Piston questions again...

[dontknowitall]

Hi folk

I have some trouble locating pistons for my T173 engine, 218ci

I have measured up the following:

Current piston in the block is 3.375 which according Powerwagon folk is an odd size?

When I ordered .040 + pistons, was written on the box.. but when opened I found + .100, way to big for the block!

Rung the guy back and told him just to send me a set of .040 +, should be simple hey?

Pistons I am looking for ideally should be:

ok to use is piston size 3.395 or + .020 over

we really want piston size 3.415 or + .040 over

measurment of the block face = excactly 25. 5/8" inch

this is measured from end to end on the face (not the head just the face of the block)

The Piston / Bore = 3. 3/8" inch

Conrod lenght = 8" inch

measured from centre of the pin (top of piston) to centre of where the bearing is held."

Beside getting a wee bit frustrated.. is there anyone out there that can help me either with new pistons for this or some advice as how to go further from here..

Cheers from a very Hot and muggy Australia!

Edited February 11, 2010 by dontknowitall
wrong measurment

[Merle Coggins]

Your 218 is most likely a 25" block? As as such your pistons are likely to be different. Isn't the standard bore of a 23" 218CID engine 3.25"? The good folks at Vintage Power Wagons probably don't deal with the 25" engine much since most Power Wagons used the 23" engine.

You might want to try Terrell or Egge. (sorry I don't have any links for you)

Merle

[dontknowitall]

Finaly some answers although still confusing to me.

Vintage Power Wagons, Inc. tells me the T173 engine I have, is a pre war block, because the bore is 3. 3/8" inch!

A 1939-1940 block..in a 1950 Fargo ute??

Does that mean the info found here:

http://www.t137.com/registry/help/ot...herengines.php

is wrong?

Registry indentifies my engine as a

T173 218ci Dodge Truck Canada DE-1, DF-1, Fargo FM-1, FN-1 1949-1950

whats next?

Your 218 is most likely a 25" block? As as such your pistons are likely to be different. Isn't the standard bore of a 23" 218CID engine 3.25"? The good folks at Vintage Power Wagons probably don't deal with the 25" engine much since most Power Wagons used the 23" engine.

You might want to try Terrell or Egge. (sorry I don't have any links for you)

Merle

[Tony WestOZ]

I think I mentioned this before, but if its not a 230 small block or a 251 long block VPW don`t have a clue.

Your engine is definatly 1949-50, 218cu" engine.

I think the 39-40 they are on about is a 201 but I need to check.

I have some numbers I crunched years ago that that gave me all the variations on the big blocks and their over bore sizes. I`ll try and find it and do some comparisons to te sizes you have.

Edited February 12, 2010 by Tony WestOZ

[Tony WestOZ]

Gees it took awhile for the penny to drop.

+100 thou on a 3 3/8" bore approx = 40 thou over on a 3 7/16" (251) bore.

Without getting the bore sonicly tested I think the pistons you have will be to large.

Is it possible to measure the piston pin height on the 218 pistons. I think it should be the same as the 251 pistons they sent you but it would be good to check.

If the piston pin height is the same on the pistons you have then a standard 3 7/16", 251 (approx = +60 on a 3 3/8" bore) pistons will work.

[dontknowitall]

Hey, Tony

here are the measurments again:

measurment of the lenght of block face = excactly 25. 5/8" inch

this is measured from end to end on the face (not the head just the face of the block)

The Piston / Bore = 3. 3/8" inch

Conrod lenght = 8" inch

measured from centre of the pin (top of piston) to centre of where the bearing is held."

VPH said they have to modifying pistons to make them fit...

Gees it took awhile for the penny to drop.

+100 thou on a 3 3/8" bore approx = 40 thou over on a 3 7/16" (251) bore.

Without getting the bore sonicly tested I think the pistons you have will be to large.

Is it possible to measure the piston pin height on the 218 pistons. I think it should be the same as the 251 pistons they sent you but it would be good to check.

If the piston pin height is the same on the pistons you have then a standard 3 7/16", 251 (approx = +60 on a 3 3/8" bore) pistons will work.

[dontknowitall]

see latest email from steve

Hi Tony,

Ryan, we already exhausted that avenue and the standard 251 pistons are ..022 inches larger than the 3-3/8" +.040 bore that you need. This means if you could find 251 standard pistons you will still have to bore your cylinders another .022 inches. Since the standard 251 pistons are harder to find than the ones we have being machined it doesn't make sense to go that way.

Steve

Hi Steve

I know, found that out in the mean time, and if in trouble locating any suitable pistons, some folk suggested standard 251 pistons can be used as .040+ for the 218 engine.

regards

   Cheers

Ryan v Mastrigt

0413998759

-------Original Message-------

From: Steve

Date: 16/02/2010 3:07:49 AM

To: mastrigt

Subject: Re: re-ordering the right pistons Fargo 1950 truck

Ryan, we would not have information for Canadian built engines.

Steve

Steve,

Many folk have indentified this engine as The Canadian long block 218.

It has stock bore of 3.375 according to the Allpar website for Canadian engines..

and it only stated the cubes went from 201 to 234 based on stroke used.

Originally Posted by Bob_Koch

If the block is stamped as T137 then I would tend to believe it's a 49-50 engine.

This may help. It's from a Canadian export serials guide I just posted on DPETCA:

http://dodgepilothouseclub.org/know/know.htm

thanks,

I will wait until you contact me again

Hey, Tony

here are the measurments again:

measurment of the lenght of block face = excactly 25. 5/8" inch

this is measured from end to end on the face (not the head just the face of the block)

The Piston / Bore = 3. 3/8" inch

Conrod lenght = 8" inch

measured from centre of the pin (top of piston) to centre of where the bearing is held."

VPH said they have to modifying pistons to make them fit...

[Tony WestOZ]

Hi Ryan.

Was great to talk to you last night, its good to be able to at least put a voice to what is on the forum.

Latter this year I hope to head over that way and see my parents how only live about 100 k`s (60 miles) from you.

With Vintage Power Wagon I was a bit harsh with some earlier statments about them. Though they have had a problems with the pistons they have certianly done the right thing by you regarding the other parts they have supplied.

With the NAPA link you PM`d me it did not work properly but I have been to their site before. You are right it is a shame the do not post to Australia, alot of the stuff we nead is straight of the shelf for the US blokes.

I would be interested to know what pistons they are machining down for you if its not 251 ones I thought they would use. I hope it all works out in the end.

Back to our coversation last night,

here is a pic of my van. Since this pic was taken the nose is off and the engine and gearbox are out so I can check the engine. Then I will mount the engine and box in a frame so I can test run it while I finish off the body painting.

Here is the Deluxe ute I have. What ever I do it will be a few years before anything happens. Got a couple of mopar V8`S sitting around so one of those will end up going in.

[dontknowitall]

like this....

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1950-DODGE-B-2-B-B2-B-B2B-WOODIE-STATION-WAGON-Article_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem5639b353ddQQitemZ370335241181QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Hi Ryan.

Was great to talk to you last night, its good to be able to at least put a voice to what is on the forum.

Latter this year I hope to head over that way and see my parents how only live about 100 k`s (60 miles) from you.

With Vintage Power Wagon I was a bit harsh with some earlier statments about them. Though they have had a problems with the pistons they have certianly done the right thing by you regarding the other parts they have supplied.

With the NAPA link you PM`d me it did not work properly but I have been to their site before. You are right it is a shame the do not post to Australia, alot of the stuff we nead is straight of the shelf for the US blokes.

I would be interested to know what pistons they are machining down for you if its not 251 ones I thought they would use. I hope it all works out in the end.

Back to our coversation last night,

here is a pic of my van. Since this pic was taken the nose is off and the engine and gearbox are out so I can check the engine. Then I will mount the engine and box in a frame so I can test run it while I finish off the body painting.

Here is the Deluxe ute I have. What ever I do it will be a few years before anything happens. Got a couple of mopar V8`S sitting around so one of those will end up going in.