1940 Plymouth tail-light question

[MackTheFinger]

I was looking through my junk and saw something I hadn't noticed on the driver's side tail-light on a 1940 Plymouth. What's the purpose of the clear lens protruding from the tail-light? Only thing I could think of was a backup light.

Edited April 26, 2021 by MackTheFinger

[sidevalvepete]

Is a reflector. This lens is for the drivers side. Doesn't have the reflector on the right side. Not sure of the reason though.

[Veemoney]

I have this on my 41 lens and always thought the added protrusion was to help make it more visible for those approaching from the rear side since the overall lens profile is low. Also helps to see the car when pulling out from a series of parked cars at night. Just my assumptions ?

 

 

[MackTheFinger]

That all makes sense. I just never noticed it before and had no idea what it was for.

[chrysler1941]

The protruding lens is supposed to be red. ?

Edited April 26, 2021 by chrysler1941

[MackTheFinger]

19 minutes ago, chrysler1941 said:

The protruding lens is supposed to be red. ?

This one's clear glass but maybe it bleached out over the years. It has what looks like some little bullseye chips in it. I'm surprised I'd never noticed it before. 

[Plymouthy Adams]

protruding lens is clear...and only on the side of the vehicle as parked WITH traffic as per law back then and still in many areas. lt  is  designed to gather light from approaching car from rear and illuminate the lens as a reflector.  The other side of the car is both sold factory without a protruding matching globe and with a red globe based on when and where you aftermarket.  If you have red lenses on both sides. one is right the other is wrong...if you have two clear lens globes, one is right the other is wrong.   show your car for points at an official meet...this is the ruling....

 

L. Lighting Only the left hand tail lamp lens on the Deluxe P10 model had the “reflector knob” on it. All P9 tail lamp lens and the right P10 tail lamp lens were plain.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Just now, Plymouthy Adams said:

protruding lens is clear per all factory I have seen....repeat that I have seen...the parts book however only denotes left part number, right part number......and only on the side of the vehicle as parked WITH traffic as per law back then and still in many areas. lt  is  designed to gather light from approaching car from rear and illuminate the lens as a reflector.  The other side of the car is both sold factory without a protruding matching globe and with a red globe based on when and where you aftermarket.  If you have red lenses on both sides. one is right the other is wrong...if you have two clear lens globes, one is right the other is wrong.   show your car for points at an official meet...this is the ruling....

 

L. Lighting Only the left hand tail lamp lens on the Deluxe P10 model had the “reflector knob” on it. All P9 tail lamp lens and the right P10 tail lamp lens were plain.

 

[Skrambler]

Yup, it is a safety reflector. Also, they did not put a lock-set on the outside of the drivers door. This way, no one would be fumbling around for a key while in the path of traffic! And, you can NEVER lock yourself out of the car!!!

[chrysler1941]

So Chrysler had two reds and Plymouth one white ? ? I don't understand

[Skrambler]

Not certain as to why the bulb part, that was originally on the drivers rear side looks white in that photo. It has to be a fault in the glass lens. It is super "rare" I do not like to use that word, but, to find a true NOS tail light lens. When found you can see that there is actually a grey, mirror like reflective silvering material behind the lens and the bulb.  I am sure that it did to some degree reflect light back to an oncoming car. That being said there was no reason to install one on the passenger side.

[Dan Hiebert]

When your car was new, there were not many National automobile safety standards, if any at all.  That was left up to the States.  The vast majority of States only required one taillight, and even then it didn't even have to be on the driver's side in some States, there just had to be at least one (NM was center, or street (driver's) side).  At some point in time, some of the States required a reflector as well, again, just one initially.  Maine still only requires one rear reflector.  The passenger side taillight was usually an option for the safety conscious owner, so it often wouldn't have any bells or whistles.  The automobile manufacturers were primarily the ones that pushed for Federal, or at least interstate, standardization, so they could "save" money by theoretically not having to build 48 different car configurations.  

[Plymouthy Adams]

@chrysler1941on your 41 Chrysler, a question....is the small lens you referring to a glass globe and cast as part of the larger lens or are you referring to the small inset round dot lens that is recessed into the housing above the lens.  My two 1941 Dodge D19's have neither a globe or a a recessed glass dot built into the housing.  There was no rhyme or reason sometimes for particular appointments and what was done to one model did not extend to all across the board.   Another thing we must all consider with these old cars, previous owner, aftermarket parts...unless you have owned this car from day one...originality is up for grabs....

 

IF you referring to the dot recessed into the casting...left and right is red.....even when later the use of the Stimsonite style lens in the housing one year the Plymouth (P15) were actually clear then went red till end of the built in reflector.

 

Little joking here but a layman's car such as the Plymouth might be found parked on any dark street thus a distinct need for the added reflector..the Chrysler on the other hand will be garaged and or valet/desiginated parking.....lol

Edited April 27, 2021 by Plymouthy Adams

[chrysler1941]

1 hour ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

Chrysler on the other hand will be garaged and or valet/desiginated parking

LOL that may be ?

My tail lights where used up till 1948 They all had a separate reflex in chrome molding. I don't have any close ups of mine but here is a similar from a gorgeous Barrel back.

 

I found part number for reflex. 854791. Two where used.

 Interestingly, the Master part list show something looks like one piece with 4 reflexes. Was the idea you would break them of yourself? Strange

[Plymouthy Adams]

having never seen these in group of four as pictured.....and use as required I would view this as a means to service these per the book AS NEEDED to indicate these may be 'carded' and removed and used individually.  Unless these were poorly designed pop in an style and subject to loss or theft....being glass I would suspect very few were sold....

[MackTheFinger]

10 hours ago, Skrambler said:

bulb part, that was originally on the drivers rear side looks white

It's actually clear glass with what I assumed were round bullseye chips on the inside, although I also thought they may have been something left by insects or some other unidentified substance. The weird part is that I've had that car a decade or longer and only noticed the diiference in the lenses recently.

[chrysler1941]

If you look at same photo, Tail Lamp Lens Retainer is empty. Could they be plastic?

[Plymouthy Adams]

I saw that...in reading it says you need a retainer and a nut for each reflector....retainer shown, no IPB number as also no nut number so again, without the footnote for the star in the part box....I would think but again, just my thinking, it is serviced NHA  (next higher assembly) which is the reflector set of 4....... 854791

[chrysler1941]

Here is the complete page. 1936-42

Red square is where 1941 C28 Royal starts and continues with Windsor, New Yorker and so on. 42 Is the same

 

The yellowish screen dump above is for only 1941 models

Pages from Unødvendigt Fjernet.pdf

[Plymouthy Adams]

ah the big picture.....that helps...see the individual number now...

[Veemoney]

These came with my 41 Plymouth. Both have that white look when dry but turn clear when they get wet. They appear to be amber on the sides and the globe and the rest is red. No sign of a reflector but it has peaked my interest. Lit them up with a flashlight after I gave them a wash.

[MackTheFinger]

4 hours ago, Veemoney said:

Lit them up with a flashlight

The concept as explained by PA-- designed to gather light from approaching car from rear and illuminate the lens as a reflector--seems optimistic and it's certainly not intuitive but it makes more sense than anything else, with the caveat that even fully illuminated the tail-light isn't likely to blind anyone.

[Veemoney]

Yes I agree with PA's explanation. Just had these out and noticed when I cleaned them that they have both red and amber in the design along with the clear globe.