Thinking of purchasing a front suspension rebuild kit

[D35 Torpedo]

So, I pulled the front suspension out of the 52 today. I'm thinking about rebuilding it to swap into the 50, to prevent down time. The 52 also has slightly different lower control arms. The spring pocket sits lower. And the springs look heavier. I was looking online and found Andys kit at a reasonable price. Then I found another kit at a terrible price. Who has used Andys kit and can give info on its fitment and durability? Because everything pivotes on bolts, the materials need to be top notch. One other thing I noticed is that one of the suspension uprights appears to be bent. Ill take a pic tomorrow.

[andyd]

I can't comment on the quality of the kits but generally speaking I've only had good dealings with Andy Bernbaums over the past 35yrs or so.........also I'm unsure whether buying a "kit" will give you a discount on the total cost as it maybe cheaper to buy the wearing parts individually via ebay, its unusual for the upper & lower A arms to have any wear, tho' the spindles or uprights have been known to exhibit a "bend" after I suppose a large pothole or similar   .......also things like the kingpins, inner & outer upper & lower bushes and pins are the same up to 1954, tierod ends also are used for a number of years, tho' the sway bar links do change thru the years so you may have to get the specific year parts but once you know or get familiar with mopar front suspensions they do allow a certain amount of interchangeability between 1940 and 1954........andyd

[Sniper]

When I went thru my 51's front suspension the only thing that needed addressing was the king pins and the front shocks.  I did put a set of cut down Aerostar springs in it.  I ended up taking a full coil out, should have probably only done half a coil though.  I took the upright and spindle assemblies to the machine shop along with the new king pin kit and had them do it,

[D35 Torpedo]

A bend like this andyd?

I think between both cars I have one good set.

I have the king pin kit already. I'm leaning towards a full kit, just for piece of mind, one and done.

[andyd]

Torpedo..........err, yep.........thats what I'd call a bent spindle..........lol...........one good thing tho' is that there appears to be very little grease to be removed on it...............lol..........andyd 

[D35 Torpedo]

18 hours ago, andyd said:

Torpedo..........err, yep.........thats what I'd call a bent spindle..........lol...........one good thing tho' is that there appears to be very little grease to be removed on it...............lol..........andyd 

Funny that both these parts came out of the same car. One side is nice black paint and the other side is rusty. The drum, backing plate and LCA is the same.

[D35 Torpedo]

Welp, made that purchase...should've order rear spring and shackle bushings as well. Maybe Napa with have something.

[Saskwatch]

If you do find the spring & shackle bushings @ Napa , would really appreciate it if you could pass the part# along please ?

[D35 Torpedo]

On 4/16/2023 at 6:24 AM, Saskwatch said:

If you do find the spring & shackle bushings @ Napa , would really appreciate it if you could pass the part# along please ?

So far I have found urethane front bushings. I had to reuse the sleeve to make them work. Napa 274-7053. I lubed them up with silicone grease and pushed the sleeve in with a vice. They are on the tight side of things.

[D35 Torpedo]

Update on the front kit

 

Andy's kit showed up pretty quickly. The quality looks good. Shipping wasn't terrible being from Canadastan. I can't wait to put it all together.

 

Hints, tips and tricks are welcome.

['41 Fat Bottom Girl]

I just saw your posts...

after I just wrote one about how the heck do you remove the kingpin retaining Pins?

Sure would appreciate it if you would find that one and give me your advice.

Thanx,

Bruce

 

[D35 Torpedo]

Update

 

Well.....good and bad news. The good news is, I've replaced the bent stuff, one upper control arm and steering knuckle. Bad new is all the stuff I purchased isn't as good as I first thought. So much so that I am only using what I must, and this isn't much. It all "looks" good. But the hardness isn't on par. The grade of material is lacking. I discovered this when inspecting the new king pins. They had some knicks that I hit with a file. And to my surprise, the file dug in. So I tested the old pin and it skated off. Then I tested the suspension pivots and the same thing happened. Moral of the story is, source NOS. We will see how the lower control arm pivots age.  Since I figured this out after doing them. As for king pins. I have a bushing and bearing so I can't use what I purchased. I just put the new thrust bearing in. I also had to add 30 thou of shim in the top gap to get it pretty tight. The old bearings only have a tiny bit of play. I guess we will see how the other side goes tomorrow.

[Dodgeb4ya]

Yep most new repop parts are junk sadly.

Soft metal.

NOS or NORS only parts that will fit right, be safe to use and last.

['41 Fat Bottom Girl]

Looking at the kit parts from AB now and seeing more differences.

The old Kingpins mic at .793 O.D.

The new pins mic at .799 O.D.

The original Kingpins are hardened, ground steel and the replacement parts are untreated steel, but looked better once I hit it with fine emery cloth, but certainly not ground or as smooth a finish. 

My old kingpins aren't useable as they have scoring, and I haven't been able to locate an NOS kit.

Looking at the dimensions I have with the pin and bushings there is no question that I will have to ream the bushings by .003" to .004" so I may have to get an adjustable reamer so I can control the bore cut. With some care, I think I can make it work. (Reamer-$100- Grrr.)

 

(I did see on my old kingpins that the top bushing area showed wear whereas the bottoms looked good. I suppose on some cars that's why they used needle bearings instead of a top sleeve bushing, longer wear. On my year Mopars, the 7-passenger car had needle bearing on top, all others bushed.)

 

Good Luck!

 

 

 

 

[D35 Torpedo]

3 hours ago, '41 Fat Bottom Girl said:

Looking at the kit parts from AB now and seeing more differences.

The old Kingpins mic at .793 O.D.

The new pins mic at .799 O.D.

The original Kingpins are hardened, ground steel and the replacement parts are untreated steel, but looked better once I hit it with fine emery cloth, but certainly not ground or as smooth a finish. 

My old kingpins aren't useable as they have scoring, and I haven't been able to locate an NOS kit.

Looking at the dimensions I have with the pin and bushings there is no question that I will have to ream the bushings by .003" to .004" so I may have to get an adjustable reamer so I can control the bore cut. With some care, I think I can make it work. (Reamer-$100- Grrr.)

 

(I did see on my old kingpins that the top bushing area showed wear whereas the bottoms looked good. I suppose on some cars that's why they used needle bearings instead of a top sleeve bushing, longer wear. On my year Mopars, the 7-passenger car had needle bearing on top, all others bushed.)

 

Good Luck!

 

 

 

 

I've read that. So then the spindle would need to be reamed as well. In my opinion, that would ruin them. Maybe it's better to have some tool steel cut and treated instead. The machinist should be able to account for shrinkage. Yes expensive, but you're not Micky Mousing things to fit substandard parts. I'm going to have a chat about this with some people I know. 

[andyd]

Maybe its been just my Oz luck but my understanding has been that kingpin bushings always have to be reamed to size after being installed in the stub axles.........at least thats what I've always had done both for any mopar kingpin sets I've played with and in fact others including Frod & Shev.......andyd  

['41 Fat Bottom Girl]

I agree, thanx Andyd, it is indeed SOP. If the Kingpins were same dia. as stock, I could have used my old in-line reamer from my old kit.

This go-around I am going to get a new adjustable reamer so I can size the bushing bore to the new pin diameters.

I'm not going to worry about the pin hardness, it will be working against the bronze bushing. The new Kingpins are round, T.I.R. is less than .ooo5" so roundness is fine.

Torpedo, I wouldn't do anything to the spindle. 

My aftermarket split bushings pulled in ok, and it took a bit of pressure to install them. The new adjustable reamer should work fine to size them to the new Kingpins.

Now that I am this far into it, I think everything is going to be ok using the replacement kit.

Hang in there!

[D35 Torpedo]

4 hours ago, '41 Fat Bottom Girl said:

I agree, thanx Andyd, it is indeed SOP. If the Kingpins were same dia. as stock, I could have used my old in-line reamer from my old kit.

This go-around I am going to get a new adjustable reamer so I can size the bushing bore to the new pin diameters.

I'm not going to worry about the pin hardness, it will be working against the bronze bushing. The new Kingpins are round, T.I.R. is less than .ooo5" so roundness is fine.

Torpedo, I wouldn't do anything to the spindle. 

My aftermarket split bushings pulled in ok, and it took a bit of pressure to install them. The new adjustable reamer should work fine to size them to the new Kingpins.

Now that I am this far into it, I think everything is going to be ok using the replacement kit.

Hang in there!

The pin is over size....and the stock pin is a very tight fit in the spindle. So explain to me how you will get it in there?

['41 Fat Bottom Girl]

I have sleeve bushings both ends, so I don't know how things work with a needle bearing on top.

But for what it's worth, here is what I have done so far:

The bushings have to be pulled in from the bottom, not installed from the top. I got a big bolt and washers and nut and pulled them into place. I just cleaned up the bores (really well!) with some emery cloth and lubed them with grease before installing the bushings. A couple big wrenches and they pulled in OK. I just made very sure they were flush so there is no interference with shims etc. later (photos). A finished assembly is on the left showing the flush installation.

I ordered my adjustable reamer and will ream the bushing I.D.s to fit the new Kingpins. I have about .004" to remove on the bushings to get a slip fit with the Kingpins.

 

I am curious about the needle bearing you are working with on top- is its bore diameter a different diameter than that for your lower sleeve bushing? I was wondering if it was larger on top. I don't know anything about those, I have just done sleeves in my past.

Good Luck

 

 

 

[D35 Torpedo]

6 hours ago, '41 Fat Bottom Girl said:

I have sleeve bushings both ends, so I don't know how things work with a needle bearing on top.

But for what it's worth, here is what I have done so far:

The bushings have to be pulled in from the bottom, not installed from the top. I got a big bolt and washers and nut and pulled them into place. I just cleaned up the bores (really well!) with some emery cloth and lubed them with grease before installing the bushings. A couple big wrenches and they pulled in OK. I just made very sure they were flush so there is no interference with shims etc. later (photos). A finished assembly is on the left showing the flush installation.

I ordered my adjustable reamer and will ream the bushing I.D.s to fit the new Kingpins. I have about .004" to remove on the bushings to get a slip fit with the Kingpins.

 

I am curious about the needle bearing you are working with on top- is its bore diameter a different diameter than that for your lower sleeve bushing? I was wondering if it was larger on top. I don't know anything about those, I have just done sleeves in my past.

Good Luck

 

 

 

Sorry, I said spindle, I meant the knuckle/upright. Its pin bore will need to be reamed as well. Yes the needle bearing pocket is a larger size. Good luck with your project.

[D35 Torpedo]

Update

 

It's all back together. I swapped parts from the plymouth and I am happy with the results. I used the lower control arms, sway bar, right knuckle, right upper control arm, springs, right drum and left spindle from the Ply. The coils are cut one turn. I might cut another quarter coil eventually. All the pivots in the dodge were decent. I used the new king pin thrust bearings, and had to add an extra 30 thou on each side to eliminate play. The car drives wwwaaaaayy better. It does't pull, the wheel is straight, it's nice and firm and doesn't pitch over in turns. It's a completely different car. 

 

From what I can tell. The king pin bushings wear the steel pin. I've hear this before but now I've seen it first hand. It seems backwards, but that's the way it is. The real advantage of the needle bearing is that it doesn't. Just thought that this is interesting food for thought.

['41 Fat Bottom Girl]

Congrats! Job well done.

Had a delay getting mine back together- I hope to enjoy that better ride next week!

Thanx for letting us know how it all turned out. Good to know.