Manifold - I must be living right!

[RobertKB]

Up date on my manifold removal and broken bolt. I finally got the manifold off using various punches as wedges, BFH, and finally a crowbar and BFH combination. Had to pull the valve cover and gasket below the offending area so I could get a wedge in there as the manifold would tip forward from the top due to where the broken bolt was located. I sighed with relief when the manifold came off and I had broken nothing.

Yound Ed wins the next stage, removal of the offending bolt. In the first picture it would have been located in the hole below numbers 2 and 3 exhaust ports (to the right of bolt number 13 some people don't know about). Put the vice grips on after heating the area up and could tell I would twist the bolt and break it again as there was at least two inches of broken bolt. Decided to use Shel_bizzy_48's idea about doubling up nuts and try to turn it out that way. Cut the not threaded part off with a hacksaw. Theads were way too damaged and could not get a die on it to rethread it. OK, now I have a shorter bolt and after heating it up again, tapping healthily with a hammer, I put the vice grips on again and could see some movement. Very gently and carefully kept turning and heating, and she came out. I think one reason this worked was because before the bolt broke I had managed to turn it out some. No drilling and tapping required. Young Ed, you win the prize!

Second picture shows the remains of the offending bolt held so the hole it was through in the manifold is just above it. Last picture shows general condition of the manifold.

Now for clean up, resurfacing the manifold after putting in a heat riser kit I just ordered. Incidentally, very little sludge in the valve gallery.

Thanks to everyone on the forum for your support and good ideas. It really helped!

Edited December 17, 2009 by RobertKB

[Joe Flanagan]

Good job, Robert. Interesting pictures. You can sleep well tonight. It's great when things go that way. When you say you will resurface the manifold do you mean you'll have it milled?

[RobertKB]

Good job, Robert. Interesting pictures. You can sleep well tonight. It's great when things go that way. When you say you will resurface the manifold do you mean you'll have it milled?

Yes, milled is another term for it. Just gets everything level so the gaskets should fit snugly. As mentioned, I will put the new heat riser kit in and reassemble the two manifolds and then have the machine work done. Probably have the machine shop do everything. Would love to do the block too but not possible unless the engine is out and apart. You are right, I will sleep well tonight. The rest is pretty straight forward.

[desoto1939]

Here is a question for the group. Since the manifold is apart would it make any improvment to the engine to shave down the edges on the intake and exhaust port holes to allow for a smoother flow.

I know this has been done on race cars but would this be of any benefit to our cars.

In put from the group is helpful. If this is a good thing then now is the time to do the shaving on the angles.

rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

[Don Coatney]

Decided to use Don C's idea about doubling up nuts and try to turn it out that way.

I dont think I posted that on your current manifold problems. I have posted that in the past but Young Ed posted it recently so he gets the credit.

Here is a question for the group. Since the manifold is apart would it make any improvment to the engine to shave down the edges on the intake and exhaust port holes to allow for a smoother flow.

I know this has been done on race cars but would this be of any benefit to our cars.

In put from the group is helpful. If this is a good thing then now is the time to do the shaving on the angles.

rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

Rich;

Porting (removing metal to match the manifold ports to the engine ports and gaskets) is always a good idea. Race car owners always do this and all engines will benifit by doing this for better air flow. I recommend it.

[RobertKB]

I dont think I posted that on your current manifold problems. I have posted that in the past but Young Ed posted it recently so he gets the credit.

Don, you are correct. It was Shel_bizzy_48 who posted it and thanks to him for the advice. I will change that in the above post. Young Ed won the lottery on manifold bolt removal.

Edited December 17, 2009 by RobertKB

[alan32433]

Robert,

I just finished the same project on my 48 DeSoto, twice. I removed all the manifold studs simply to replace them. The first time around I sealed the threads in the block with permatex in a can. Got everything back together and started the engine. I had several water leaks around the manifold studs. Several days had passed with plenty of time for the permatex to dry, but still had bad leaks. I had to take it all apart again and remove the studs. This time I used high temp silicone and used a tooth pick to place some silicone on the female threads in the block, as well as coated the stud threads. This time I had no leaks. I suggest you learn from my mistake and seal the threads similar to the way I did (the second time), and use high temp silicone.

Alan

[RobertKB]

Robert,

I just finished the same project on my 48 DeSoto, twice. I removed all the manifold studs simply to replace them. The first time around I sealed the threads in the block with permatex in a can. Got everything back together and started the engine. I had several water leaks around the manifold studs. Several days had passed with plenty of time for the permatex to dry, but still had bad leaks. I had to take it all apart again and remove the studs. This time I used high temp silicone and used a tooth pick to place some silicone on the female threads in the block, as well as coated the stud threads. This time I had no leaks. I suggest you learn from my mistake and seal the threads similar to the way I did (the second time), and use high temp silicone.

Alan

Good advice and I had planned on using some anti-seize compound that has worked for me in the past. I am going to leave the studs that are still in the block alone as they are in nice shape. Everything else will be sealed with either anti-seize of the hight temp silicone you mentioned. Thanks for the advice.

I have ordered two new long studs to replace the bolts that were used when I put this engine together about 30 years ago. Engine is a 251 CID from a three ton grain truck but the manifolds are from the original engine in the car that was toast.

[alan32433]

Robert,

I use anti-seize on all bolts unless they go into a water jacket or an oil galley. It definately prevents frozen bolts but I don't think it provides much of a seal. Good luck with your project.

[Powerhouse]

I used some high temp silicone for the same reason...worked like a charm. I also used teflon tape on all the wet bolts as extra insurance. Tape is cheap.

I had the pleasure of taking a 47 manifold off last night...it came off so nicely...NO broken bolts! That's a first for me. The gaskets had dcpd on them...looks like originals...

[Jim Saraceno]

I've been VERY lucky in the manifold stud department. I've taken two old manifolds off and apart, replaced the studs and never had one break. As a matter of fact, for all the bolts I've turned on my '35, I can't think of any that have broken. I can even get my rear drums off without any problems.

On the other hand, when in came time to remove the water distribution tube during the engine rebuild, I cant tell you how long it took and how many cans of penetrant it took.