How to know wear on shoes w/o new to compare

[Grdpa's 50 Dodge]

Is there a measurement to go by?  Or distance down to rivets?

 

My old shoes LOOK like they have much wear left in them but its hard to tell with no reference point.

 

If I order new shoes they are going in.  I suppose I could keep old shes for relics or spare parts to help hold the garage down in the stiff winds we have lately.

 

I disassembled the wheel  down to the cylinders late last fall before cold hit for purpose of replacing wheel cylinders which was a good idea since old ones were rusted tight and had NO fluid in then,,,a substance that most resembled sand.  Didnt even get a drip of fluid out of the hoses.

 

Now to get the lines off to replace as well as master cylinder(new one in box here now)

 

Also thinking now is time to drop gas tank for same reason,,,a strong look and clean out of any crap in there.

 

Guess what I need is a shot of motivation, and a shot of energy to boot.  Have a couple part time jobs that are like feast or famine.  And trying to remodel a house at same time.(At the point of finishing interior paint and ready to hang cabinets, and trim, and doors)  I get so tired cant function well sometimes.  I hate getting old!!!

 

Nice decent almost warm weather is here,,,I need to get this done.

 

So question of the day,,,do I NEED new shoes,,,and order now,,,or get as many miles as I can from old and worry about it later?? (car has about 56K original miles, age of shoes unknown) No large ridges or wear spots on shoes or drums...If I determine somehow I have half or more life left I think I should run them a while.  How do I determine that???

[Plymouthy Adams]

if the shoe linings are not riveted then you have no wear mechanical indicator as it would show lining to the rivet level..as the rivets are brass.....bonded limits are usually between 2 and 3 mm (approx. 5/64) but the whole thing depends on even wear of a properly aligned shoe.  you have to read the lining left to right across the surface in relationship to the backing as well as reading it concentric along the surface heel to toe...any minimum thickness along any of the contact surface is your indicator to change...proper alignment is critical to long life of the shoe and the reason the brake gauge is critical in set up be it the 1760 or Miller equivalent..

Edited April 6, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams

[Grdpa's 50 Dodge]

Did you mean a 1750 or is the 1760 a newer version??? So you are saying the rivets SHOULD have at least 2-3 mm space minimum so they dont rub??  I will go see how much space I have in a few minutes.  Or do you run them down to the rivets before replacement??  Guess I didnt understand the term "bonded limits"  (((type slow cause I understand even slower)))

[captden29]

Pa, bonded linings can separate due to the age of the shoe and not how much lining is left.i suppose the bonding agent just dries out and the lining separates off the shoe. yes, this happened to a 51 Chrysler that I used to own. I prefer bonded linings, but new ones are the way to go.   capt den

[Plymouthy Adams]

typo on the 1750 

 

not riveted..2-3mm

 

riveted is the head of the rivet making contact..

[Plymouthy Adams]

captden29, on 06 Apr 2014 - 12:12 PM, said:captden29, on 06 Apr 2014 - 12:12 PM, said:captden29, on 06 Apr 2014 - 12:12 PM, said:

Pa, bonded linings can separate due to the age of the shoe and not how much lining is left.i suppose the bonding agent just dries out and the lining separates off the shoe. yes, this happened to a 51 Chrysler that I used to own. I prefer bonded linings, but new ones are the way to go.   capt den

yes any shoe that is bonded can fail with the glue...it is accelerated due to heat as the linings get thin..also new ones can fail rather early in their application also...no real guarantee to age or mileage...inspections and common sense plays a huge part here...IF doing your own work and you have doubts of the components you have then get new...or take it to a brake shop who will bear the liability of the work involved..I just answered the wear limit question as outlined by those state that still have a brake inspection program for annual safety certification..

 

as an added note, as both a certified brake mechanic and state vehicle licensed inspector, (previous life) I know what I would fail a car on in a heartbeat..

Edited April 6, 2014 by Plymouthy Adams

[_shel_ny]

When new would be 13/64".

[desoto1939]

You can also get the brake lining gage tool at any good auto supply store.  This is the tool that the mechanics use to measure the lining thickness.  Be careful there are two different tools one for dick bake lining measurement and one for regular style drum style brake thickness.  You can pick these up in the swap meets also.  Do a search on ebay to see what type you need.

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

[Grdpa's 50 Dodge]

just went to look,,,I guess I just learned the difference between bonded and riveted.  Expected to see rivet heads on face of lining sorta like a clutch,,,,but no rivets so I guess they are bonded.

 

Thickness varies a bit,,,seems both ends are a little better than the middle section.  Middle is probably down to thickness of a quarter which is about same thickness as backing metal.  Both ends are almost double that,,,which isnt a huge difference but some.

 

Meanwhile they are completely smooth and even across the face.

 

But with ends better than the middle does that mean the arc is off and new shoes need arced to drums??  Wish I had one new shoe to compare old to.  Does NAPA keep these on the shelf??Doubt it, but depends how far up in years the same shoes fit or other apps

[austinsailor]

Hearing the condition of the cylinders, no question, replace the shoes. I'm actually surprised on or more linings haven't come loose already, but the will soon. I've taken apart a number of older ones like that and about half have just come off. With the effort you're putting into it, another $100 to make it right is a no brainer. There isn't even any extra labor involved.

Gene

[_shel_ny]

Took my shoes and drums to a local shop to have new linings done. Burned off the old bonded linings, and riveted new on. Shop fit the shoes to the drum. Problem I had was the new linings were too thick. Had to take them back to be ground down to be able to get the drums back on. Shoes centered with Ammco 1750

[desoto1939]

The official thickness here is PA for our state Inspection at the min is 3/32 left on the lining.  So if you are that close then they replace the shoes.  This is also on the modern cars for disc and drum style bakes shoes.

 

Like I said get the lining brake shoe gage at your local auto supply and when you take off your drum then measure the thickness.

The starting thickness for the riveted lining is 3/16 thickness this is pretty much standard.

 

Not all cars and trucks use the same lining numbers.  I can look up lining numbers for you.

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

Edited April 7, 2014 by desoto1939