4 door P15s with Suicide Door hinges

[Ulu]

For 4 door owners:

Why is the rear bottom hinge exposed? Was the hinge bucket going to stick thru the wheel arch, the cavity available being very small??

 

Does the whole body shell simply get too thin right there? Or is it all about door geometry of the thick sill, needing the pins to move out?

(I see the sculpted bottom of the front door, and it seems the rears just look plumb & straight.)

 

All of the above?

 

I'm considering suicide doors for my P15 roadster project, but the exposed hinge is sure unwelcome.

 

It's been 30 years since I stepped into a P15 with 4 doors. I forget what's what.

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

lay it down and make a handicap ramp out of it for your golden years.....

[Ulu]

Thru that tiny door? Won't fit.

 

I'll need one of those sedanbulance Chryslers with no centerpost on the right side.

And a robot chauffeur, who can also work a grease gun and change oil.

White paint and some ghostbuster lights on top in case of traffic.

 

[Eneto-55]

5 hours ago, Ulu said:

For 4 door owners:

Why is the rear bottom hinge exposed? Was the hinge bucket going to stick thru the wheel arch, the cavity available being very small??

 

This.  From the surface where the lower hinge tongue mounts to the body, back to the inside of the fender well area there is only about 1 1/2" or a bit less.  I reckon it's just about all taken up with the steel frame work to support the door.  (If you need a photo, I can get one, as my car has both the left rear door & fender off.)

Edited March 16, 2020 by Eneto-55

[Ulu]

I would be interested in any photos of the structure.

 

Do you know if the 4-dr has a different body mount scheme?

[Eneto-55]

1 hour ago, Ulu said:

I would be interested in any photos of the structure.

 

Do you know if the 4-dr has a different body mount scheme?

Pretty sure the frame is the same on the 2 & 4 door sedans.  Comparing the club coupe, I'm not sure, but I think I recall having read that only the convertible has a different frame structure.

I checked our camera, and the batteries are dead.  My wife doesn't ever use it anymore, and I have another I keep at work - will bring it home tomorrow.  (She said "Cameras are obsolete - everyone takes pictures with their cell phones."  Well, I don't, as I only have a flip phone, and while I CAN take photos with it, I don't have a way to get them off of it, at least not anything simple.)

Edited March 17, 2020 by Eneto-55

[Andydodge]

As a general rule US cars have the same chassis for all closed body styles that have a center or fixed B pillar, ie, 4dr &  2dr sedans, coupes,wagons and sedan deliveries........2 & 4 dr hardtops and convertibles have the same chassis as each other which is usually made from thicker material or includes some form of "X" member to give strength when the centre or B pillar is not used........as for the need for the lower door hinge being exposed it will be as the result of the angle that the door opens together with the amount of clearance that the door needs from the rear fender when opened and could even be a result of a cost cutting measure from the factory with the bean counters having won a battle over the designers and/or engineers.............my Oz 1.5 cents worth......andyd      

[Ulu]

2 hours ago, Eneto-55 said:

Pretty sure the frame is the same on the 2 & 4 door sedans.  Comparing the club coupe, I'm not sure, but I think I recall having read that only the convertible has a different frame structure.

I checked our camera, and the batteries are dead.  My wife doesn't ever use it anymore, and I have another I keep at work - will bring it home tomorrow.  (She said "Cameras are obsolete - everyone takes pictures with their cell phones."  Well, I don't, as I only have a flip phone, and while I CAN take photos with it, I don't have a way to get them off of it, at least not anything simple.)

 

Don't stress. This is no emergency. I have the rest of my life to finish this build.

[Ulu]

33 minutes ago, Andydodge said:

. . . as for the need for the lower door hinge being exposed it will be as the result of the angle that the door opens together with the amount of clearance that the door needs from the rear fender when opened . . .

 

Yes, since the sill is so wide, and the hinge location is thin, I believe this was the case. Otherwise the door bottom could be sculpted back like the front of the front door, but that would make a sort of trip hazard getting out. I think they wanted the door corner square, and thus were stuck with a long hinge, sticking thru the skin.

[Eneto-55]

On 3/16/2020 at 7:20 PM, Ulu said:

I would be interested in any photos of the structure.

 

Do you know if the 4-dr has a different body mount scheme?

Here are a couple of photos I took last night.  I don't have very good light in my garage where the car is being stored, so I used one of those forehead flashlights to get some light on the area - kind of weird w/ the light on your head like that....

(I also took one from the front angle, but it is rather blurry.)

[Ulu]

Thanks a bunch. Clearly I had no idea what that rear door Corner looked like & in my mind it was not sculpted that way.

 

This is the first really clear photo I have seen.

[Eneto-55]

8 minutes ago, Ulu said:

Thanks a bunch. Clearly I had no idea what that rear door Corner looked like & in my mind it was not sculpted that way.

 

This is the first really clear photo I have seen.

I'm glad to be a help.  My job (self employed - keeps me busy not only during the day, but evenings as well) just really gets in the way of making any progress on my car.  (And I also lost some parts during 35 + years of storage.)

 

I was thinking that if someone had a wrecked 4 door, you could possibly cut out that C pillar, and patch it into a wider dog leg in a 2 door body, kinda' like the Dodge Grand Caravan & Plymouth Grand Voyager did as compared to the non-Grand models.  (Other minivan manufacturers put the extra length of their long body models behind the rear wheels, but Chrysler Corp put it between the wheels, where it belongs.)  Anyway, you would still need to modify the 4 door C pillar to accept the hidden hinge, but I think it could be done, possibly using a lower hinge pocket from the opposite side front door. 

[Ulu]

6 minutes ago, Eneto-55 said:

. . .  if someone had a wrecked 4 door, you could possibly cut out that C pillar, and patch it into a wider dog leg in a 2 door body . . . 

 

I did consider this, but since I will raise the door sill it won't be required. I will just weld up the stock doors, and carve a new one from stratch.