never went too far in it though. The thing was only running on 3 1/2 cylinders and it also had a blown head gasket in it. But.......I was able to spit and sputter the thing up to about 40 MPH that way as it choked and coughed to get there. The 6 months or so that the engine was out of the car during the rebuild was the worst, couldn't drive it then (even in and out of the garage). Once the engine was back in though it was driven even without the seats in it and a hole in the floor that I cut out so I could replace that section. Just threw a piece of plywood over the floor and sat on a crate.

I'll bet I have more miles on my coupe since 1995 than my brother in law has on his 36 Ford, and he's owned it since the late 60's.

[Don Coatney]

I'll bet I have more miles on my coupe since 1995 than my brother in law has on his 36 Ford' date=' and he's owned it since the late 60's.[/quote']

Looks like this no driving thing runs in your family including both the in law and out law sides:D

[Young Ed]

I don't even drive mine that much but I wouldn't be surprised if I've got Norm beat in mileage and I've only been driving mine since 04. And then you've probably got my figure blown away too.