Work Stops... So Do My Wheels

[Edward Roberts]

What I've learned this weekend:

1. All speedometer cables from out of state must be returned

2. Horn circuits were not meant to work

3. My fuel problem is in my sending unit

4. Tackle only one system a weekend to avoid plummeting morale

5. My brakes are now locked

Since #5 stops me from driving tomorrow, I will toss out a question about it. PO stated he "did the brakes," and why would a PO lie? I pumped the brakes repeatedly and slowly tonight to determine when the brake light comes on (suspecting it to be very late in the braking process). Brakes have worked great until about the fifth pump... now they are locked. Fortunately I was just pulling back into the garage from an evening drive.

With all four brakes locking (or very nearly so) where should I start my search for the problem? Master cylinder? Could air cause this? Or is it possible that heat from my drive (about 18 hilly miles) combined with the pumping cause this anomaly?

I've tried searching the threads, but maybe I'm just too tired and down... think I'll go watch The Office and hope for an overnight hint.

[55 Fargo]

Hey hang in there, take a breather for at least the rest of tonight.

All of these issues you will get corrected, 1 at a time, or whichever is need the most.

I know it's easy to get down and frustrated at tiems, but trust me it will all come together, but sometimes we need to walk away and not think about it for a while.

Brakes all locked up, check MC, relief port clogged, look into the MC and you will see this little port, it must be free and clear to allow the MC to relieve hydraulic pressure. If all for wheel's brakes are locked, the MC should be the culprit.

Gas Gauge, sender unit, if both are working, make sure all connections are tight and clean, are the wires from gauge to sender, in good shape. What is the gauge and sender doing, is dead, or partially working, is this 1 wire or 2 wire sender gas gauge?

I am sure you will find all the answers to your problems/issues on this forum.

Take the night off, and go relax..........

[Captain Neon]

PO owner lied a bout repairing the brakes. More than likely he had issues that he couldn't cure on the cheap; probably making things worse. Since he did perform some work on them, he has a clear conscience in saying that he did the brakes. Did them wrong it appears.

I've told my self that if I ever had to do a lot of work on my brakes that I will convert to disc brakes. That may be some thing to consider. There are a couple of good kits out there.

[PatS....]

It's been my experience that these brakes are the most needy, troublesome brakes ever put on a vehicle.

The PO probably did do the brakes. They go south in a hurry just sitting for the winter

I bought Charlies disc brake kit, will switch the rear end to a 72 Plymouth Satelite unit for the brakes and install ECI's dual reservoir master cylinder kit.

I spent enough time rebuilding these brakes in the 70's...no more wasted time and money...they go in the scrap metal bin.

BUT, that's just my personal opinion based on my experience with a 49 Chrysler as a daily driver from 72 to about 79 off and on. (Parked all winter...useless in winter)

But I loved that old car and with updated brakes and a few other updates, I'm looking forward to having another on the road. Not this year though

[Aussie D25]

At least your horn dosn't earth out inside the steering column and blow a your ear drums out every time you turn right.

[Don Coatney]

As Rockwood said this bleed back hole pictured below must be open. However I suspect you have an adjustment problem possibly two fold. The shoes must be correctly adjusted to the drum. In my opinion the only way to do this correctly do this is by using the Ammco tool or Miller equivlent.

Secondly the adjustable rod that pushes the piston inside the master cylinder must be adjusted with enough travel to allow the piston to move far enough to expose the bleed back hole.

My guess is that if you check your brakes this morning they will not be locked up. But if you pump them a few times they will once again lock up.

What speedometer shop messed up your cable?

[rockable]

You are fortunate that they worked until you arrived home. There is NOTHING on the car more important than the brakes. Do yourself a favor and take the time to go through every component and make sure it's all up to snuff. This includes the lines and hoses.

After attempting a quick "patch it up" job on my brakes, I elected to do the dual master cylinder and front disc conversion. I replaced all the plumbing, while I was at it. You can't believe how fragile 70 year old brake lines are.

As someone already said, Chill out first. Then start fixing stuff one at a time until you are confident you have a SAFE and reliable car to drive. Don't let it drive you crazy. When you get frustrated, take a break and walk away from it for a while.

[Plymouthy Adams]

If you attempt to go through the stock brakes be sure you have the proper brake guage tool..without it you may get a firm pedal but your shoe wear pattern will not be correct and the actual contact surface less than full so you effectively have a brake system that is degraded and will fade fast....the odds of getting that done proper without the tool and by feel are slim to none..slim is out of town..

[55 Fargo]

I adjusted my brakes initially as per the manual, my drums had very little material removed.

I have since adjusted and checked my brake shoes with home made brake tool, they were quite close, and the wear pattern looked fairly even.

I had a very good brake pedal right off the bat, with adjusting without a special tool. I am not stating it should be done like this, just my experience.

I also no a bunch of Old Mopar owners who have adjusted there brakes the same way, all brakes work well. 1 owner has 3 vintage Mopars, his brakes are all adjusted, without the brake gauges, all have good brakes, and wear patterns.

Again, the brakes would perform best witha correct brake adjustment right off the bat, sometimes brake shoe grinders were used to create an arc, but this will happen with some wear.

I do see the wisdom and advantage in a disc brake upgrade, but the stock brakes will perform if set-up poperly and are adjusted periodically

[Plymouthy Adams]

with all due respect to those who have other methods and I assure a homemade guage can do a good job for those that have them, I do not think a new owner be tainted by the shade tree...as stated, these unit when done right will go a long way before needing attention...and when said attentions times comes, the wear patter is even and thus the "touch up" will be quick easy smooth and allow even longer wear of the shoe...if it was just slapped on and make contact then why in the name of Sam did the factory go to such ends to get these tool produced and why is there not a "tweak till you hear/feel drag" adjustment in the book...sorry but in the area of brakes..you should not be guessing..and due to the high cost of this tool if and when you should be able to find one is more than enough to do an upgrade to disc over and above the sure fact that they are superior..all the way around...to the new owner..do as you think is best but my advice is not to proceed with brake repair in the absence of the tool..if you carry it to a brake shop, be sure to ask and "verify" that they do have the tool on sight..it will be money well spent if done correctly..a headache if not..

Edited June 13, 2010 by Tim Adams

[Edward Roberts]

Thanks everyone for the responses.

The brakes were fine this morning, as predicted, Don. And thank you for the photo. I am so impressed with the number of photos available on the forum - they really help. I've been trying to take photos from a newbie standpoint for that very reason - nothing any veterans would need, but for any future newbies once I'm an old hand.

Took the rest of the weekend off to write. I suppose I will start by making sure the relief port is clear. I had already read some of your posts, Don, about proper adjustment. With my attempt to keep this car as originalish as possible, I guess I will be heeding Fred and Tim's advice on equipment, as filtered through my finances accordingly. Pat & Benjamin, if I decide in 10 years I was a fool for trying to keep this brake system going, you both will get invitations to my "You-Told-Me-So" party:D

Thanks again, everyone. For any member who is thinking of leaving because of or in spite of Hot Rods vs. Trailer Queens, it's responses such as these that make forums like this valuable. "Hey, take a break, it ain't as bad as you think" transcends one's personal opinion about how a car should be returned to or kept on the road.

[Joe Flanagan]

Edward, it's never quite as bad as you think once you take a little time off and revisit it. Some of the worst moments of my project have happened between my ears.