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EDIT: ready!!: installing new core/ freeze plugs


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EDIT: executed successfully- See my posting 2022-05-13 / ~13:08

 

I have these sets of core plugs:

Bowl- style (left) and dish- style (right). (EDIT: right is from Bernbaums!) The Parts List shows "Plug- 9-02-5", but the sketch is not exactly clear.

 

 

My mechanic would prefer the left bowl- style.

He uses to insert them

- convexity inside

- freeze them down to 5 deg. F (-15 deg. C) 

- without any sealing. "They will expand while warming up and rust solid to the block".

 

 

The manual says to install

- convexity out, to use

- "MOPAR Perfect Seal Sealing Compound", and  

- expand them by hammering them flat with a blunt drift.

- No mention of freezing before (maybe because in the 50ies freezers were not on hand in every house of the land.)

 

Questions:

- Which plug- style will last better?

- Which sealant should I use?

 

 

 I am suspicious with the the "rusting-in solid" procedure.

 

 

Thanks!

Greetings from Düsseldorf!

Go

 

 

Froststopfen.jpg

Edited by Go Fleiter
executed successfully
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If you want the car to be accurately original, then use the dish type. The cups are usually deeper, but I believe the recesses on the motor block are rather shallow. Would check this.  Important are the rear and front plugs, very hard to correct if they start leaking.

Core plug opening.jpg

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Not sure the bowl type will work properly.  The holes are machines for the dish type, you can see the ledge in Bryan's bottom picture.  That will likely not allow the bowl type to seat deep enough to seal.  Blocks machined to use thee bowl type do not have those ledges, or at least I have not seen them.

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use the disc, proud side out.....you may use a tad of sealer if you like, Permatex is a good choice, no need to freeze these.  Clean the block recess well, insert the plug and dimple the center, this will cause a slight rolling effect and effectively make the plug expand 360 locking into the recess.  The cup unit is not what you want to use...while you may get one to fit...the block was not designed for their use.  A cup style if fitted may also be a chore to remove later do the depth of the cup and closer proximity to the wall of the inner block may cause for no room to clear the hole especially if the deeper cup is used.

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I have had problems with the disc type leaking. The issue is the walls of the block where the disc's sit get rusted up over time and even when a block is acid dipped it is rough in there and it weeps. I had some brass discs pop out many years ago. Turns out the brass ones were slightly smaller than the steel ones. One can try and find my posts on that from 15 years ago...

 

When I do the 265 block we are going to machine the holes through and perfectly round to use a cup style plug.

 

James

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32 minutes ago, Dartgame said:

My machinist recommends using jb weld to seal the disc type plugs. if you need to remove them later, just heat up with a propane torch to remove the jb weld.

Winner winner!

Have done many many brass disc this way over the years on both flat heads and Hemi's.

Pitted or not proper prep and install...never a leak.

Edited by Dodgeb4ya
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Use the brass flat disk style welch plugs the deep dish style are not correct.

 

The brass will last longer than the galvanized welch plugs

 

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

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5 hours ago, Sniper said:

Not sure the bowl type will work properly.  The holes are machines for the dish type, you can see the ledge in Bryan's bottom picture.  That will likely not allow the bowl type to seat deep enough to seal.  Blocks machined to use thee bowl type do not have those ledges, or at least I have not seen them.

One source

https://mossmotors.com/core-plug-brass-cylinder-block-1-5-8?utm_source=feed&utm_medium=free&utm_campaign=shopping&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIzcuC4rfG9wIVmXtvBB1JMA-hEAQYCiABEgIuN_D_BwE

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And here..Summit Racing..

Screenshot_20220504-111406_Google.jpg

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1 hour ago, Dodgeb4ya said:

And here..Summit Racing..

Screenshot_20220504-111406_Google.jpg

Looking at ones I need but $11 shipping for the number I'm getting.  Think you mentioned at one point about doubling up on the ones in the rear.

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Well, if you are near/passing by McDonough Ga on I-75 you can beat the shipping by stopping by the store.  My son and I popped in a month or so back to cruise the aisle of the large display lobby.   I am not often that far north on I-75 but maybe 4 times a year.  

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For dimpling the plugs, I rounded off the end of an air chisel tip and give the plug a quick hit with the air chisel. Works like a dream, especially if the engine is in the car. I also use Permatex aviation gasket sealer on the plugs when I install them although I will be using JB Weld in the future.

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I have a pile of them from dorman. But, they are a few thousands smaller in diameter than the steel ones and if that hole is at all opened up due to rust and the like, they may well not hold.  I too use JB weld on all of them now, steel or brass. But like I said, I am going to machine the block to take the cup style. I could care less on the '47 if it looks stock or not.

 

On the 1949, I machined the "correct" tool to pound or press the disc plugs down as specified by one of the manufacturers. It has a step that stops the plug for being driven too far and the nipple of the tool creates a wide pressure across the entire face.

 

James

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during my travels to Hershey and carlise I have stopped at several tool venders and have seen the welsh plug installer tool that has several flat disks that screw unto the  a long road that can swivel so that you can hit the end of the long rod with a hammer to drive the welch plugs into place and set thme properly.

This tool is currently on ebay for $58  Look up Freeze plug tools

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.comimage.png.0bcd495ebe0c2f63247d161aae53a104.png

Edited by desoto1939
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Original poster is in Germany so shipping maybe an issue.........but use brass plugs shaped like that on the right of the original pic, 1 & 5/8th diameter.........clean the recess in the block well, wipe some non hardening gasket goo around the edge of the hole, place the plug in the hole, sitting on the ledge of the hole and using a drift or even say a 6" long socket extension, 3/8 x 6" bolt hit the centre of the plug which as Plymouthy says will flattened the plug a little and therefore "expand" its diameter locking it into the edge of the hole in the block........I've never had to replace a brass plug.............they don't rust........andyd 

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Went for the whole shebang.  Even a few trial plugs for the 2nd layer on the rear oil galley.   One thing..don't pry the core plug off on the head. Not sure I have the right size.

Core Plugs.jpg

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Posted (edited)

One more hint regarding the installation needed:

The rearmost left plug has to be changed.

It is easy to take the starter out -

but will there be enough room to hammer the new plug flat??

Did anyone ever try?

Or do I have to take the engine out?

20220501_165554 Txt.jpg

Edited by Go Fleiter
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  • Go Fleiter changed the title to ...one more: Questions: installing new core/ freeze plugs
  • Go Fleiter changed the title to EDIT: ready!!: installing new core/ freeze plugs

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