Loren

You might take a look at my experience under the topic frustration in getting the right part. I finally got an NOS clock for my 49 and being that it came with the wiring and lamp I think the extra money was well spent. Not every car of that era had a clock, so there’s no shame in not having one. Besides they are asking as much for a delete plate as you’d expect to pay for a clock. It’s surprising how well made such a primitive piece of technology they are. ”Electrically wound mechanical clock” is what it says on the box.

Besides the OEM modules there are performance after market ones as well. (the key is the 4 connectors) Then there is the MSD multiple spark boxes that just plug in to give you (I think) it's 6 sparks per firing up to 3,000 rpm. That pretty much covers the entire rpm range of a street driven flathead 6. If you are a gadget nut there's a lot of add ons for GM HEI.

Back in the late 1950s early 1960s all the pre war racers were deep into middle age. The old car hobby was getting started. As a little kid I was really into Model T Fords and I had every Floyd Clymer book on them that was in print. My Dad humored me but he liked Model As so we played with both. The added bonus were the race cars. For years we went to the Signal Hill climb just to hear and see them run. An old time racer Joe Gemsa took all of his pre war knowledge of what worked and what didn't and built the tooling and patterns for an Aluminum Overhead Conversion for a Model A/B/C (1928-34). They were really quite nice actually. There were some older guys who had several of the pre war designed heads and they got offended that now anybody could own an Overhead. A bitter campaign ensued over the "Purity" of having a car with one of his heads. It got so bad that people he considered friends shunned him. Gemsa finally retreated and didn't come to shows and swap meets anymore. If you saw him and asked about a head he blew you off unless you knew one of his better friends. It was really tragic what happened. The upshot half a century later is all the detractors are dead and a new generation are "discovering" the incredibly rare Gemsa head. These things are now literally priceless. So while a modern V8 powered engine swap car is not my cup of tea. I know that one day it will be a "Period Correct Hot Rod." It's just not from the period I wish to dwell in. Los_Control is on to something, the SBC's day has come and gone just like the Cadillac OHV V8's day before it and the Ford Flathead V8 before that. An old friend of mine told me stories about how he made money racing Model Ts that had an Essex 4 engine swapped in! I actually witnessed a very well driven very powerful Essex 4 race car at a Vintage Car race in Reno. It was very impressive! (both the driver and the car) I can only imagine a light weight Model T with one in it. So look around and enjoy the view, there may be row after row of swapped V8s around now but one day they maybe Tesla powered.

It does make you wonder how they did it. I am sure the engine came apart every race and was crack tested everywhere. They said he had post race inspections 15 times out of 19 races. They used to pay you around $100 (enough for a gasket set, rings and bearings) if you passed the inspection. That had me wondering if they called for an inspection just to help him with expenses. Petty more than the rest was doing this as a business. Using Plymouths fit his business model. A low priced car reliable enough for taxi duty with good handling because it was light. The ability to use heavy duty parts from other Chrysler cars (the Imperial springs, shocks and wheels). It all fits. The list of things they could do besides NDT and balancing might have included Nitriding the crank shaft (to harden the bearing surfaces). The 92 mph figure agrees with the magazine road test data I've seen in several places as the top speed of a Plymouth. All of Lee Petty's strategy was to get to the finish line in the money (5th place and above) at the end of the race. How long it took to get up speed didn't matter if he could stay at his race speed longer than the others even if it was slower. It's the old tortoise and the hare story with the added twist that he was doing this as a business. Fascinating!

There's been some questions about wheels and tires lately and because of my activities with brakes I've had to study up. I knew I had read about Lee Petty and his 49 Business Coupe and for the longest time I couldn't find it again. I found it last night and had to read pages of Petty Enterprises history....fascinating! He talked about using Chrysler Imperial springs (front and rear) shocks and wheels. Surprisingly he used 4.78 final drive gears! He said the little Plymouth would only go 92 mph! Now I maybe wrong but I had to calculate it out. C64 Imperial wheels are 15x6 with 8.20x15 tires C66 Crown Imperial Wheels are 15x6 1/2 with 8.90x15 tires Using the Crown 8.90x15 tires (31 inches tall) with a 4.78 final drive means the little Plymouth was wound up to 5,000 rpm at 92 mph! If that doesn't get your attention he said because the car was so light he never took his foot off the throttle. The Oldsmobiles had to slow down for the corner then try to accelerate out but because he never did slow down he had the edge on them. Imagine lap after lap at 5,000 rpm for 500 miles....in a flathead Plymouth!?!? We know he did it and so did others. So I don't think we can call B.S. on that. He said the car handled better than the big engine V8s, didn't use tires and was easy on fuel, so he made fewer pit stops and had fewer accidents because of blown tires. He just motored around lap after lap his objective was finishing in the top 5 where he could make money racing. This is what I am talking about! This is what gives me satisfaction with these old things! There's a story, a history and we can actually drive one. It's a different experience if you crane out the flathead 6 and install a V8. I personally think you lose something when you do that.

Machine shops which do a lot of this kind of work are never hesitant to take on this job. As usual if you have the right tool it is easy money. They don't have to jig it up and mill it or grind it. It's much easier than that! They use a really big Belt Sander made for just such a job. They only use a milling machine to do spot facing of the two manifolds bolt bosses. I've had trouble getting the exhaust pipe to seal at the manifold. The previous owner had a muffler shop bend up the exhaust and they put a flange which has oversized slotted holes in it. When tightened it flexes and misaligns so it never seals. Walker Exhaust makes a two piece bolt together repair flange for a problem flange on GM cars. I had to modify it slightly to fix my problem. The flared part which contacts the old flange and the flared pipe wasn't flat so I used a belt sander to get it flat. Now it contacts the flange all the way around and since the bolt holes are smaller it aligns much better when tightening. Walker P/N 36132

I have a 52 Suburban too! In the coming weeks I might even be able to SEE the car. It's buried inside a warehouse behind an unassembled garden building I am going to put up soon. Mine is getting a 265 Chrysler 25 inch engine I built for it. What a great and useful car! A recent "Plymouth Bulletin" had Walter Redmond's 52 High-Clearance Suburban on the cover. Kind of gets you going! One question, have you found a source for the tail gate rubber? I totally agree on V8s (of any kind) in early cars. There has to be a story or some kind of history to make it worthwhile. Just cramming a V8 in doesn't have enough "romance" for me. I used to live in Northern Nevada where Hot August Nights is a yearly event and after you've seen row after row of nice cars all with Chevy V8 power you begin to think the owners lack imagination. I don't wish to offend anyone, we are all entitled to what gets our pulse quickened. I favor the traditional hot rodded 6 (or flathead V8) that was buzzing around when I was a kid. Chevy Overhead Valve V8s came on the scene too late for me to get excited about, besides when they did start to race they blew up a lot (then). On my Suburban I figure most folks will see that Chrysler Flathead 6 and think it's a Plymouth engine anyway which will be my own little joke. Besides the guys who know what it is are the kind of guys I want to talk to.

My Mom had a 1955 with with the 277 V8 and a PowerFite and it was wonderful car! I wish she had saved it for my first car but she sold it for $15! It was absolutely reliable and a great looking car. It was a Red and Black 2 door hard top, very snazzy! Or at least I thought so from the first time I saw it, till the last time. Oh and you can put a Bendix-Stromberg WW on it to good effect! Just say'n. If you have to put a V8 in your 40, I'd have to approve that one for purely sentimental reasons. lol But that is what the car hobby is all about...how your car makes YOU feel. I admit I go out to my 49 and open the door just to see the new clock ticking away and keeping perfect time! That makes me happy!

Bless you for saving this marvelous car! I was turned on to these carburetors from a guy who specialized in carburetors. He had once held a license to build Stromberg 97s and thought the WW was a much better carburetor. He proved it by put them on all sorts of cars from Mercedes 450SLs to my little SAAB 96 V4. The SAAB set a class record at El Mirage Dry Lake of 117.42 mph way back in 1978, breaking a record that had existed for 20 years. WW carburetors are found on so many cars I can't list them. Bendix-Stromberg also sold them as replacement carburetors for cars that didn't come with them and I can't imagine that the performance wasn't improved by using one. The Power Pack manifold added a bunch of horse power and it was so simple. One carburetor and simple linkage to deal with. Of course if you wanna trade I have an Edmunds or an Offenhouser manifold I'd trade for one, might even throw in a couple of carburetors too. lol

Wow! You have three desirable cars! My 1949 Business Coupe came with a 218 and 3,73 gears. I've put an Overdrive in it and I think it's great! Suburbans are heavier (the Coupe being the lightest Mopar) but even with the 201 it should be able to pull 3.73 gears. You might see more Kick Downs with your Overdrive however in hill country. That said a 3.54 is not a huge difference and with the 230 Power Pack it would be ideal. BTW the Power Pack Bendix-Stromberg WW carburetor is my all time favorite. Here's the best part about your plan: You don't have to dismantle the whole car to change gear ratios. You can just change the Differential Carrier NOT the whole axle. Which means if 3.54 is too tall a gear for your area, all you have to do is change the Differential Carrier to the 3.73. Much easier than changing whole rear axles or pulling them out to change ring and pinions. Plus if things change (like if you move to hill country) you have a selection of gear ratios on the shelf ready to go. You have options! The question becomes Overdrive or Automatic. If you still have the original 1940 gear box it may still have the one year only second gear ratio the old time Hot Rodders prized. (The Ford guys had their version too. If you heard an old timer talking about Lincoln Zephyr Gears, that's what they are. LZ gear sets are going for $600+ now days) So you have much to play with! Enjoy!

I am a big fan of the stock 8.25 rear end. (1937-56) However, your 1936 has a different rear axle that I do not have experience with. I believe a 1937-56 8.25 could handle a V8 as they were used in a lot of cars that had them. My M.O. is to make a change AFTER the stock part has been proven to lack the needed strength. The old "if it works don't fix it" motto applies. As far as the Overdrive transmission is concerned I am a huge fan of those too but again there's an age problem. The R10 Overdrive that most of us are used to can be installed easily in a 1940 to (what?) 1956 because of the column shift. A 1936 might be better off with a T5 because of the floor shifter. People who know me know I dislike T5s intensely. The reason is most are sourced from S10 pickups (because of the shifter location) and have the worst ratios ever. So how would I approach this? I'd be seriously questioning myself as to why I wanted a V8. In the end I think you'll be changing everything and it might be better to get a later car (1940-41?) There's no way I can see what vision you have for your car. Just know anything is possible but even if you can, should you be doing it? More power, more reliability might be had from a later 230 Plymouth or Dodge flathead six and that would be a lot easier and cheaper to do.

Generally you use a ridge reamer BEFORE you take the pistons out. The so called ridge is the place in the bore where the rings start and stop. The top ring gets rounded on its edge and as it rocks in the bore it wears the "ring lands" (or grooves) in the piston. This causes them to recede in the bore a little. The results are that a groove in the bore forms. When you go to remove the pistons the rings hit that ridge (I have heard them called "cylinder ledges" as well) and they break the rings when forced. Needless to say you might want to change the pistons if that has happened. If you change pistons you might as well bore the block. A caution: some machine shops will bore a block to pistons they have on hand....not what is required....so suddenly an engine that needs a .010 overbore gets a .060 overbore. I've taken to supplying the pistons rather than buying them from the machine shop thereby removing that temptation. But you have to have the means to accurately measure the block to guess what size you need. The idea behind removing the ridges (besides getting the pistons out safely) is to remove the "dull" radius worn area which will encounter the new sharp piston ring thus breaking it on the first rotation of the engine. The problem is as I see it that unless you are real careful and have a good sharp reamer the area you're working on is the place in the bore that sees the maximum pressure. Not done perfectly and you will lose a lot of pressure to blow by. If you're doing a "used car lot" rebuild, go ahead on. If you plan on keeping the car then do a real rebuild with properly fitted pistons. A ring and valve job is not a rebuild, it is a kind repair as the engine still has old worn cylinder bores and certainly doesn't have the compression of a new engine. Just my humble opinion.

Please be careful! I see the clock I sent back is already on eBay again along with the one I actually paid for. Still no apology or other communication. I too am interested in Sniper's find. An instrument cluster a radio and a clock plus the rest of the dash for $300 delivered. Bravo! I think I'd be having it Hydro Graphic printed with wood grain with the savings.

There's a non-working Jaeger on eBay for $200. You might give Instrument Services a call. The one I got from them is a Berg. Who knew a clock could be so expensive that one that doesn't work is worth $200? I have more money in that clock than I do the radio....if only the radio worked as well.

I finally got the new clock! It came in the original MoPar box and it was so nice it was almost a shame to install it. I got it in the dash and wired up, as soon as I put the battery cable back on I could hear the clunk of the winder. You have to put your head near the clock to hear it ticking. It was date stamped June 1949. I expected to have to have it cleaned but the company who sold it must have done that already. It was expensive but very satisfying to hear it working and see it keeping proper time. I was supplied by Instrument Services, Inc. 4075 Steele Drive Machesney Park, Il 61115 WWW.clocksandgauges.com (815) 316-2921 I think they deserve a shout out from a very happy customer!

A good Speedometer shop can fix it fast and they will check the calibration too. This is one of those items I don't bother trying to fix myself. If in doubt...send it out. You'll be money ahead. Also with all the electronics these days, these guys are like shoe repair guys. If they are still in business they probably do good work and you need to support them.

In my research Greg G is correct the max backspace is 3 1/2 inches (this is what the stock '49 wheels are and you can't go more because things start bumping) which means any increase over stock width goes to the outside. There seems to be plenty of room for wider rims in the fender openings as long as you don't go too large on the tires. One thing usually over looked is the hub diameter, most after market wheels are around 1/2 inch larger in the I.D. than the Mopar hub O.D.. I don't know if you care about that but I do. 6 to 7 inch wide sounds about right but if you are using over 205/75/15 tires, (the modern radial equivalent to the stock size) a test fit would be a good idea. Another thing to remember is the wider the tire the greater the steering effort will be when parking. Radials typically like more caster than the Plymouth can be adjusted for but considering the advantages Radials have I don't think 99 out of 100 owners would care. Great looking car Andy!

I thought I knew everything to get this job done but it seems there are some nuances to this project which I have overlooked. You can drop the drums into the wheels and everything looks fine until you tighten the lugs. So...yes you will be changing the wheels....Chrysler Windsor 12 inch brakes have the right King Pins but the wrong upper bushing (or needle bearing). The steering arms bolt right up but they are now lower than the Chrysler ones. I am still trying to work out wether this could be a problem or they will need to be changed. Big Chrysler Knuckles have bigger King Pins and therefore are not being used for this mod (they might possibly work if you changed the Supports. Which is not a job I'd tackle unless I was rebuilding the entire front end). The wheels however can be used as they have the same bolt pattern. Bottomline: Once I work out the kinks and get all four wheels on the ground and fully tested, I will put together a new bill of materials and a procedure on how to get satisfactory results. I have to admit this is a work in progress.

I have looked the wheels over with close attention to what exactly is going on. It will require a spacer 1/2 inch thick. They make them but I think I am going to go wheel shopping. Wheels do flex on hard cornering so what clears while standing might not clear while they are being used. I am pretty sure a 16 inch wheel will clear. It's the drop center that bumps where the center meets the rim (at the riveted portion). Yes the unsprung weight does increase. There is simply more iron involved. I don't believe it would be noticeable and considering the benefits it's a good trade off. Comparing the weight increase versus Vented Disc Brakes, I would have to think the drums would be less. Now I am on another treasure hunt...

A final resolution Ebay sent me an email this morning stating that THEY were refunding the rest of my money including the shipping costs. Not a word from the seller. Sorry would have been nice. When my daughter graduated from law school the guest speaker said one line that stuck with me. ”A reputation that takes years to build can be destroyed in an instant with a bad choice.” Of course I knew the sentiment I just hadn’t heard it put into words. Nobody ever remembers graduation speeches but I remember that line of that speech.

An update There is a cheap quick and dirty solution to the wheel fitting problem. A wheel spacer (oddly to fit disc brakes on some cars) can be had to give enough clearance. With some testing I am going to determine the exact thickness needed. I will pick some up this week at Summit Racing when I go back to Nevada.

An Update to the clock. EBay informs me that the seller received my return and has refunded HALF of my money less a DEDUCTION of $38. They asked if I wanted to open a case. Damn right I do! To recap the clock I bought was listed as “New out of box” with some pieces missing ( the lamp socket and the cable ). The clock I got was used and not even the same style as the one in the listing. I told eBay because of this I expected and demanded 100% refund as this is a case of fraud pure and simple. I am very close to revealing the name of the seller to this forum. They knew what they were doing because they have never responded to my original message about the switch in items. Further they now have no clocks for sale....if they ever had the one I ordered, which I am beginning to doubt. I would not buy from this supplier again even if they were the only source for a particular part ( which I believe they are in a couple of cases ). Good customer service is not rocket science and pays big dividends in customer loyalty, swindling people does not.

Okay news I did not want to hear! This morning I put a wheel on the drum I finished mounting yesterday. When you tighten the lug bolts on the Safety Rim Wheels the assembly won't turn! An investigation found the problem, the centers of the Safety Rim Wheels at the dips closest to the outside diameter of the drum just touch the drum enough to distort the drum locking the brake. Since the steel center of the drum is flexible there is no harm done and it springs right back. PHEW! I had planned on changing the Safety Rim Wheels to a wider rim anyway but this has to be acknowledged for those interested in doing this modification. Of course a little work with a grinder could knock the corner off the dips to provide clearance. Which is what I will have to do to get my car off the jack stands while I prepare a set of wheels. The Torrington NB-15-OH (Chrysler P/N 681378) needle bearings as I said before are no longer made. The ones I got were sealed in the original rust preventative paper and grease, but they were stuck. An hour with PB Blaster and a box cutter got them to wiggle a little but not move. Two hours in an ultra sonic cleaner in Diesel Fuel broke them loose. If they had been installed stuck they would have stayed stuck forever. Now I am hopeful. On another topic, I am interested in your Police car. My Grandmother had a 1951 Ford Police car that was built for the Pasadena PD but remained unsold. This thing had enough torque it went through gearboxes pretty quickly which is why she got a new Ford in 1955. However it would out run the new CHP Oldsmobile 88 overhead valve V8s for top speed by a wide margin. People give their cars names and her's was always "The Police Car." Fun to know what Plymouth did for the Police Package! Police cars after their service (around 100,000 miles) usually become Taxi cabs so there's a lot of heavy duty stuff in them.

I am sorry for the confusion, my training did not come from the Mopar parts book. For clarity what my Plymouth manual calls a “Knuckle” would be called a “Steering Knuckle” or a spindle elsewhere. Which seems more descriptive to me. The part I called an “Up-right” is indeed called a “Support” in the Plymouth manual. Again being the only vertical suspension member, “Up-right” seems more descriptive than “Support”. If you said “Support” to me without knowing you were referring to a Plymouth front suspension part I would think you were talking about some kind of bracket. Since they made the car they can call them whatever they wish. I will be more careful to use the Plymouth nomenclature in the future rather than generic terms.

Well I can tell you with 100% certainty that you will need the spindles. The anchor points for the brake shoes are a part of the spindles. When they increased the size of the shoes it required a change to the spindles. Therefore there are three different spindles. All will fit the uprights on the cars however.