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ROB-PA

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Everything posted by ROB-PA

  1. Thanks DJ, I appreciate the effort. As I stated before I am not in a big hurry but I am trying to get everything lined up so that things go smoothly when I do get the opportunity to concentrate on the 35 for a couple of weeks, hopefully this winter. It would be a bummer if I end up getting time to work on the car only to find that I am at a standstill for lack of correct parts. Of course, there is always something to do on the car! I looked at the Chrysler 'parts' engine that came with the truck chassis and drive train. It has the same type of bell housing as the truck, not sure what this came out of, neither was the PO. Someone had started to disassemble it. The bell housing is unbolted but is jammed up on it somehow. Evidently they could not figure out how to get it off and gave up. I peaked inside and the only thing that I noticed is that the spline on the clutch disc is much bigger that the input shaft on the 35 tranny. I was hoping that I could use the truck clutch assembly and save myself 2 or 3 hundred bucks (high prices at Bernbaums). I may have to start totaling up the costs and see if might be more cost effective to go late model conversion.
  2. The only wood the factory installed in the car are the stringers for the canvas roof and a small piece inset on either side of the windshield frame to secure trim. The body is contoured to fit directly on the frame. There are body bolts that run down from the body into the top of the frame and bolts that run horizontally through the body through the side of the frame. There are rubber pads about 1/8" thick between the body and the frame, at least on the vertical bolts, not sure about the ones through the side of the frame. From what I have been able to dig out of the info on the net, 35 and 36 are the only years like this. It was a big part of their advertising campaign in 1935 (No Wood!). The 34 was the last Plymouth to have wood in the frame/body mount; in 37 they went to the more conventional ear type frame mounts on the outside of the frame with rubber buffer body mounts. I won't get a chance to work on this for a couple of days; off to WV to work on the new house. DJ, were you saying that the flywheel and clutch may be available? The bell housing appears to be correct; has all of the right mounting holes at least.
  3. I have the complete drive line from the truck, that includes the flywheel, starter, clutch and transmission. I haven't removed the engine yet, only one bay to work in right now. I'm just trying to get everything lined up. Once I remove the 35 body I plan on setting up the whole drive train in the 35 frame before I strip the frame and blast and paint it. If the flywheel is not a different diameter and fits in the 37 bell housing I may be able to make it work. I believe that the trucks must have a different sleeve on the release bearing since the clutch linkage is way different. I'm not sure what else may be different yet. I have considered welding a brace or nut on the carriage bolt head and I may give it a try. My welding skills are notoriously bad and I may cause more damage than I would with a torch!
  4. Yes, I have had to drill out carriage bolts before. That's why I'm not too happy about it and I am procrastinating. I may try the torch yet. Right now I have 5 of these to remove and the thought of having to drill all of those is painful. When you drill them you need to go all the way through the square and then collapse it inward so the bolt can be removed. As an aside, does any one know the difference between the car clutch and the truck clutch? I got a clutch with the 46 truck drive train that is supposed to be relatively new and I was wondering if I could use it. Bernbaum list them as different assemblies.
  5. I'm learning new every day, no wait, make that every hour that I work on it. This is all new to me. In my past life I built and maintained race cars as a hobby; everything was relatively new and clean. When I managed to get all of the pan head screws out of the X frame I thought that I had licked the biggest problem. Boy was I wrong! I have been trying to get out the carriage bolts now with limited success. About half of them are tucked into corners of the frame as well as corners of the door posts. Of course those are the ones that the squares have rounded out. They are too close to the frame for the nut splitter and I can't get at the heads with anything. I'm hesitant to cut them with the torch so I'll probably end up drilling them out. I think someone was there before me and managed to destroy all of the seats for the carriage bolts trying to remove them. This will not be pleasant. Today I found that one of the rear spring shackles was broken. I went to the 36 frame and found that there is one I may be able to use if it comes out cleanly. I also just found them at A. Bernbaum if it doesn't.
  6. Todd, I looked closer at the 'trim anchors' (for lack of a better term) in the 35 and found that there were a couple of small sections of mine that had been replaced with some kind if soft wood also. I plan on taping over them prior to media blasting. I took a couple of pictures of the floor pan where it is secured to the X frame. I also went and looked at the 36 frame and confirmed that it is the same. There are square 5/6" nuts welded to the frame rails. In the pictures you can see that there is a trough stamped in the pan where these screws attach the floor pan to the X frame. I plan on replacing all of the carriage bolts and pan head screws with button head allen screws.
  7. Todd, The 12 screws that I found in the X frame are definitely factory screws. There are captive nuts secured to the frame that they screw into that were always there. It appears, at least at this point, that the floor pan is just sandwiched between the body and the frame at the frame rails. I do hope that the pan is welded or secured to the body by some means as that would make the whole structure much more rigid. I removed 2 more of the carriage bolts that attach the body to the frame rails today. I had to use a nut splitter as the square wholes for the carriage bolt heads in the frame were wobbled out. Still have 6 more to go. I would love to see some of assembly line photos. Can you point me in that direction? I'll see if I can get you a clear enough picture of the screws that I am referring to. I know that the 1935 advertising really touted the more rigid bodies due to the increased mounting points. Rob
  8. Thanks for the information Austinsailor. I'll check that out. I'm not sure which way I'm going with this build yet. While I would like to keep everything original I have to be practical. I'm looking now at upgrading the brakes to more modern to eliminate the maintenance headaches. I can do the work now but 5 years from now . . . maybe not. The wife and I plan on taking some trips with this car so I'm trying to eliminate all of the potential problems while I still am able. The radio is still down the road a ways at this point.
  9. I think this car deserves a frame off restoration; it is really solid and I would like to prevent any further deterioration. I don't plan on making a show car, just a solid driver. The car was already stripped to paint when I received it so all of the glass is out and all of the interior. The fenders, running boards, grill and hood just have enough bolts to keep them in place. It seemed like a relatively small amount of work to pull the body and do it right the first time. That is until I found out about the 46 body bolts to the frame! I should mention that I also received a second frame with the car. It is in pretty rough shape and it turns out to have been from a 36 instead of a 35 but I believe that the body will bolt right on (I hope). I plan on removing the body from the original frame and securing it on this frame so that it can be mounted on a rotisserie for soda blast and paint. If the floor pan was attached to the body I would not have worried all that much about the swap from frame to frame. I was hoping that I could avoid welded braces so that I would not have to worry bout touching up interior paint. I guess I will be welding in some braces and just being very careful where they go. I will probably weld in the base of the B pillars also. Maybe I should just tack weld the floor to the body for the transition?
  10. Also, as I started looking at removing the dash and I noticed that there is a mystery (to me) control or light on the dash. It is in extreme the lower left. I have attached a picture below. Right now is an empty socket that looks like it has a thread on the ID ; maybe to take one of the old threaded lenses for an indicator light(?). This car came with the optional radio, see picture. I understand that this is fairly rare. Is there any information on this? It has a separate control in the center of the dash and it looks like the actual radio is tucked up under the upper left of the dash in a metal box (with speaker). I'm sure that this is next to impossible to get repaired and probably didn't work all that well. I remember the radio in my 1950 Dodge was a little sporadic. I may put something modern in the 'black box' and try to retain the original controls. Has this been done before?
  11. While continuing my slow disassembly of the car some questions came up and I hope someone here can help. Around the doors and the seat frame, and I am sure in some areas that I haven't noticed, there is a packing secured in grooves to retain the upholstery. Apparently it was tacked or stapled in at these locations. It appears to be something like hemp wrapped in tape (no idea what it is called). Is there a replacement for this material available or should I work to preserve it while cleaning (sand & soda blasting)? There is seam sealer around all of the joints where the floor boards meet the frame and the tunnel. I haven't removed all of it yet but so far I don't see any place where the floor pans are secured to the body or the tunnel other that the body mount bolts that I am now removing. If the floor pans are not attached to the body in any way I am wondering how flexible the body is going to be when I lift it off. This became more of a concern when I noticed that the B pillar is apparently only secured at the bottom by 3 of the carriage bolts securing the body to the frame. I'd like to know if I need to weld in some braces before lifting the body?? I've attached a couple of pictures below of the floor pans. What I originally thought were solid floor pans ended up having a minor rust issue in front of the battery box. I'm not going to complain as the rest is just some minor surface rust and I have found a partial patch panel for the rusted area at the Plymouth Doctor. Someone in the past had done a really good job of 'repairing' the rust with some type of epoxy and it was all but invisible under the paint and dirt. It loosened up when I was using the impact screwdriver to remove the 12 pan head screws in the 'X' frame. I might have to attach some of the pictures in a follow up post.
  12. Well, I had some time away from house construction the last couple of days so I started to prep the Plymouth PJ sedan for body removal. While I believe that they had their act together and designed a beautiful car, whoever determined how it was to be assembled is not my favorite person. The big promotion for the 'new' 1935 Plymouth stated that one of the improvements was the integrity of the body / chassis. They raved about the 46 body to frame mounts! What a nightmare. I had to remove the front seat frame to remove the remaining 2 mounting screws in the 'X' frame. These were 5/16" pan head screws that required a lot of PB Blaster, the impact screw driver and a lot of sweat. Today I started removing the bolts down the right side of the frame rails. For some reason, I guess to make it pleasing to the eye, 6 of the 12 bolts ( those at the bottom of the doors) are carriage bolts. After 60 some odd thousand miles the square holes in the body are no longer square on about half of these. I got 3 of the 6 out on the right side before I called it a night. I stopped when I found that the one at the bottom of the rear door had about half of the head leaded in to true up the line. Time to dig out the old nut splitter. The bolts on the far rear of the frame, back near the rear apron, actually are about 4 1/2" bolts with nuts that go all the way through the frame. I guess this is gong to be an interesting project. I do have one question. Around the doors and the seat frame, and I am sure in some areas that I haven't noticed, there is a packing secured in grooves to retain the upholstery. It appears to be something like hemp wrapped in tape (no idea what it is called). Is this available or should I work to preserve it while cleaning?
  13. Congratulations! That is a beautiful car.
  14. Thanks David. I'll be pulling the cover once I finish cleaning the exterior, maybe tonight. Thanks to Robert Horne also. I mic'd the pilot shaft after I cleaned it up and I have about 0.743" to 0.744". I think I can live with that. There is still some minor pitting but I figure that will just help to retain some lube I've been mulling over the T5 conversion also but I figured I'd like to try to keep it original if I can.
  15. David is correct. The shifter is mounted in a conical extension of the top cover that overhangs and is bolted to the bell housing. In the manual I have the graphic shows the shifter and the shifting rails mentioned and what appears to be ball detents below the rails. I didn't know if the removal of the cover would allow the rails to move and release the ball detents. I scanned the graphic and I will try to attach it below but the scan didn't come out too clear. I was also wondering where I can get replacements for the universal boots on the drive shaft. The originals on this are leather and they are pretty much toast. I see that the 46 truck drive shaft is similar but they are rubber. I haven't been able to find these yet. Any ideas?
  16. Okay, I finally got to spend some time with the 35 Plymouth (building a new house really eats your time!). I have a couple of basic questions. The input shaft was somewhat corroded from sitting for about 40 years with no engine attached. I cleaned it up and attacked it with some medium grit emery strips (100, 200, 400). It doesn't look too bad but there is some pitting. I may be able to live with the pitting but I would like to know if anyone here knows what the OD of the pilot shaft is supposed to be. I don't think I removed too much material but I would like to check it. The next question is about removing the top plate to inspect and clean. Are there any surprises waiting for me? Like spring loaded ball detents that will try to find a new home. This is the early tranny with the shifter that overhangs the bell housing. The bottom of the shift mechanism is exposed when there is no bell housing attached. The transmission shifts but it is very stiff so I'm sure the shift pivot needs cleaned and lubed and the sludge needs to be drained from the box and some cleaning performed. Any advise would be appreciated.
  17. Well Plymouthy, you are absolutely right! I went out this evening with the Scotch Brite and some WD 40 and, voila, about 1/2 inch in front of the P25 is a diamond. It wasn't stamped very well but there is no mistaking it once the area was cleaned, By the way the 7 is definitely a 7.
  18. Now I am really confused. I just went out to check my engine number again. It is P25*272958*; no diamonds, definitely stars.
  19. Being new to this also I have been doing a lot of digging on the net. I found the attached list somewhere in my waFlathead 6.pdfnderings. It shows that the 218 cu-in were used early and then later in the year they switched to the 230 cu-in. It would be nice to know what engine number started the 230 but I have not found that yet. Anyone know? Does anyone know the total number produced? It is good to know what the stars are for; thanks for that input.
  20. Wow! There is nothing like having a goal to shoot for.
  21. SOTH122003, I checked the Motor I have first but it only goes up to 1951. Wish I had the whole set.
  22. Bobandy, Yes, the same website lists for Plymouth, Chrysler and Desotos. Follow the link and go to the bottom; there is a link to 'Return to Flathead Six Engine Number Page'. You can select which model. Not sure how complete the lists are.
  23. I used to build and run Formula Vee race cars that were based on the early 60's VW Beetle. Everyone that ran them used the original 6 Volt starter with a 12 Volt system. I never heard of a starter failing in the 25 years that I was involved. I think I used the same starter on every car I built for myself. I have been trying to figure out what I would have to go through to run a 12 Volt system on the 35 Plymouth and whether it would be worth it.
  24. Yes, it is a 25 inch from a Chrysler. It seems odd though, there are only 4 characters (C3224), I think that there are usually more (?). The website I noted above only lists C34 and C38 numbers. Maybe the list is incomplete or this may have been a replacement block. I am not that familiar with the number codes. Is anyone aware of another listing for these codes? Is there any explanation of what the rest of the numbers mean? The number of the engine that I got for my Plymouth is P25*272958*. I know that the P25 means it is from a 1954 Plymouth but I have no idea what the remaining digits mean. I'm pretty new to this obsession. If AL48s has a Dodge that was made in Australia the numbers may be completely different.
  25. AL48s, There is a Dodge Power Wagon site that has some basic engine number listings (http://www.t137.com/registry/help/otherengines/dengines.html ). This list only identifies the number that you have by the first 3 characters, D43, which it shows to be from a 1953 Dodge car. It is not unusual to find an engine from a different year in one of these vehicles. I bought an engine from a 46 Dodge truck recently that turned out to be from a 54 Plymouth! I was looking at this site today as I acquired a 'spare' engine with the 35 Plymouth that I just bought and the number is odd. It has a stamped number of C3224 which doesn't show there. Can't use the engine in my car so I was trying to get information to eventually post it for sale.
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