Undercoating?

[Abeblinkin]

There is a tar like coating under my car (50 dodge wayfarer) and in the trunk floor. I was wondering if its original to the car or if someone added it later? It has a rough texture and in some places it is peeling off. Would you guys recommend scraping off the stuff thats already coming off and recoating those spots with something? and what? Thanks

[P-12 Tommy]

Maybe Por15 rust preventer?

Tom

[smallblockjunkie]

on my 48 pickup I used spray on bed liner works great and can be painted with in 72 hours after sprayed on

[Abeblinkin]

Yeah thats the stuff. Seems like it may be on the floor as well I scraped some up and it looks like it was doing a fairly good job keeping the rust off. I didn't know you could still buy it. I was thinking I might use the por 15 on the floor and in the trunk once I get it cleaned out and just remove as much as I can under the car and re-apply it.

[dezeldoc]

Whatever you do after you get it off, prep it and paint it before you put anything else down, undercoat, bedliner or Dynamat. if you do not paint it the moisture will get under it and rust it. me i would not touch asphalt under coat for nothing, use rubberized undercoat. if you go to a auto paint store you can get it thete along with a nice little gun to apply it.

[adam_knox]

I don't know if this will help, but here's my floors when I did it. Scrapped off the coating with a putty knife, then used a battalion of chemical strippers, sand paper, wire wheels, and elbow grease to get the red primer off. Then used phosphoric acid (Metal Etch) to prep the metal. Then Por-15. I used caulking to fill in the gaps where the old filler was. Then bought several cans of rubberized coating. Don't have a picture of that. Skimped out on not putting an insulation lining underneath the carpet. Gets a lil' warm by the feet, but late at night its kinda nice! I'd probably use it if I were to rip up the carpeting again, might deaden the sound a bit more. Good luck!

[dezeldoc]

Norm, rubberized has no asphalt in it, nothing they use today on cars has it either. it is nasty, stinky, messy and will never really dry. just my .02

[dezeldoc]

Norm, used to work at a rock plant and we also had a asphalt plant on site. i'm talkin about the henrys type stuff.

[dezeldoc]

I am gonna have to look and see what the msds says on it, i don't remember any asphalt in it but maybe.

[Bingster]

Eastwood sells undercoating in spray cans and bulk along with the gun applicator. Google them for their web site.

[Tom Skinner]

Like DezelDoc said Paint it and Prep it first, or even last, here is why.

Someone that owns the car down the road when we are gone will appreciate

your efforts also. Its murder cleaning up behind undercoating.

A gimmick to hide rust used in the 70's on alot of our old cars.

My first 1948 Chrysler Royal that I bought in 1974 with 32,000 original miles had nothing but the Paint Color under the Body and High Gloss Black Paint

on the Frame and Chassis.

The 1948 Chrysler I bought 3 years ago with 52,000 original miles has the same.

So I doubt very highly dealerships were spraying undercoating all over the bottom of cars back in the 1940's. That practice came later on.

To hide rust and problems. Get under there and see what taking it off entails like I have. It is no cake walk. Its more like a walk through hell wearing a winter coat.

Don't be fooled by a quick pretty it up because ultimately you'll wreck the value of your own car. An eye for quality will not except it. Cean it up and Paint it, that is true restoration work. Just my Opinion - please don't get pissed off and vent do your home work true valueable restored cars are not undercoated.

[dezeldoc]

My 50 P-20 had undercoat from the dealer on it, all over it! in the late 70's i worked at a dealer and that was part of my job undercoating! i guarantee none of mine were going to rust out, leave no spot untouched was my motto!

[Abeblinkin]

Lots of good stuff here, read every post twice and looked at all the sites you guys recommended. I've got under the car and tried removing some of the undercoating. In some places it comes off very easy and reveals a painted underbody and in other spots its kinda bulletproof. I would prefer to remove it all but I don't have the room to remove the body and I think doing it from under the car on stands would be really tedious task. The stuff in the trunk and on the floor is more pliable and removed easily with a putty knife like mentioned. I'll try and take a pic of the under body stuff and see what you guys think give me a few minutes. Thanks for all the help

[55 Fargo]

Like DezelDoc said Paint it and Prep it first, or even last, here is why.

Someone that owns the car down the road when we are gone will appreciate

your efforts also. Its murder cleaning up behind undercoating.

A gimmick to hide rust used in the 70's on alot of our old cars.

My first 1948 Chrysler Royal that I bought in 1974 with 32,000 original miles had nothing but the Paint Color under the Body and High Gloss Black Paint

on the Frame and Chassis.

The 1948 Chrysler I bought 3 years ago with 52,000 original miles has the same.

So I doubt very highly dealerships were spraying undercoating all over the bottom of cars back in the 1940's. That practice came later on.

To hide rust and problems. Get under there and see what taking it off entails like I have. It is no cake walk. Its more like a walk through hell wearing a winter coat.

Don't be fooled by a quick pretty it up because ultimately you'll wreck the value of your own car. An eye for quality will not except it. Cean it up and Paint it, that is true restoration work. Just my Opinion - please don't get pissed off and vent do your home work true valueable restored cars are not undercoated.

Tom,

I agree good prep work makes a big difference.

I do however have a 47 Chrysler parts car, it appears to be under coated back in the day, maybe when fairly new, where ever you peel off the undercoating the paint is shiny new looking compared to the rest.

I do know some guy who use roofing asphalt/tar, after the floors and underside are cleaned up and primered, they have reported no problems.

Lets face these cars will not be driven through snow,salt, slush, and even good old clean rain is not an everyday event for our cars.

I also know a few old guys with 47 and 48 Chryslers, cars look great nice paint chrome, interiors, engines, but they never even painted under there cars, still surface rust and patina under there. One guys says it like this, my car, is only summer driven, they have the cars for years, there not rusting out, because they drive only in summer weather,and are stored in clean dry garages.....Fred

[Abeblinkin]

Here is a pic of the trunk as I started to scrape off some of the looser stuff and a pic of under the car in a spot where I simply pulled off a piece with my fingers to find, like Rockwood said, a perfectly good painted surface. I threw in a pic of my garage Sunday morning before I got back to work on my other project. One thing I can say is I have a new found respect for you car guys there is a lot more ground to cover than on a bike. I think I have a good idea of what to do in the trunk/floor but I may just have to patch the areas under the car with a similar asphalt material until I can remove the body someday and paint the frame/underside like I know I should. The coating is also on the backside of the fenders and inner fenders which I will definitely remove when they come off for repair and new fender welts I think I will use por 15 in those areas. I see on the por15 site they apply it directly over a rusted battery tray after they treat it with the solvent and degreaser, am I fool to believe that works?

[dezeldoc]

Dang norm!

[1955 plymouth]

I coated the trunk space of my '55 Belvedere with some undercoating spray type from an aerosol csn. I first used a wire wheel with the 4" grinder to strip off all the flakes of rust, then I cleaned the entire surface with a paint thinner, I then used a Rustoleum primer to give the first coating, then a standard primer, finally followed by a undercoating mateial. I did use some of the roofing type tar in some of the bolt locations and factory seam locations to help restore the original tar seam sealers. Hope the pics come across well enough to see the stages.

This was how I did my "rookie repair" I must say it is alot better than the original condition I was givin when I purchased the car as the pics show. I do plan to do the underside of the car soon. Probably this winter. I will use some Rustmort on the underside surface rust prior to coating with the tar. I will also use the thicker brush type tar where I car reach without much dissasembly.

Edited July 16, 2009 by 1955 plymouth

[Abeblinkin]

Hmmm, Rustmort, looks like thats a good option to get the stuff you can't reach, to at least neutralize the rust. Read some stuff about it and people seem to like it, everything but the smell? Thanks for the pics 55 Plymouth I would be happy with that result.

I agree with Norm, in the respect that one way or another when I'm gone at least something was done to preserve it for the next guy and if he wants to completely restore the car to a collector valued condition that much more of the car will be there for them to have that option. I'm a novice at best and I have to rely on my limited abilities, space, time and money. my intentions ,at best, are to tend to the very necessary, drive and keep one on the road. That being said i would love to have a perfectly painted restored chassis but I just got this car and I basically bought it not for an investment but because I needed a car for transportation, couldn't find anything else i liked and I don't mind being stuck anywhere because of my shade tree mechanics.

I'm gonna do the underbody a little at a time, back to front, most of you guys know more about undercoating, rust prevention/conversion, coating and such then I know about these old car all together. Definitely a lot of options for me to work with, and much appreciated advice

[dezeldoc]

You guys know primer will not hold out moisture, you need a top coat that is non porous, and primer is not it, not even rustolum.

[55 Fargo]

Isn't a quality rubberized undercoating a Topcoat of sorts, will this not seal, or not?

I also would not leave straight primer as a coating, not even epoxy primer, but would either topcoat or undercoat, then possibly topcoat....

[dezeldoc]

The rubberized should seal, but i would always put down some paint before the undercoat.

[Abeblinkin]

So if I por 15 before undercoat thats solid right?