Advice information help

[Don Jordan]

I wrote in a very long post and somehow I was logged off and it didn't post. So I will make this quick: I just took my car in to be painted (and cleaned up) quote: $20 to $30,000. Does this sound excessive? He's talking about first sand blasting the whole car. I have more questions but I'll be quick.

What is the opinion about wood grain? Worth it or is it just an ooo - aaah affect?

I need to find rubber - does Steele do MoPar or just GM? How about JC Whitney? The guy said if I got a lot of the little things myself it would hold the cost down. I'm sorry - one more question: Is the frame on the wind wing supposed to be chrome or painted?

So many questions - I'm sure there will be more later. I figure if I'm going to do it might as well do it right.

Thanks everyone.

[oldmopar]

Hope thats a typo 20-$30,000 for paint?

[NatesSedan]

Hope thats a typo 20-$30,000 for paint?

Yeah it should really be $98 ( DIY roll-on) - $30,000. There was an amazing $30,000 paint job on a 41 Willy's on Ebay awhile back. It will look great in the back of someones trailer when it sells.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BADDEST-41-WILLYS-STREET-ROD-EVER-30K-CUSTOM-PAINT_W0QQitemZ230170951934QQihZ013QQcategoryZ6161QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[Norm's Coupe]

From the looks of the post, it sounds like he's having the car restored by the shop. Assuming that's correct for all body and interior work, plus parts you would come close to that figure to have all that done by a shop. Think David Maxwell said his car ran about that much for the full restoration.

[Normspeed]

Tell us more Don. You have a 48 Plymouth? Are they dealing with rust, panel alignment, saggy doors and stuff, or just freshening up an older resto?

[claybill]

oooooh. just go out and buy one done for under 20k.

i have one near perfect and couldnt imagine it over 20k.. and it has everything. hmmmmmmor for 20 grand it would be a tempting sale!!

claybill

i am going with the typo !

[Don Jordan]

I have a 48 4 door. I'd send pictures but I don't know how. The body is straight. It has some dents - no rust. This guy was very thorough as he walked around the car. He was talking about first taking everything out of the car and having the car completely sand blasted ($1600) Then he opened and closed each door saying the door mechanisms needed to be replaced. All the body work. All the rubber and channels in the doors. Now I'm starting to feel foolish. I didn't really want an "Earl Shibe" $200 one day paint job. I saw some of the stuff he'd done. A 55 Chevy looked like it rolled off the showroom floor. All I really want is a daily driver but I want it to look nice. I posted the other day to see if anyone could recommend someone but nothing was close by.

I know it's a lot of money and I don't want to be taken advantage of - but I've seen pictures of cars on this forum and that's what I want. I tried to paint it myself but it's a lot harder than it looks and is a lot more time consuming than I figured. That's what the guy told me - older cars = more time spent.

I don't know what to do. If I put $20,000 in it now and use it for 10 years maybe I could sell it for $20,000 - all things being equal. It's not the same as stocks and bonds but there is a cost for the pleasure of just having it.

somehow this isn't as funny as I thought.

come on guys - be gentle

Don

[Don Jordan]

I'm hoping some of you will understand this - the reason I don't just go buy one already restored is because I bought this one as a mess and have done a lot of work on it - it was a project, hobby that I enjoyed. But then I got to the point where I did not have the knowledge or skill to complete the task.

I have a 1969 Triumph I bought when I got back from Viet Nam. I have had it for over 35 years. I just spent $10,000 for a frame off, powder coated restoration. Now it looks so nice I'm afraid to ride it.

I have a picture but again I don't know how to post it.

It's not easy going through life making stupid decisions. You guys that know how to do it yourself are lucky - have some sympathy for us klutzes.

d-

[Normspeed]

Wish I had good paint and body skills too. My car is a 20 footer, but some day I will either attempt the bodywoork or pay a shop. Don, Darin on this forum (Its Heaven in a 47) recently had his P15 done at a Maaco in this area. Not that far from you really. His came out real nice. I'm sure it cost way less that the estimate you got, but probably did not include as much work as your shop is contemplating. Maybe Darin will chime in about his experience. Here's his car.

[Guest rockabillybassman]

First off.... I dont believe that owning an old car should be considered an investment or a way to make money. You own an old car because you love old cars. Period. End of story. People who buy old cars to turn a buck disgust me. I'm sorry, I'm not inferring you are doing that, just something I had to get off my chest.

That figure is probably pretty conservative. That's why we work on our own cars. I set a self imposed budget of $10K including purchase price. To achieve that I taught myself to do panelwork (rust repair), to paint (it came out damn good, I miust say), to rewire completely, to do rings, bearings, valves etc, and am currently starting on the interior. A lot of work (over 2 years), but I now have a compressor, a welder, and an industrial sewing machine, and the confidence to do another project. Oh yeah, I taught myself to pinstripe too.

I realise that not everyone has the desire or the time to do all that stuff, but my point is that is why a pro is gonna charge you AT LEAST $30K. It takes a LOT of time.

BTW: dont let anyone with a sandblaster within a mile of your car, they'll ruin it. Media blasting or soda blasting or the like is OK, but sand is gonna warp your big panels. Here's an idea...... buy a cheap 4" angle grinder and a six pack of 3M stripping wheels and take it back to bare metal yourself. Be judicious so you dont heat up the metal (in other words... keep moving) and you've just saved $1500! It'll make a mess, and it'll take a day or so, but $1500 is $1500, right?

Also, things like door latches, rubber stripping and every other part you'll likely need.....

www.oldmoparts.com

www.rockauto.com

www.kanter.com

www.vintagepowerwagons.com

www.mitchellmotorparts.com

Hope this helps. Good luck with it.

[Plymouthy Adams]

30,000.00 this is not excessive to someone with unlimited funds..but for the average joe with the average car...anything in excess of 3000 is indeed excess...even most convertibles in excellent shape don't carry a resale this high..

[Rodney Bullock]

If you want this car to be a project, 30,000 is unheard of, a project is something you work on yourself, when you hit a road block you farm out somethings then you get back to work. Unless this guy is rebuilding your motor, redoing all interior, if there is no rust why is he sandblasting? I see new brakes, frame painting tires, rims I mean everything, you should not even be looking for rubber.What fun would it be if all that was done for you. These old cars are good therapy if you like working with your hands. It's up to you. We have a place over here called white post they do total resto's I did a tour of the place acouple of years ago, now that's restoration to a high dergree:)

[Don Jordan]

I, too, agree the amount is excessive - so what do I do with an old car that looks like it's been sitting for 25 years - which it has. The interior is shot (full of mice droppings). The paint is gone. Some dings. But all in all it will clean up.

I don't have lots of money - but I don't have any kids and my house is almost paid for. The longer I wait the closer to death I get. I can't take the car or the money with me. I figure if I don't do it I will always regret it.

I don't want a cheap paint job that will wear off in a few years. This guy is going to do all the stuff I can't do. He's going to take out the windows and replace the window channel, replace the fenderwelt (which I could do) but he's also taking all the dents out not just filling them with lead. And a super paint job.

A lot of you guys are very talented - one guy wrote how he "taught himself" how to do everything. I admire that - but not every one has those capabilities. You know, to put things in perspective, I teach school in a juvenile lock down detention camp for gang banging morons. I bet some of the guys that can put in a head liner wouldn't last 20 minutes with a 16 year old car jacker.

All my cars are paid for (mine and my wife's) - In reality I'm just buying a new car that I've always wanted. A couple years of car payments.

Most of you guys know the feeling - motoring down the freeway at a brisk 55 mph. People speed by doing 80 but still slow down enough to gawk and wave.

To Rockabilly - It is an investment. And I will own it till I die. And my wife will sell it and it will give her enough to make it through another month. I have a lot of things that are investments. I have an M1 Garand - every year they cost more to buy, and cost more than I paid for it, but since I will never sell it who cares.

I've had old cars since I was 15 (and got caught). I'm just no good with my hands. I always kidded myself that I would do all the work myself. Never happened.

I understand where some of you are coming from - I read your posts. You have a talent I envy.

I've said too much already.

d-

[PatS....]

"I don't want a cheap paint job that will wear off in a few years. This guy is going to do all the stuff I can't do. He's going to take out the windows and replace the window channel, replace the fenderwelt (which I could do) but he's also taking all the dents out not just filling them with lead. And a super paint job."

If you are getting all of that kind of work done, then it is quite a bit more than a "paint job" and likely worth the money. These shops charge labor by the hour and it can add up.

The other thing is, it gets DONE!!

I'm sneaking up on year FOUR on stands in the garage and if it weren't for the fact it's a special car to me AND the help and encouragement of this site, I would have lost interest long ago. Being off with an injury has sort of helped...can't wait to get back at it.

So, to my way of looking at it, it's your car and if all things considered, you are comfortable with this direction then by all means go for it and "Git 'er done!" The sooner the better, hourly rates are goin up all the time.

About the 16 year old carjackers...you are right, probably wouldn't last 30 seconds. I did however drive night shift taxi in the 70's when I was younger and at THAT time...well...I would have enjoyed an hour with one of those wannabe's

As for now, I'm old and I have alot of respect for guys like you. You have the opportunity to influence these kids to change. 99% won't, but if just ONE does, you have performed a miracle. And you may never know.

Some of those kids are living lives that would eat us alive. That's gotta change...and it starts with guys like you.

Thanks!!

[Tony_Urwin]

I think $30k could be considered reasonable if the restorer does excellent quality work. I don't know how much David Maxwell spent on his 100 point restoration (and I'll bet his wife doesn't either), but it was probably in that $30k ballpark.

Just be sure to get recommendations, check out other cars he has done, and make sure everything is spelled out in the contract.

Very few restored cars are wise investments, but they can be a joy to their owners. Good luck!

[oldmopar]

Is the car also being mechanically restored or has that already been done; from what I read the discussion is about body work. Is he also rebuilding the engine, trans, rear, suspension, brakes etc. If not better add another chunk of money to budget.

[david lazarus]

Hi Don.

Like you I did not have the skills to do the panel and paint thing on my car. Nor was I prepared to pay big bucks to have someone else do it.

So... I built up a friendship (proven to be good and longstanding) with the owner of a panel shop and took a few days off work here and there and my brother and I did the "grunt" work ourselves. We sanded, masked, sanded, stripped sanded and sanded. It ended up that I paid for materials, plus labour for panel beating and the materials and labour for painting....all the prep we did ouselves.

I learnt a lot along the way, got a great job at a great price, knew exactly what had and had not been done and bought a lot of morning tea shouts for the guys in the shop.

Long story short...perhaps there is a middle ground for you in this dilema as well.

[oldmopar]

I learnt a lot along the way, got a great job at a great price, knew exactly what had and had not been done and bought a lot of morning tea shouts for the guys in the shop.

Good story but I need to ask what are tea shouts is it like the American cup of coffee

Ed

[PatS....]

Kinda like here when you show up in the morning with a cup of coffee for everyone and a couple dozen donuts.

I think it's spelled

K-I-S-S-I-N-G U-P B-E-C-A-U-S-E

Y-O-U W-A-N-T S-O-M-E-T-H-I-N-G

[Plymouthy Adams]

promotion through assmosis...I loved that office word from the previous thread

[david lazarus]

You guys are on to it, when hanging around a panel shop asking lots of dumb questions (they are dumb when you know the answer !!) food goes down great with the boys.

The "morning tea shout" is a legacy from our English colonial past...old chap, eh what?

also for the record !!!

Panel beater = Panel shop

Boot = Trunk

Bonnet = Hood

Hood = Tough kid from wrong part of LA

Front guard = front fender

Might Kiwi-ise you guys yet !!

[Guest rockabillybassman]

I've seen David's car, and a mighty fine job it is too. Shows what can be done, there's always ways of saving a buck.

[blueskies]

I delivered my '50 to the painter like this:

He took off the doors, and diss-assembled the front clip that was already just sitting on the car for transport.

My car had very little or no rust in the body just a bit under the front fenders where they mounted to the firewall. They used a handheld blaster to remove this surface rust, and then sanded and preped the body for paint. I had one dent in the drivers door, and a couple of little ones in all four fenders, and a ding in the roof above the windshield.

I got the car back like this:

Total cash outlay for the body and paint... $2800.00. The grin on my face, priceless.

My paintjob is hardly perfect, and would never complete with something like David Maxwell's car. But I drive the wheels off my car, and I would have a nervous breakdown driving around a $30k painjob...

I don't think the prices you were quoted are unreasonable if you are not doing any of the labor yourself. Question you have to ask, is the car worth the money you are going to put into it. I have about $17k into my car, and I have done all the work myself but the paintwork, and the machine shop work to the block. And its probably worth about $7k on ebay.

But I'd probably do it again anyway .

Pete

[Don Jordan]

It's good to see what can be done. You have a georgeous car. The difference is you were able to do alot yourself and I'm going to pay someone. I was looking the other day at my neighbor's boat. He spent $30,000 for it and uses it only on week ends when the weather is nice. How can that be any different than putting the money in a car?

[50PlymouthSled]

You can do it the way I'm gonna do my 50. Sign up for an ROP body class at a local community college. I don't know for sure if they have them in your area, but learn a few things, and have the teacher assist you in painting the body. That's how I plan on doing mine.