Master cylinder upgrade to 2 chamber style

[George Anderson]

George Anderson

[CO54]

Can we have some more info?  

[wagoneer]

A lot of questions are answered by searching google with "topic  site:p15-d24.com" and that gives you quick answers.

 

 

https://butchscoolstuff.com/42-53-plymouth-41-53-dodge-frame-mounted-brake-pedal-kit-2475bc/

 

 From:  https://p15-d24.com/topic/46688-found-source-for-bolt-in-dual-master-cylinder/ 

 

https://www.ecihotrodbrakes.com/chrysler_master_assemblies.html

 

 

[Rocket-bob]

Maybe I'm late to the fight, but I went Toyota.  Same bolt pattern, straight hook up. Toyota part number is NM55022.

 

https://www.autozone.com/brakes-and-traction-control/master-cylinder-brake-system/p/duralast-new-master-cylinder-brake-system-nm55022/486326_0_0

[Veemoney]

Bob,

Do you have it hooked up and working yet. I see it has a 1" bore as opposed to the 1.25" bore of my stock MC and wondering if you notice any difference due to the volume change. I would expect more pedal travel. Also uses 10m threaded line so if you have part numbers for the adapters you used those would be helpful.

Thanks 

[Rocket-bob]

4 hours ago, Veemoney said:

Bob,

Do you have it hooked up and working yet. I see it has a 1" bore as opposed to the 1.25" bore of my stock MC and wondering if you notice any difference due to the volume change. I would expect more pedal travel. Also uses 10m threaded line so if you have part numbers for the adapters you used those would be helpful.

Thanks 

 

 

The 1" bore gives it a bit more pressure, which I like.  I shortened the push rod by an inch or inch and a half if I remember.  I used 3/16" copper nickel brake line because it's easy to work with.  10mm bubble flare are easy to find on Amazon, Ebay, or local shops (3/16 brake line = 4.7mm brake line) for example https://www.ebay.com/itm/202073979625?chn=ps&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1iy2mAIpMQbizGEeedma0bg27&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=202073979625&targetid=1262906534562&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9014850&poi=&campaignid=12873833206&mkgroupid=123950846602&rlsatarget=pla-1262906534562&abcId=9300536&merchantid=8027054&gclid=Cj0KCQjwl_SHBhCQARIsAFIFRVWu43i-kpAjmiDDnseHaLqX8HUrMHuMcd8ME5mGrTVPUdk4E5rHoNIaAmLcEALw_wcB. Adapters for the 10mm to 1/8"-27 NPT are equally easy to find.  I guess 4AN is a thing now too.

 

I'm running stock brakes up front and I have a 90 Cherokee rear axle with stock brakes.  I run to a CCP proportioning valve with 10 lbs residual valves on both front and rear.  I can't remember the part numbers, I just called CCP and told them what I wanted and they went from there.   

 

I'm not sure I needed the proportioning valve as both systems are drum but it wasn't that expensive.  I clearly didn't Frankenstein this up on my own.  I had a Toyota Master cylinder hanging around on my shop self from my daughter's car and noticed the similarities to my Dodge MC. I search it on here figuring someone else had tried it.  Indeed they had.

[Veemoney]

Sounds like it is working well and your happy with it. Thanks for adding the details. ?

I started looking into going the dual MC change recently when mine started leaking but decided to just rebuild my original one with the wheel cylinders last week and I am up and running again but still considering the change.  

[lostviking]

On 7/25/2021 at 2:24 PM, Rocket-bob said:

 

 

The 1" bore gives it a bit more pressure, which I like.  I shortened the push rod by an inch or inch and a half if I remember.  I used 3/16" copper nickel brake line because it's easy to work with.  10mm bubble flare are easy to find on Amazon, Ebay, or local shops (3/16 brake line = 4.7mm brake line) for example https://www.ebay.com/itm/202073979625?chn=ps&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1iy2mAIpMQbizGEeedma0bg27&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=202073979625&targetid=1262906534562&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9014850&poi=&campaignid=12873833206&mkgroupid=123950846602&rlsatarget=pla-1262906534562&abcId=9300536&merchantid=8027054&gclid=Cj0KCQjwl_SHBhCQARIsAFIFRVWu43i-kpAjmiDDnseHaLqX8HUrMHuMcd8ME5mGrTVPUdk4E5rHoNIaAmLcEALw_wcB. Adapters for the 10mm to 1/8"-27 NPT are equally easy to find.  I guess 4AN is a thing now too.

 

I'm running stock brakes up front and I have a 90 Cherokee rear axle with stock brakes.  I run to a CCP proportioning valve with 10 lbs residual valves on both front and rear.  I can't remember the part numbers, I just called CCP and told them what I wanted and they went from there.   

 

I'm not sure I needed the proportioning valve as both systems are drum but it wasn't that expensive.  I clearly didn't Frankenstein this up on my own.  I had a Toyota Master cylinder hanging around on my shop self from my daughter's car and noticed the similarities to my Dodge MC. I search it on here figuring someone else had tried it.  Indeed they had.

Hi, so the only change required for you was to trim the push rod? Did you have to drill out the third hole? Mine is a 46 and I'm going to use a Jeep rear and disk conversion on the front. I'll give CCP a call.

 

Thank you for posting this information.

 

Tim

[Rocket-bob]

As I remember, the three holes lined up pretty well.  I had to elongate the holes a bit, but it wasn't major surgery.

[lostviking]

Rocket-bob, which size brake line did you use, and what fittings at the master cylinder? The ones that were on my truck looked more like fuel lines than any brake lines I've ever seen.

 

Tim

[Rocket-bob]

3/16 nicop line, with SAE flares.  I replaced all hard brake lines as I replaced the rear axle with a ‘90 Cherokee rear axle (8.25 Chrysler). I simply used adapters to hook into the stock (but new) flexible brake lines. Hydraulics don’t care about line size just about whether those lines are full of fluid. 

[lostviking]

1 hour ago, Rocket-bob said:

3/16 nicop line, with SAE flares.  I replaced all hard brake lines as I replaced the rear axle with a ‘90 Cherokee rear axle (8.25 Chrysler). I simply used adapters to hook into the stock (but new) flexible brake lines. Hydraulics don’t care about line size just about whether those lines are full of fluid. 

Thanks, do you know the size of the fitting that screwed into the master cylinder? I'm not sure what Toyotomo uses.

[Tooljunkie]

On 7/25/2021 at 11:14 AM, Veemoney said:

Bob,

Do you have it hooked up and working yet. I see it has a 1" bore as opposed to the 1.25" bore of my stock MC and wondering if you notice any difference due to the volume change. I would expect more pedal travel. Also uses 10m threaded line so if you have part numbers for the adapters you used those would be helpful.

Thanks 

Stock bore 1.25” on one piston. 
dual master 1” on two pistons(theoretically) more fluid is displaced with the dual port master cylinder.
 

Im presently using 15/16 dual with vacuum booster from a pt cruiser. Im happy with the brakes. 

[Rocket-bob]

17 hours ago, lostviking said:

Thanks, do you know the size of the fitting that screwed into the master cylinder? I'm not sure what Toyotomo uses.

3/16 SAE (standard double flare).

[lostviking]

Ordered two M10x1 to 3AN fittings to go into the master cylinder. I've also got the 3/16 NiCop line and fittings coming. Thanks for sharing.

Edited September 13, 2021 by lostviking

[ggdad1951]

On 9/11/2021 at 1:54 PM, lostviking said:

Ordered two M10x1 to 3AN fittings to go into the master cylinder. I've also got the 2/16 NiCop line and fittings coming. Thanks for sharing.

 3/16"? 

[lostviking]

Yes, corrected.

 

[Young Ed]

Ok am I missing something? Earlier in the thread we're using metric to sae adapters and then later it sounds like 3/16 fits. 

[lostviking]

19 hours ago, Young Ed said:

Ok am I missing something? Earlier in the thread we're using metric to sae adapters and then later it sounds like 3/16 fits. 

3/16 tube. The master cylinder has M10x1 fittings on it. That's the only metric. I fixed that with an adapter to 3/8-24 female double flair fittings...and like the OP, I'm using 3/16 Nicop brake line.

Edited September 17, 2021 by lostviking

[lostviking]

Asked the wrong question. Got it figured out.

Edited December 12, 2021 by lostviking

[Matt Wilson]

On 7/25/2021 at 9:23 AM, Rocket-bob said:

Maybe I'm late to the fight, but I went Toyota.  Same bolt pattern, straight hook up. Toyota part number is NM55022.

 

https://www.autozone.com/brakes-and-traction-control/master-cylinder-brake-system/p/duralast-new-master-cylinder-brake-system-nm55022/486326_0_0

Bob, do you happen to have the dimensions for this 3-bolt pattern (i.e., bolt spacing)?  I looked at using a Toyota 3-bolt master cylinder for my '49 Power Wagon, which has a 3-bolt pattern, but I was concerned about the 1" cylinder bore diameter (Power Wagon stock is 1-1/4"), so I passed on that idea.  Reading this discussion, though, I'm thinking it might work after all.  The only other master cylinder that looked like it would work and fit in the tight space between my frame and steering box was a Wilwood master cylinder with 1-1/8" bore diameter and 2-bolt pattern, so I bought it and I made an adapter to fit my existing Power Wagon 3-bolt mount.  I think it would probably work fine (I haven't installed it yet), but I'm concerned that it wouldn't go over well with police and insurance if I ever get into an accident and they notice I have this M/C on my truck, since Wilwood says it's not for street use.  If the Toyota part would work and fit, then it should be more legally defensible, I would think.

[Tooljunkie]

Remember, old mc was pushing fluid from one port, divided into 4 wheel cylinders. Dual mc’s move double the amount of fluid. 

[Matt Wilson]

4 hours ago, Tooljunkie said:

Remember, old mc was pushing fluid from one port, divided into 4 wheel cylinders. Dual mc’s move double the amount of fluid. 

Right, yes, I think I was thinking about it incorrectly until you pointed this out in your earlier post (thanks for that, by the way).  Now I just need to know if there is a 3-bolt master cylinder that will fit my Power Wagon, such as the Toyota master cylinder.  I suppose I could just go buy one and see if it will fit, and if not, then I could return it, but if someone has those dimensions handy, then that would save me that little bit of trouble.

Edited December 27, 2021 by Matt Wilson

[bkahler]

26 minutes ago, Matt Wilson said:

Right, yes, I think I was thinking about it incorrectly until you pointed this out in your earlier post (thanks for that, by the way).  Now I just need to know if there is a 3-bolt master cylinder that will fit my Power Wagon, such as the Toyota master cylinder.  I suppose I could just go buy one and see if it will fit, and if not, then I could return it, but if someone has those dimensions handy, then that would save me that little bit of trouble.

 

I think the circle has a 1-1/4" radius.  I have the pattern in a stack of papers at home.  If I remember I can try and find it this evening.  

 

[Matt Wilson]

38 minutes ago, bkahler said:

 

I think the circle has a 1-1/4" radius.  I have the pattern in a stack of papers at home.  If I remember I can try and find it this evening.  

 

Thanks, if you have it, that would be much appreciated.