J.R. Posted June 4, 2013 Report Posted June 4, 2013 The victim is a chopped 50 Chrysler Windsor with a 251 and what I am pretty sure is a M6 trans. I am installing a EZ Wire 21 circuit kit (3rd kit I have used from them and they are great), I have always had cars that were already 12v and have never had to deal with 6v part mixed in with a 12v system so I just need to clarify some stuff. I am ordering 3 voltage reducers from speedway, one for the fuel gauge, one for the wiper motor and one for the transmission. Should all 3 be the same ones or should the one for the fuel gauge be a different style? These were what I was looking at... http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Electric-12-Volt-to-6-Volt-Reducer-for-Motors,15824.html I was thinking about the Runtz style but have read too many stories about them failing. The reducer for the transmission, where should it be wired in at? That leads me to my main question.....I have seen the M6 wire diagram but I just want to make sure that it is the same one for my car... Here are some pics of the trans electrics as they were hooked up (or not) when I got the car and drove it home. I thought it was a regular 3 speed and it drove great down the freeway at 65 mph. 1st gear away and up, 2nd gear away and down, and for 3rd gear I took it out of 2nd with the clutch in, listened for the "click" then dropped it back into "2nd" (away and down) and I rolled it all the way home like that and had no issues driving it like an automatic. None of the wires were hooked up going to the coil or ball and ball carb nor would I want to hook them up in their condition! I am going to rewire everything so it functions like it should safely I just need to know what wires go to what connectors on the carb and coil, there is currently no color coating on any of the wires that are left. I am no rookie at working on old cars, this is just the first time I have worked on one of these transmissions with 6v and 12v mixed. Thanks for any help... Quote
J.R. Posted June 4, 2013 Author Report Posted June 4, 2013 Also, does anyone have the year make and model or part number of a 12v starter that will work on a 1950 251? I have read that a mid 50's Plymouth starter will work? I know I can get away with using the 6v starter but I would rather swap it out if I can, this car will be a daily driver once done. Quote
Roger the Dodger Posted June 5, 2013 Report Posted June 5, 2013 J.R. I went 12 volts on my 52 Dodge. I used that Heavy duty finned resistor from Speedway on my 6v wiper motor and a Runz resistor on the fuel gauge. I left the 6v starter motor in and changed the solenoid to a 12v. And I also swapped out the Amp meter for a Voltage gauge I had laying around. It was done about 6 months ago and no worries yet. Roger. Quote
J.R. Posted June 5, 2013 Author Report Posted June 5, 2013 Would the finned reducer also work for the transmission? Thry are rated at 10amps. Quote
J.R. Posted June 5, 2013 Author Report Posted June 5, 2013 http://m.napaonline.com/Tablet/parts/PartDetails.aspx?Id=RSE2441084_0158737809 Found this starter for a 56 plymouth on napas site... Quote
J.R. Posted June 6, 2013 Author Report Posted June 6, 2013 So tonight I went through the burned up rats nest of transmission wires and got that all figured out for when I make up a new mini harness to replace them. The only thing I really need to know is after I swap over to the 12v coil (AC Delco PN U515) Do I run the voltage reducer in line from the ignition side of the coil (in between the coil and the circuit breaker) before it goes into the solenoid and/or do I need to run another voltage reducer off the dist. side of the coil on its way to the Interrupter switch? If anyone is interested I did run across this article but they don't mention anything about the transmission..... http://www.rodandcustommagazine.com/techarticles/135_0310_how_to_rewire_1951_plymouth/ Quote
Don Coatney Posted June 6, 2013 Report Posted June 6, 2013 http://m.napaonline.com/Tablet/parts/PartDetails.aspx?Id=RSE2441084_0158737809 Found this starter for a 56 plymouth on napas site... The picture of the NAPA starter does not look right. Below is what a 56 Plymouth starter looks like. Quote
J.R. Posted June 6, 2013 Author Report Posted June 6, 2013 (edited) Yeah, I thought it looked wrong too after double checking it. I actually saved that pic you posted last nite so I could match it up. There is a place by my house that deals in N.O.S. parts and he probably has a shelf full of new starters. Old Car Parts NW, I will check tomorrow, see how many he has, whatche wants for them and post the info this weekend. Edited June 6, 2013 by J.R. Quote
larryconnors Posted June 6, 2013 Report Posted June 6, 2013 I saw a 36 Plymouth coupe at a local car show with an interesting solution to the 6 volt 12 volt question.He put on a bigger belt and ran a 12 volt alternator and the original 6 volt generator both. I don't know what he ran off of each except that his sound system is 12 volt. Quote
Don Coatney Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 I saw a 36 Plymouth coupe at a local car show with an interesting solution to the 6 volt 12 volt question.He put on a bigger belt and ran a 12 volt alternator and the original 6 volt generator both. I don't know what he ran off of each except that his sound system is 12 volt. like this? Quote
Don Coatney Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 It is possible to run a 6 volt positive ground and a 12 volt negative ground system with both using the same chassie as a ground. One + and the other -. Quote
ptwothree Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 I'd replace that ratty wiring before you plug a battery into it. Looks like a fire waiting to happen. Mine is in the same condition and it's getting replace now. 1 Quote
J.R. Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Posted June 7, 2013 (edited) I'd replace that ratty wiring before you plug a battery into it. Looks like a fire waiting to happen. Mine is in the same condition and it's getting replace The trans wires are the only thing I haven't removed yet. I am waiting to find out about the voltage reducer placement and coil hook ups before I start building a new trans harness and making a new diagram for it. I have already mounted the EZ Wire harness and ran the wires but haven't hooked anything up or wrapped the new harness yet. i am picking up a N.O.S. 12v generator and other parts to finish the swap this weekend. Edited June 7, 2013 by J.R. Quote
J.R. Posted June 7, 2013 Author Report Posted June 7, 2013 So according to this do I just put one of the 12v to 6v reducers in line on the green wire between the coil and the circuit breaker/resistor? The black wire is just to signal that the dist is firing and won't need a reducer as well, right? Quote
Robert Horne Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 (edited) http://m.napaonline.com/Tablet/parts/PartDetails.aspx?Id=RSE2441084_0158737809 Found this starter for a 56 plymouth on napas site... The listing states that starter is for a 383 V8. Too bad, at $64 would be a great buy for our flatheads. I bought two 1956 Dodge starters on ebay years ago. One in my 38 Coupe now, and the other is for my 56 Dodge engine.... Edited June 7, 2013 by Robert Horne Quote
Robert Horne Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 http://www.ebay.com/itm/140986697950?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_1318wt_884 12 to 6 volt reducer, voltage regulator.... Found this on the ebay today... Quote
garbagestate 44 Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 The whole 12 volt conversion question as it pertains to the m5/m6 transmission has been discussed at length on several sites and everybody has a different opinion. I met a guy from the Midwest who did the conversion on a 49 Saratoga with an m6 and it was no problem. He said the duty cycle time for the kick down switch is short enough that it can tolerate the higher voltage. Some people say that parts of it are polarity sensitive and won't work correctly if the system is changed to negative ground. I have a 48 Windsor with an m5. I plan to use a 56 dodge starter (bendix type) with a ford type solenoid switch connected to a 12 volt battery hidden in the trunk. That's going to turn the starter only and won't be connected up to any kind of charging circuit. Everything else will run off 6 volts which should keep the transmission happy. I'll put a voltage reduced on the sisson choke as it will be the only other thing working off the 12 volt battery. I'll just recharge the 12 volt once in a while. I'll post later whether this scheme actually works when I do it later this summer. Quote
garbagestate 44 Posted June 7, 2013 Report Posted June 7, 2013 The whole 12 volt conversion question as it pertains to the m5/m6 transmission has been discussed at length on several sites and everybody has a different opinion. I met a guy from the Midwest who did the conversion on a 49 Saratoga with an m6 and it was no problem. He said the duty cycle time for the kick down switch is short enough that it can tolerate the higher voltage. Some people say that parts of it are polarity sensitive and won't work correctly if the system is changed to negative ground. I have a 48 Windsor with an m5. I plan to use a 56 dodge starter (bendix type) with a ford type solenoid switch connected to a 12 volt battery hidden in the trunk. That's going to turn the starter only and won't be connected up to any kind of charging circuit. Everything else will run off 6 volts which should keep the transmission happy. I'll put a voltage reduced on the sisson choke as it will be the only other thing working off the 12 volt battery. I'll just recharge the 12 volt once in a while. I'll post later whether this scheme actually works when I do it later this summer. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.