SuperGas61

Hey, Ivan...just saw your post...thanks for this! The videos are definitely interesting, and I may just give it a shot before bringing it to the body doctor...I'll keep the board posted...thanks again!

Yeah, I'm sure that's true...the paintless guy around here did finally get back to me, but I had already taken it over to a local body shop that came very highly recommended...the guy there said he thought he could get the fender back in shape in about a week, but I haven't gotten an estimate, and the car might actually have to go into storage before that happens..if that's the case, it'll happen in the spring...

Oh, man...that's scary...and yes, this has definitely been a lesson for me...but that's interesting about the Rhino Ramps, and I'm sure you're right--that's exactly what must have happened...crazily enough, that left Rhino Ramp was crumpled behind the left tire, but it actually worked itself back into its normal shape pretty quickly once I got it out...I'm still going to trash it, though...

That's probably why the paintless guy I called hasn't gotten back to me... ?? The creases don't actually seem to be too severe, but I guess time will tell...I'm just really glad and impressed that the damage appears to be limited to the fender. I can't imagine that at least some of these dents won't come out one way or the other, but I'll be keeping my eye out for a replacement fender, which of course appear to be rarer than hen's teeth...there's actually a RH front fender available online right now, but no lefties...

Hey, thanks for everyone's replies...I do feel better! Especially after seeing Dan's VW... ? I think the paint-less dent repair approach is a good one, and I have a call into one up here. I also purchased some touch-up paint in the original New Brunswick blue, so if I can get the dents out, I can at least cover any scratches with something resembling the original. I'll keep everyone posted. In any case, thanks once again for everyone's support...it definitely helps turn this self-inflicted nightmare into just another car-building obstacle... ??

Ah, where to begin... Yesterday started out quietly enough. Got my 3-point retractable seat belts from Wesco the other day, so I started laying everything out so I could see where I'd have to drill anchor holes, etc. Then I changed the oil, and while the car was up on the jackstands, I took the opportunity to take the front left wheel off, so I could measure the back of the wheel for fitment with the Andy Bernbaum disc-brake conversion kit, which I'm thinking about getting. Now, before I go any further, it would probably be helpful to go back about a half an hour. My original plan for the oil change was to put the car up on Rhino Ramps, which I use all the time and have never had any problems with...in fact, my Ram 1500 was up on them earlier in the week. This time, just as I got the wheels up on top of the ramps, I felt the left ramp sort of collapse, and I got out to find the right front wheel correctly up on the right ramp but the left front wheel almost back down on the ground, with the ramp crunched behind it, between the tire and the door. I guess I figured I had overdriven the left ramp, although I wasn't sure how that was possible if the right wheel was up on its ramp properly. But yeah, I guess it could happen. In any case, I was able to get a jack under the car at that spot and lift it off the ramp so I could pull it out, at which point I just jacked the car up by the front crossmember, put in jackstands, and changed the oil without incident. Then I took the left front wheel off, measured the back of the rim and took some photos, put the wheel back on, finger-tightened the lug bolts, lowered the car, talked to my neighbor for about 10 minutes, and then headed out for a short drive to christen the new oil. This was strictly local driving--30 mph in most places. The car was fine for about a half mile or so, but at one point I missed a turn that I had wanted to make and decided to stop a little farther ahead and make a U-turn to go back. As I came out of the U-turn, I thought I felt or heard something odd in the left front area, but the car was still driving normally, so I just kept going. And then, not more than a couple of hundred feet later, it all just came apart. I felt the left front go down, then heard a sound like rocks crunching, and then watched as the left front wheel very smoothly separated from the car, rolled right along with me for a second or two, not more than three feet away, and then shot forward like a rocket, bouncing up the road at 35 mph but thankfully not hitting anyone or anything, and then ending up in a bush a couple of hundred yards ahead. It was at that moment, of course, that I remembered that I had only finger-tightened the lug bolts... ??? I managed to stop the car and pull over to the right side of the road pretty quickly, and then I jumped out to take a look at what I knew was going to be a real day-ruiner... ? And yeah, it definitely didn't look good--a car on the side of the road that's down to the brake drum on one corner just looks broken. But other than that, nothing actually seemed broken--nothing was leaking, nothing was smoking, nothing looked particularly twisted out of shape. The only thing I could see that showed any signs that something had happened was the front edge of the drum, which looked scored all the way around, probably from cutting through the pavement. And amazingly enough, four of the five lug bolts were sitting in the middle of the road not more than 100 feet away. A bunch of people stopped, and I finally hitched a ride back to my house to get the truck and the jacks. I say "jacks" plural because it was both my regular 3-ton jack and the small one that I keep with the Concord...which I had left back at the driveway, after I had used it to help get the collapsed Rhino Ramp out. In any case, I got them, came back, managed to get the front end up in the air, and eventually managed to get the wheel back on with the four bolts, although I had to stop every time a car passed, which was often. But after I lowered the jack and put everything away in the truck, I was amazingly able to just drive the car back to the house with no problems--they definitely don't make 'em like this anymore! And after I dropped it off and walked back and got the truck, I drove back to where I had made that U-turn, and sure enough, there was the fifth lug bolt, right in the middle of the road, standing on end. ? Unfortunately, when I got back home, I realized that I actually hadn't escaped unscathed. There are now two pretty large, shallow dents in the front left fender (one of which I can push in and out very easily, although it won't stay), along with a small amount of creasing and a tiny bit of paint loss. The fender is also sort of bowed in at the bottom, behind the tire, obviously from when the car dropped to the pavement. The Concord emblem has also come unscrewed on one end, but all of this is actually camouflaged pretty well by the car's dark blue color. (See attached photos.) Nevertheless, I'm pretty sick about the whole thing, because this is (was) a really straight car. (It's also interesting that in my rush to get the wheel back on in passing traffic, I didn't notice the fender damage, even though it was literally a foot in front of my face.) So I definitely want to try to get the fender fixed, and if anyone has any thoughts on the best way to get that done, feel free to chime in--I've never had any old car body work done. How hard is it to take one of these fenders off? Can I do it? It seems like it would be a lot easier to just get the fender itself repaired, rather than involving the whole car (which is in Maine, along with me, but I'm only there for another month, so time could be an issue). Or would it be easier to just look for an intact donor fender and get that painted? Also, how does winter storage (indoors but not heated) affect unrepaired metal? I'm thinking that rust could be a problem, especially on edges and creases. In any case, thanks for listening to my tale of woe. Believe me, no one knows more than I do what a dumb mistake this was. I'm trying not to beat myself up over it (although I'm not doing a very good job of it at the moment), but I do know that I was very lucky, in more ways than one. Definitely not something I want to do again... ?

Great job!

No, thanks for heads-up! The price difference just grabbed my attention...

Thanks, Sniper!

And for some reason, the Bernbaum kit ($1500) is almost twice as expensive as the ECI kit ($825)...

He also mentioned that he straightened the steering shaft, but I'm not sure how he did that...

He actually does use the stock steering box...he explains what he had to do for clearance starting at around 1:30 of the first video...

Hi...not sure this has been posted anywhere on this site before (I couldn't find anything via search), but this guy has swapped a 318 into his '51 Concord (my exact car, right down to the New Brunswick blue!) and has documented it on YouTube. This isn't a step-by-step documentation of the build, but it does give you a good sense of what it takes to shoehorn even a smallish V8 into a P22 or similar car. He used an A904 transmission, which he said (in response to my question) was "not the easiest swap"... Anyway, just posting in the hope that this will be helpful for anyone who's contemplating a similar swap...

Hey, everyone...I know a lot of people (myself included) have contemplated or are contemplating a rear-end swap for their old Mopar car or truck, and I know that Jeep rear-ends are often mentioned as replacements, so I just wanted to share this short YouTube video, which is a great little tutorial on the various Jeep rear ends available over the years: Gary

Hey, thanks for the suggestions, everyone. My primary objective is to slowly start making performance (okay, "performance") upgrades to the 218 that's in there now (dual intakes, split exhaust or headers, maybe eventually a lumpier cam, maybe eventually stroking it with a 230 crank and rods, and maybe even eventually swapping in a 251 or a 265), and then making some standing-mile runs (no hard launches, just an easy run out for a mile or two to top speed) to see what kind of performance can be wrung out of these little flatties. But I figured that the three-speed would be an immediate handicap on anything I did to the engine, so I thought I might as well get some overdrive in there before I did anything else. I'm open to the R10 (especially the bolt-in aspect), but as you know, they are getting really tough to find, while the T5s (with a bellhousing kit, in my case, from Vintage Metalworks) are not. So there is at least a little bit of method to my madness... ?

Honestly, I have no problem with drums all around. I'm contemplating doing the T5 swap (I have the T5 in hand) for the overdrive, but because of the loss of the parking brake, I said, well, I'll just swap in an Explorer rear end with disc brakes and a parking brake and I'll be good to go! And then I said, well, I've read that it's not good to have discs in the back and drums up front, so I'll swap the front drums out, too. And then I said, well, maybe I'll get a Jeep 8.8 rear end with drums (which actually sounds like the best idea if I do go with the T5). And THEN, of course, I said, well, maybe the folks on the website are right--maybe I should just get an R10 overdrive and keep everything else stock. So if you know of anyone with an R10 (other than the guy on eBay charging $2,100 for a R10 that looks like it needs a serious rebuild), let me know! ?

Believe me, I'm not disagreeing with you, especially after this...

So Scarebird has stopped providing hubs with its '46 to '54 Plymouth/Dodge front-disc-brake conversion kits, apparently due to the aluminum shortage. From what I can see, they're still providing aluminum hubs with their '55-'56 kits, as well as hubs (aluminum or otherwise) with other manufacturers' kits, so I'm not sure why they can't at least provide steel hubs with our kit, but of course, I don't work there and I'm sure they have their reasons. However, they are still providing the basic conversion kit (mounting brackets, etc.), which you can apparently use with the original drum hub. They say that some machining may be necessary, and from what I've read elsewhere, that means having to shave down the drum hub so that the rotor hat will fit over it. Anyone done this conversion before, using a kit or otherwise? Is it worth it? Thanks!

I love those races...I also like the WRC rally cars in Europe...it looks like a ton of fun, but it also looks totally abusive...LOL...

And then you have the Russian ice motorcycle racers... ?

You're on the wrong coast, unfortunately, but Loring in Maine is great for hot laps. They use the 13,000-foot runway at the old Loring AFB in Limestone, and unless you're going over 200, you need to get back on it before you even reach the turnoff...it's a huge place. The people are great, too. It's definitely a poke for anyone outside the Northeast, but they get racers from all over the country every July...

Agreed...and as much as I've always loved watching roundy-round racing off all sorts, I've never really had a desire to do it...I also drag raced a little bit about 20 years ago, but I've kind of lost my passion for that, too...LSR kind of hits the sweet spot of cool cars, cool people, and crazy speed...

Hey...no apologies needed! And thanks for that link...that's awesome...I can't believe I never saw these guys before. That's exactly what I'm looking for, whether the engine ends up in the Concord or in a lakester. I had actually just contacted a guy at H&H Flatheads, who pretty much just do Ford flatties, and he liked the idea of running a Mopar flathead at Bonneville, but said that they couldn't do it. So I'll definitely check them out...this has reinspired me to go the Mopar flathead route, regardless of what vehicle it's in. And if you want to check out another interesting group of Pacific NW Bonneville guys, visit the Hudson Boys website (http://hudsonboys.com/)...these guys have set TONS of slow Bonneville records, which is almost as impressive as the guys who go 400 mph...okay, almost... ? Gary

Hey, everyone...thanks for the replies! So here's the deal. The governing body in question is the SCTA, aka the Bonneville folks. I've always loved land speed racing, and I've actually done a little bit of it (ECTA, LTA, and in a blown Chevy HHR, no less, which I know is ridiculous), but never at Bonneville. And while I'm not really a bucket-list kind of person, I really would like to run the salt at least once before I die (I'm 60, so, you know, any day now... ?). Recently, I talked to a guy who's a very well-respected LSR builder and racer (he built the cage in my HHR) about what it would cost to build a belly-tank lakester for the salt--and because I've become fascinated with flatheads since I bought the Plymouth, my plan was to run a Mopar inline 6 flathead in the lakester, which I think has been done, but not very often. So he quoted me a mid-five-figure dollar number, which I pretty much choked on and really don't think I can afford or even justify. But then I was looking through the 2021 SCTA rule book, and I noticed that the current record for the XO/PRO class (XO is the engine class for non-Ford/Mercury flatheads under 325 ci, and PRO stands for a production body) is 139.713 mph. And despite the fact that that's basically TWICE as fast as the Concord currently runs, I put my beer goggles on and said, "Hey, what if...?" And to be honest, if I just went 100 at Bonneville (especially in a cool car like the Concord) I would probably die a happy man. But I will say that I have to agree with the poster who suggested that maybe I should shoot myself for destroying a rare antique car--or at least, MOST of me agrees with that. There's still a little part of me that says, hey, you know what, it's just a car...and I currently own it! But to be honest, because it's a really stock class, you could actually bring the car back to true stock condition pretty easily--cut the cage out, clean the salt off, get rid of the headers, put the headliner back in, and off you go! ANYWAY...thanks for humoring a crazy old man! I'll keep you posted if I end up doing anything... ?

Hey, everyone...so, as the title suggests, I have a theoretical question for the folks on here who are infinitely more knowledgeable about these cars/engines than I am. Let's say you had a 1951 Plymouth Concord, and you were interested in running the car in a racing class in which you HAD TO run the stock engine (or engine family) available with the car from the showroom floor. Now, that would be the 218, because I think that was the only engine available in the two years of Concord production, although according to the rules, I believe you could also run a 230, because the block (unless I'm mistaken) is the same (it's in the same "engine family," which would exclude the 251 and 265, both because they're two inches longer and because they weren't available with the Concord, unless Canadian Concords came with the bigger blocks), and you're allowed to modify stroke and bore within certain parameters--i.e., you can open the cylinder bores to 0.150 over, and you can stroke it as much as you want, as long as the crank and camshaft remain in the stock location in the block. (I'm also pretty sure that you can use an aftermarket cam and aftermarket rods and pistons of non-stock sizes.) Furthermore, you basically can't do anything to the head, although the block deck can be milled up to 0.150 (but I don't think you can mill the head). Other than all this, you can use ANY transmission, ANY non-quick-change rear-end, and ANY exhaust system (i.e., headers), and you have to have a full cage and a racing seat. But the rest of the car has to be pretty much bone stock--you can take out the stock seats, headliner, carpet, minor chrome items and emblem, and you can run an aftermarket fuel tank (but the stock fuel tank has to remain in place), but that's about it. You can't run a turbo or a blower, and you can't use EFI, but you can use any ignition system (although it can't be interactive, i.e. make decisions based on sensor input), and you can only use a computer for data collection. ARE WE HAVING FUN YET??? So, if you were tasked with making this car go as fast as possible under the above conditions, with no streetability required, and with money (reasonably) no object, what would you do? This test will not be graded, and any and all input (even smart-ass input!) is greatly appreciated...thanks! Gary