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Frame damage


mburtis

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So the further I get into my 49 plymouth the more I realize I should have bought a different car. Any how, I started pulling the front fenders off as I prepare to start fabricating an entirely new floor. Looking at it tonight I realized that it has taken a significant hit to the front drivers corner. The bumper bracket is bent and the frame horn in front of the crossmember is buckled. This in itself isn't that big of deal other than I will have to customize some to get the bumper to look right. However if it hit this hard I'm really wondering if the frame is going to be twisted or way out of sqaure. Anybody want to wager a guess on if this frame will be salvageable.

Guess I'll pull the body so I can actually inspect the whole thing. Building this as a driver so I don't want to deal with weird handling issues or alignment issues or stuff like that. If it was a show car who cares if it drives terribly or eats tires, but I want to drive it to work and on trips. 

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Is the sway/stabilizer bar that is attached to the bracket also bent? Cannot tell from the pictures

Maybe you can find a parts car with a good frame or just a frame and go from there. It would be a lot less time consuming/labor intensive going that route.

It would also offer you any other parts that you may need

Good luck

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It could just be the part in front of the crossmember.  Take some measurements to check it.   set it on a level floor and use a plumb bob or carpenter's square to transfer key points on the frame to the floor where they can be measure diagonally to determine if it is bent.   If not the front horn can be straightened. 

 

Or take it to a body shop with a frame machine.  They can quickly take the measurements and even do the pulls needed to correct it.  

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My plan is to get it set up so I can take serious measurements and see if it's twisted or out of sqaure or if it's just the front frame horn. Any input on what points are the most important to measure between and what the limits would be. I realize these frames were probably not dead straight from the factory but how far off can they be before it starts having an adverse affect on alignment, handling etc. 

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When I crashed my p15 the frame horns looked worse than that. Frame shop got them straightened right back for a couple hundred

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12 hours ago, mburtis said:

So the further I get into my 49 plymouth the more I realize I should have bought a different car.

Welcome to my world.

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5 minutes ago, knuckleharley said:

Welcome to my world.

Welcome to OUR world, lol.

 

The service manual usually has dimensions in the frame section you can use to determine issues.  Out of one my manual as an example.  If you tell us EXACTLY what you have I can probably get the prints for it.  Coupe, sedan, convertible, etc, they differ some.

 

 

frame 1.JPG

frame2.JPG

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11 hours ago, mburtis said:

 I realize these frames were probably not dead straight from the factory but how far off can they be before it starts having an adverse affect on alignment, handling etc.  

you would be quite surprised at the manner these frames did conform to dimensions...I have been able to do all my checks per the book for tolerance....and using the book for the later model donor clip when cutting and joining frames and have no issues squaring up the now hybrid frame.  The data Sniper posted will get you on track....the tolerances are listed...the only other frame pic is not shown and is the diagonal measurement from X guage hole to X guage hole and these are limited to +/- 1/4 inch.....tolerance are shown on the above pics.

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10 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

the only other frame pic is not shown and is the diagonal measurement from X guage hole to X guage hole and these are limited to +/- 1/4 inch

 

Forgot that one,  here it is.  Read the text too.

 

 

Frame3.JPG

Edited by Sniper
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Plymouthy Adams is right. These frame are jig welded and precise. There aren't many movie documentation on frame production but watch this movie from 1936 fast forward to 19:17 see how mechanical robots made frames. Imagine what Chrysler could in 1949.

 

 

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Thanks for the information. I have a book but it's down at my dad's shop with my motor. I'll have to go get it. It's a 49 plymouth 4 door. Based on some rough measurements I took last night I'm highly skeptical it will make that 1/4 inch tolerance. 

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I'm not worried about the front frame horn if that's all the more extensive it is. To me it looks like they clipped something with the front drivers corner hard enough to buckle that front horn. If it's just the front frame horn I will rebuild the bumper bracket to make it sit right and leave it. What I'm worried about is that the drivers frame rail is going to be shoved back pushing the frame out of sqaure or it will be twisted. When I was trying to block it all up level it seemed like I was seeing a little bit of twist but that was before I noticed the damage so I wasn't looking that close. Just don't want goofy alignment/handling issues 

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7 hours ago, greg g said:

That used to be what the Porta power was for.  Maybe followed up with som judicious application of the 12 pound sledge.

And a little heat from your torch to soften it up a bit.

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