Plymouthy Adams Posted January 18, 2016 Report Share Posted January 18, 2016 you are right, you have not read what I stated correctly...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrhoads Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) Plymouthy is right on this. And I just did this little venture on my 49 special deluxe. The bottom seal is fairly easy, The top one? a real pain in the rear. I mean real pain... I wondered if I would ever get the three screws back in but finally got it. If yours is a 49, standard replacement is rope. I believe they make a flanged style replacement, but I wont swear on it. I replaced it with what the book said replace it with. I figure it made it 60 + years on that rope seal. The only reason I replaced it is because I had the tranny and flywheel out. But I go back to what I said, Plymouthy is correct and usually always is! BTW if you want to replace the top one, the flywheel must be removed. Edited January 19, 2016 by jrhoads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 I'm not debating or saying Plymouthy is wrong, if my engine only came with a rope seal in the rear bearing cap with does it have the flanged style that I removed. I'm just trying to understand. Why it would have a rope seal when it has a flange seal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 Possibly someone swapped it out. They can be interchanged. It was a Fel-Pro BS 6300 what I put in mine. 1950 218. Originally had the rope seal - now has a flanged type seal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrhoads Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 I agree with Lloyd, someone probably swapped it. I guess it depends on who you talk too. I have had some say the flanged don't seal as well as the rope. I really cant say. I kind of wished I did know the answer to that, but like I said, the book said rope, so that is what went back in the old girl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 Possibly someone swapped it out. They can be interchanged. It was a Fel-Pro BS 6300 what I put in mine. 1950 218. Originally had the rope seal - now has a flanged type seal. Ok now I think we are getting some where. Fel Pro BS6300 shows an application for 49-52 Dodge Wayfarer, a 49 Dodge Wayfarer is what I have. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fel-Pro-BS6300-Rear-Main-Seal-Set-/301334902270?hash=item4628f5b5fe:g:H4AAAOSw-jhUKted&vxp=mtr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) I cant say which is best either, mine is running but have not put any miles on it as yet. Just went by what I read on this forum from some previous posts. BTW Branded, what are the engine numbers on the upper forward drivers side of your block? Edited January 19, 2016 by Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) Loyd Engine number is D30 193223 Fel Pro shows BS6300 application being for 49 Dodge Wayfarer but not on Plymouth until 1953 or 54 on some. My 49 Dodge repair manual shows the flange style. I'm guessing that Dodge change design before Plymouth Edited January 19, 2016 by Branded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) D30 shows a 1949 230 ci 23" head. Dont know anything about the years difference in types of seals or why, but remember manufacturers like Fel-Pro do come up with after market designs. So I dont think it is 100% reliable to go by Fel-Pro's application catalog. Edited January 19, 2016 by Lloyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 D30 shows a 1949 230 ci 23" head. Dont know anything about the years difference in types of seals or why, but remember manufacturers like Fel-Pro do come up with after market designs. So I dont think it is 100% reliable to go by Fel-Pro's application catalog. I feel it's fairly reliable when the Fel Pro BS6300 is identical to what I removed from my engine and the seal flange is stamped with what appears to be the OEM part number stamped onto the flange. I can imagine someone going thru the trouble to drill and tape the block and rear main bearing cap to accept the flange type seal. Like I posted earlier Fel Pro doesn't show the flange style being applicable to Plymouth until 1954. Not trying to turn this into a whizzing match just trying to clear things up for fellas down the road that run into this. It's obvious design changes where made at different time between Dodge and Plymouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 The seal #863214 is what I removed from my engine. I have a 1949 Dodge parts list book in front of me that shows #863214 as being retainer, oil seal assembly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) Edited January 19, 2016 by Branded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 either it will slip into the groove or it bolts onto the rear of the block...guess which one you have... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_shel_ny Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) ... Edited January 21, 2016 by shel_ny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ194950 Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) My 49 Plymouth parts book shows a rope type rear main seal while the 50 MOPAR parts book show the type seal pictured by Branded? Maybe the Dodges made the seal type change earlier?? Edited January 19, 2016 by DJ194950 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 there is the impregnated stock fabric (rope) and or the later neoprene seal that fits the two piece bolt on flange....you install in the later style into the main cap main cap..not on the block, there is no flange..no drilled and tapped holes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 there is the impregnated stock fabric (rope) and or the later neoprene seal that fits the two piece bolt on flange....you install in the later style into the main cap main cap..not on the block, there is no flange..no drilled and tapped holes You talking absolute ut Plymouth or Dodge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 either it will slip into the groove or it bolts onto the rear of the block...guess which one you have... The guess work is over, number on my seal is I the 1949 Dodge part book, Fel Pro shows the flange type as being for 49 Dodge. Now Plymouth is a different animal. Thanks for your help, it made me dig a little deeper to figure out what I needed but hey that's the fun of messing with this see old cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 My 49 Plymouth parts book shows a rope type rear main seal while the 50 MOPAR parts book show the type seal pictured by Branded? Maybe the Dodges made the seal type change earlier?? That's the conclusion I've come to, Dodge must have been the test mule Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 Plymouthy is right on this. And I just did this little venture on my 49 special deluxe. The bottom seal is fairly easy, The top one? a real pain in the rear. I mean real pain... I wondered if I would ever get the three screws back in but finally got it. If yours is a 49, standard replacement is rope. I believe they make a flanged style replacement, but I wont swear on it. I replaced it with what the book said replace it with. I figure it made it 60 + years on that rope seal. The only reason I replaced it is because I had the tranny and flywheel out. But I go back to what I said, Plymouthy is correct and usually always is! BTW if you want to replace the top one, the flywheel must be removed. jr Every time I think I've got this figured out I read more into it. Your saying that once you removed the flange type seal that is in 2 halves being upper and lower that is held on by 6 bolts, and that there is also rope seal behind the 6 bolt flange. Thanks again Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 quit reading, buy a bolt on flanged seal and let the big dog eat... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) quit reading, buy a bolt on flanged seal and let the big dog eat... Now wasn't that easy. Hahaha Edited January 19, 2016 by Branded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 Branded, on 18 Jan 2016 - 9:38 PM, said:That's the conclusion I've come to, Dodge must have been the test mule again..check your block number...that will date the engine...I have a 1950 Dodge block here that has the flanged seal aka pre 1953 style...again, you pictured the very flanged seal in the thread as the one removed...so you do not have a test mule...you have stock pre 53 flanged gasket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branded Posted January 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) This is starting to feel like the movie Ground Hog Day, lol. Your confusing me again with your terminology.your calling it a very flanged seal and a flanged gasket. My only question is the same as from the beginning. Is the flanged seal (as I'm calling it) the only rear main seal on my engine. I'm not at the shop to physically pull the rear bearing cap to see if there is a rear seal inside the cap. Dave Edited January 19, 2016 by Branded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plymouthy Adams Posted January 19, 2016 Report Share Posted January 19, 2016 (edited) just go to the store with your old seal you removed by unbolting the upper and lower flange halves...match and go....or you can tell them you have the test mule edition and see what they come up with or you can get the later 53 seal and return it when it will not insert in your rear main cap....your call....get some silly putty.... Edited January 19, 2016 by Plymouthy Adams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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